Dean Smith

[TRO]

45 minutes ago, Johnnyp said:

I think it's sad that your gauge of progress is so black and white and your level of expectation for a team of villa players who are continually called one of the best sides in the championship ( even though you , me and the dog in the street know hand on heart that's an absolute myth ) is ridiculous. We've did more right things tonight than we have in a long while . 

Firstly, its quite popular on here to assume we have one of the best squads in the championship, irrespective of what i think....you seem to be challenging that claim.

my expectation is not high, because i think the games both under Bruce this season and now Dean have shown not to be sufficient to make a challenge and conversely find ourselves closer to the relegation zone.

Dean Smith has much work to do......and so far 3 games, there hasn't been enough time in my opinion to make sufficient improvement to turn it in to results.

There is such a thing called manager bounce, many teams experience it, ours has been mixed, so far.

your last line is encouraging for you, i wished i could share it, i would be lying if i said i could.

Edited October 26, 2018 by TRO

[TRO]

17 minutes ago, terrytini said:

Whether you saw any improvement or not is up to you. I said earlier as regards that, we must be watching different games. But that’s opinions.

Whether people would prefer improvements or Points is also opinions. Again, I think one brings the other.

I think we’ve played more football in three games than in two years under Bruce. But again, that's opinions.

But you have gone much much further than that. And it’s that which I’ve commented on as being laughable.

You have said - in multiple Posts - that we CANT have improved, because we didn’t Win.

That remains both laughable and incredibly simplistic.

Im not at all sure what I’ve said that you think anyone would find funny.

Significantly......I'm talking about improving significantly to acheive the holy grail.....points.

if you can see improvement, who am I to say there isn't any.......I am just saying i haven't seen much to get me excited, but that now sounds like i was expecting to in a few days and I wasn't.

He has had 3 games in a week, no time to secure significant improvement Imo

for those that can see improvement already,fine.....i am pleased for them.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Didn't take long for people to turn on each other hey?

Ive seen and ignored a couple posters in the past saying we need to temper our expectations, and it's true.

Ive accepted there is no quick fix and whilst being frustrated, I'm fully behind the plan and new regime.

I can actually see what we are trying to do, even if we are currently failing at it, I can see that the margins are getting finer.

It will take at least a couple of transfer windows to sort this out.

Our window for the quick bounce back promotion has past I feel, and its because of how terribly run we have been for years.

Its taken me a couple of years to accept it, but I finally have.

Looking forward to the journey, im convinced we'll be fine, however, it might not be this season unfortunately.

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Mantis]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Yeah.....it was reflective in the result.

This is very strange logic. It's almost as if you're saying that a team can't play well and lose.

[tonyh29]

We did enough to win today , Abraham scuffed a few , maybe took a touch too many on a few and Kodjia missing that header when Jack put it on a plate for him  , fine margins and all that

i still don’t think Smith has any balance in the team in regards to midfield and the players aren’t comfortable with what he is asking them to do , qpr closed our back 4 down and they were prone to panic , Axel for the second game running was the only defender to emerge with any credit 

hes still trying to find his best team there’s no need to panic yet , we’ll win a few and lose a few and then in Jan we can hopefully strengthen , we know this is along term project , let’s not got hung up on 3 games 

[OutByEaster?]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Show me the fan that appreciates the improvement of their team, but they don't win.

 That'd be me. 

Because, I think that teams that play good football to a structured, practised method designed to control games and open up defences will win more in the long term, and because I think improvement makes winning more likely - even if it doesn't mean always winning.

We've a long way to go to make that improvement meaningful, but I think the intent is visible and that there's a pattern beginning to emerge. I appreciate the small improvements we're making in our play, I'll also appreciate further small improvements in our play, even if they come in defeats, because in the end common sense says that if you keep improving, eventually you win more games.

 

[srsmithusa]

How you can trust that one manager is good when we play rudderless, lost, and baffling strategy, but then not be convinced of another manager under whom we play a coherent, organized, and in many ways dominating, is baffling to me

Especially when you were assuring us the first would come good, even when we were losing.  And if he was winning we wouldn’t be in this league 

To an observer, it appears your joy is not from style, neither is it from winning, because you were happy to support a manager when we were not winning. 

[srsmithusa]

FWIW.  I see “shoots of recovery” and want more.  But considering the VERY little time the new management has had, more is pretty unrealistic.  

[macandally]

3 hours ago, hippo said:

I doubt he will be here two years if it doesn't work.

That level of impatience is the reason we are in the crap we are.  A team passed from pillar to post for nearly ten years, we finally get a decent structure to build from in place and people bleating after three games!

Beggars belief it really does

[macandally]

3 hours ago, TRO said:

I stuck with him because, i thought 24 wins in a season was worth sticking with to see if we could improve on it.....i guess the summer scuppered that.....and in the end a change was needed.

in the game against Preston, we was in total control of the first half and scored 2 good goals, should have scored more.....the second half, that is what we was expecting, such was the control of the game.....we all know what happened.

I do want to see a difference, but i guess i am looking at different things to you.

We lost tonight and it was predictable, our play was predictable, we was once again too easily closed down....if you are closed down as much, creativity is unlikely.

i can't understand how you can't see this.

you can quote stats until the cows come home......there is only 2 stats that matter.

goals for and goals against.....and right now we are not good at either.

We were truly going nowhere under Bruce, even if we had pulled enough rabbits out of hats to go up we would have been blitzed in the premier league.  The game has changed beyond all recognition, it’s not who is in your team it is getting them to turn up every week and put in a shift.  Bruce’s never built a team in his whole time here, he was distracted by a name rather than what was needed and we were constantly unbalanced.  The summer comment is pure rubbish, look at where he spent what he had.

We are finally as a club on the right track, I appreciate some are too ingrained in the past too see that and some won’t have patience but we finally seem to have a proper plan that is hopefully sustainable.  It seems most recognise and support that despite the short term hiccups!

Edited October 27, 2018 by macandally

[DCJonah]

7 hours ago, TRO said:

I stuck with him because, i thought 24 wins in a season was worth sticking with to see if we could improve on it.....i guess the summer scuppered that.....and in the end a change was needed.

in the game against Preston, we was in total control of the first half and scored 2 good goals, should have scored more.....the second half, that is what we was expecting, such was the control of the game.....we all know what happened.

I do want to see a difference, but i guess i am looking at different things to you.

We lost tonight and it was predictable, our play was predictable, we was once again too easily closed down....if you are closed down as much, creativity is unlikely.

i can't understand how you can't see this.

you can quote stats until the cows come home......there is only 2 stats that matter.

goals for and goals against.....and right now we are not good at either.

If those are the only ones that matter to you right now, then don't bother joining a debate about improvements in play. Like i said, i think you don't see it because you choose not to.

[Farlz]

It’s a work in progress. Clear improvements are already being made, results haven’t gone our way but I’m pleased with the performances. In a few months when this all clicks we are going to be incredible to watch. 

Big issue we have right now is we aren’t clinical enough at all and it’s cost us this week. 

[TRO]

4 hours ago, macandally said:

We were truly going nowhere under Bruce, even if we had pulled enough rabbits out of hats to go up we would have been blitzed in the premier league.  The game has changed beyond all recognition, it’s not who is in your team it is getting them to turn up every week and put in a shift.  Bruce’s never built a team in his whole time here, he was distracted by a name rather than what was needed and we were constantly unbalanced.  The summer comment is pure rubbish, look at where he spent what he had.

We are finally as a club on the right track, I appreciate some are too ingrained in the past too see that and some won’t have patience but we finally seem to have a proper plan that is hopefully sustainable.  It seems most recognise and support that despite the short term hiccups!

Steve Bruce has gone that chapter is closed.....but I accept your points....I agree.

last nights game....I saw QPR close us down to the point that our play came to very little, I accept some seen a change in it......We have been easily closed down for some time now, in most of our games and it inhibits us from doing damage.

our flank play comes to nothing, no one can beat a man and disrupt the opposition, hence very little service.....The middle 2 get negated easily, despite their efforts......Long ball down the middle has undone us in the past....its not expansive football undoing us, its basic stuff.

I am not commenting on what might be.....I am commenting on what I see now.

If you read my earlier posts I am in support of Dean Smith and what his intentions are.

[TRO]

28 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

If those are the only ones that matter to you right now, then don't bother joining a debate about improvements in play. Like i said, i think you don't see it because you choose not to.

i Don't choose not to.....I might be a few things, but I am honest in my opinion.

No......I will rejoin the debate, when I see the sort of improvements that I am looking for.....in the meantime, just get on with it.

Edited October 27, 2018 by TRO

[TRO]

8 hours ago, DCJonah said:

I can see why you stuck with bruce for so long. 

Here is a clue. 

Against preston in Bruce's last game, we attempted  391 passes and completed 78% of them. We had 3 players who attempted 40+ passes. 

Tonight we attempted 540 passes and completed 85% of them. We had 6 players who attempted 40 + passes. Our back 4 each attempted 60 + passes. 

How you can't see a difference is way beyond me. I suspect its because you don't want to see a difference. 

firstly, the contrast in the Preston game between the first and second half is Stark.

secondly, if we are passing in our own half or where we are in low danger to the opposition, your stats become cosmetic.

I am all for the football that you crave.....I am on board.

I like Dean Smith, I like the style he developed at Brentford, I like the players he bought and developed.

I have been talking about the last 2 defeats....no goals scored and easily closed down .....Its still Bruces team imo.

Edited October 27, 2018 by TRO

[TRO]

6 hours ago, Mantis said:

This is very strange logic. It's almost as if you're saying that a team can't play well and lose.

If you are asking me if I want a winning team first, in my criteria.

I would be a liar if I said different.

I don't see where we are going if we are not winning....simplistic as it may be, its what the end game is.

Steve Bruce lost his job, because we were not winning enough games and languishing in the bottom half of the table.

go and tell the Man City and Liverpool fans that winning doesn't matter the style is great.

[Lerner's Driver]

17 minutes ago, TRO said:

firstly, the contrast in the Preston game between the first and second half is Stark.

secondly, if we are passing in our own half or where we are in low danger to the opposition, your stats become cosmetic.

I am all for the football that you crave.....I am on board.

I like Dean Smith, I like the style he developed at Brentford, I like the players he bought and developed.

I have been talking about the last 2 defeats....no goals scored and easily closed down .....Its still Bruces team imo.

Agree. Hope it comes right, I really do, but the risk is there for all to see... change managers and systems mid season and there will be defeats.

To be clear, this does not represent support for Bruce, he had to go, but lose too many and it won't matter how pretty we are because the confidence will be shot and the losing will become automatic.

'Some good progress' has to rapidly morph into consistently winning sooner rather than later.

[eholm]

10 hours ago, hippo said:

I just asking our new coach who is highly rated on here - to get us half way in the championship  - surely that should be a given if we are doing the the right way ? 

Yes but it sounds as though you have written off his chances of even achieving that after only a few training sessions with the squad. I appreciate that you’re not DS biggest proponent and therefore you will see games through those slightly negative spectacles whereas I would see a more positive progression through my mine. However, I feel it’s a bit harsh to suggest that DS won’t even get us to mid table after 3 games in charge and still over 30 games remaining. 

[Demitri_C]

8 hours ago, Zatman said:

its how you judge it, we have put the ball on the ground and tried to play. Hell of a lot more positive than Bruce

people forget Bruce won one of his last 10 games

Yes I agree with the playing the ball on the floor. But so many of our players are struggling with this. It will take time but I am glad the hoofball has been dropped. We seem to being playing the ball through the middle alot and have no width at time. Under bruce we did try get the ball forward in the wings more but yesterday we badly struggled with that.

[Demitri_C]

8 hours ago, terrytini said:

That’s not a fact, let alone facts plural. “ done no better”......by what yardstick ? What are you comparing to ?

The thing that matters "points total"