Dean Smith

[Vive_La_Villa]

I want Smith to succeed it just kind of feels he is self imploding. Next 3 games are massive for him and us. Really don’t want to be getting dragged in to a relegation scrap.

[foreveryoung]

For me, at the beginning of the game, the team didn't look happy. You had Watkin's give away a foul and get a yellow in the first minute, then you had Mings having a fit and looking moody (more than usual), then I noticed Martinez was not his usual cool self. Could it be the coaches have upset some of the team continuing to play this formation. I can imagine after the Wolves game, players getting a bo***** and some speaking up. 

Looking at Ranieri's relationship with Shakespere when he was at Leicester, it seemed a bit frosty towards the end, sacking Ranieri and giving Shakespere the coaches role. Knowing Ranieri was the brains behind the Prem league win, Leicester actually tried to get Ranieri back as manager, allowing him to bring in new coaches, but obviously he refused.

Just a worry for me, if I'm fair to Smith, that it all seems to be going a little tits up with Dank's and Shakespere as assistants, or is it really O'Kelly and Terry were the brains behind the continued success. Maybe Terry felt he couldn't work without O'Kelly/Shakespere and visa versa. It's known, Thomas Franks was really the brains behind Brentford, an I think he has proved it, getting them promoted while continuing in selling there best players.

[Harry]

I have always been a supporter of Smith but last night was a turning point for me. We were abysmal and I know the players have to shoulder responsibility the ultimate responsibility sits with the manager. 

• He gets completely outsmarted by Arteta tactically??? The fact that he did not change the formation, when it was obvious ten minutes into the game that it was not working, was negligent.
• We made Arsenal look like Barca at their very best. They are a good side but on our day we are just as good. We were clinging on from kick off. See above on tactics and formation.
• MIngs should be benched. He is our worst centre back. His lapses in concentration and regular errors are costing us. I doubt Smith has the balls to do that.
• Watkins should be benched. So out of form its unreal yet I guess he is the first name after Mings and Martinez on the team sheet. I doubt Smith has the balls to do that.
• Paying 5-3-2 should be an option not requirement. Cash and Targett as the main wide attacking threat - really? The three centre backs do not provide proper defensive cover - a stronger midfield would be a much better option. Up front Ings and Watkins hinder each other and get next to no service.
• The most worrying aspect for me is the mental fragility of the players. I got the impression last night that they never believed from the get go that they could win that game. It's ironical given we beat Man U at Old Trafford. At best it was a hangover from the implosion in the last ten minutes of the Wolves game. At worst it's a sign of a much more deep seated problem. Confidence is instilled by the manager and his team. As of right now I see a side with zero self belief and I don't see any leaders on the pitch either

We have now lost three on the bounce and shipped 8 goals. They always say every football club is six games off a crisis, well we are 50% of the way there. I don't think the owners and Purslow will will show any sentimentality if they have to make that tough decision. So in a nutshell I think Smith has three games to save his job.

[KentVillan]

I am not going to defend Smith, because he’s making mistakes at the moment IMO. The only reasons to play 3-5-2 are to accommodate Ings & Watkins, and to add extra fire power on set pieces with the 3 CBs.

Besides Ings, every other player in the squad is much more experienced in and better suited to 4-3-3 / 4-1-4-1 etc. We can all see this, and weirdly he persists with it.

HOWEVER, Smith is not Remi Garde as someone else suggested. He has good history here. Season-on-season improvement over 3 years gives him the right to try and fix things. Unless there is an amazing manager available to us right now (I don’t think there is?) then what is the point?

He needs to improve, but people setting ultimatums about next couple of games are taking the piss. So shortsighted.

[Wurzel]

This doesn't sound good, obviously not a happy camp

He needs to get the squad in to sort things out ASAP.

[weedman]

2 minutes ago, Wurzel said:

This doesn't sound good, obviously not a happy camp

He needs to get the squad in to sort things out ASAP.

I hate the "no smoke without fire" expression. It gives people carte blanche to believe any tripe they read, I'd wager a lot of people that believe the vaccine is going to kill off the population in 2 years probably read it, thought "that's bs" then read it a few more times and figured "well, no smoke without fire, I'll pass on the vaccine, personal choice innit". 

It's 2021, the internet exists. There is a lot of smoke without fire 

[Zhan_Zhuang]

If that is true then there is unrest in the dressing room; Sanson has a right to be pi55ed watching our midfield last night.

To repeat others earlier in the thread the rumours are that Smith has two games, I thought they'd give him until Christmas but results are bad.

I like Smith and hoped he'd be a success here but now I feel the job is too much for him.

There are better managers out there...

[weedman]

Just now, Zhan_Zhuang said:

If that is true then there is unrest in the dressing room; Sanson has a right to be pi55ed watching our midfield last night.

To repeat others earlier in the thread the rumours are that Smith has two games, I thought they'd give him until Christmas but results are bad.

I like Smith and hoped he'd be a success here but now I feel the job is too much for him.

There are better managers out there...

We signed Sanson in January and he's not been able to put in 90 minutes for us yet. He has not got a "right to be pissed watching our midfield", he needs to be able to play 30 minutes without getting injured before demanding to be in the team. 

[Wurzel]

1 minute ago, weedman said:

I hate the "no smoke without fire" expression. It gives people carte blanche to believe any tripe they read, I'd wager a lot of people that believe the vaccine is going to kill off the population in 2 years probably read it, thought "that's bs" then read it a few more times and figured "well, no smoke without fire, I'll pass on the vaccine, personal choice innit". 

It's 2021, the internet exists. There is a lot of smoke without fire 

I agree, but there were two eye witnesses in that thread. Not saying it's a big thing, emotions are high in a defeat, but it needs sorting out. 

[bannedfromHandV]

We were so abject in the first half last night I’m genuinely wondering if it was an on-pitch revolt.

Perhaps the players don’t want to play 3 at the back any longer, I just cannot see any other reason for being that bad. Second half we were okay and in the end unlucky not to have scored two.

Emotions are always high in the immediate aftermath of a bad result but it’s a long season and I don’t think people need to be fretting right now. Finishing in and around mid table was always going to be a decent outcome for us given we lost Grealish (and all he encompassed) and assuming we manage to bring through the likes of Ramsey, Chuk(s), Archer etc.

[weedman]

2 minutes ago, Wurzel said:

I agree, but there were two eye witnesses in that thread. Not saying it's a big thing, emotions are high in a defeat, but it needs sorting out. 

I can find eye witnesses that "saw" Trump votes being destroyed to rig the election. 

 

Edit. It may be true of course, and if it is then it does need sorting out (although I think there are frequently arguments after a defeat) but there's a huge chance its completely made up as most things online are. People seem to give more credence to Facebook/twitter comments rather than actual evidence these days which is why there are so many bots and trolls around 

Edited October 23, 2021 by weedman

[samjp26]

The bottle thing is true but I think Sanson threw it at Shakespeare not Deano. He has a right to not be happy, he’s not been given a chance and he actually looked really good on his last outing.

Can’t help but start to think about what a different manager could get from our squad. 

 

[Wurzel]

Another third party account, but sounds plausible

 

 

[weedman]

1 minute ago, samjp26 said:

The bottle thing is true but I think Sanson threw it at Shakespeare not Deano. He has a right to not be happy, he’s not been given a chance and he actually looked really good on his last outing.

Can’t help but start to think about what a different manager could get from our squad. 

 

What gives him the right? He's literally been injured pretty much since he joined. Last time he played for us he managed about 10 minutes before getting injured again, now he's throwing a wobbly because he was available for the first time in months and not picked straight away. Bore off 

[the_eristic]

Someone said the same about Sanson here either in the match thread or reaction thread right after the game. Didn't see it on camera, though, afaik.

[Peter Griffin]

6 hours ago, desensitized43 said:

Should have changed it way earlier than he did. Top managers wouldn’t have tried to limp on until half time at 1-0.

It would be rare for top managers to send out what was clearly the wrong team and system in the first place

[Peter Griffin]

2 hours ago, thabucks said:

Lucien Farve would be one of my choices to replace Smith if this poor form continues. 

He would be a tough one to attract. He refused Palace and the discourse in the media is that he does not want the Toon job

[Indigo]

Didn't catch the game last night so I accept that I don't have the emotional reaction everyone else probably rightly had to however abject things were in the first half especially, but have to say I've found some of the genuine revelling in Smith's perceived "failure" quite galling this morning. I know you find all manner of nonsense on social media but it's a weird response to your team losing.

For what it's worth I think we'll be fine, but in the sense we'll probably end up around mid-table-ish which is largely reflective of our squad outside of some notable exceptions. There's a chance those exceptions could carry us further should they catch form but that could be said for a number of teams given the talent spread across the league.

This is with the caveat that we ditch this experiment with the formation, I just don't get it. It made sense vs Chelsea in order to match them up and combat their strengths, but otherwise even when we've been playing well I feel as though it's been despite the shape and not because of it. There's key positions in that formation that certain players just aren't suited to and it kills all fluidity.

Still have a lot of love and appreciation for Deano, as well as plenty of patience left, but I really need to see some kind of reaction to these last few weeks.

[MaVilla]

17 minutes ago, Wurzel said:

This doesn't sound good, obviously not a happy camp

He needs to get the squad in to sort things out ASAP.

if anyone believes Sanson threw a bottle at Smith and gave him the finger while in the dugout, im not sure what to say to you, do you guys actually swallow this twatter s***?

[DCJonah]

If Sanson threw a bottle at a coach and stuck his middle finger at him, it would be all over SSN.