Israel, Palestine and Iran

[bickster]

2 minutes ago, Tumblerseven said:

Thank you for your answer. and i agree.

Thats a good faith engagement some people should learn from you.

It’s the same argument you’ve been arguing against with me. So either you’ve just changed your mind or….

[ml1dch]

6 minutes ago, bickster said:

McDs gave free food to IDF soldiers. Starbucks an Disney also in firing line apparently

Thanks. And that colourful mice thing was happening in the same nutty ecosystem?

I'm wondering if they've really thought through the public relations aspect of their message. As it doesn't seem like they've got the right strategy to rally the undecided to their cause.

Edited November 4, 2023 by ml1dch

[KentVillan]

9 minutes ago, Tumblerseven said:

Thank you for your answer. and i agree.

Thats a good faith engagement some people should learn from you.

No worries, but don’t you agree that it shows that most of the Palestinian population really don’t deserve what is happening to them right now?

And I say this as someone who thinks the attack on Israel was absolutely, utterly indefensible too.

Can’t we oppose atrocities against innocent civilians without saying one side deserves them more than the other? I feel like sometimes this whole debate is devoid of any humanity.

[sne]

1 hour ago, chrisp65 said:

Shouting again. How’s that working out for you?

Probably should have gone all caps to made sure the message got through.

[Keyblade]

3 hours ago, bickster said:

Christ not this again. It’s like a broken record. Correct, they aren't responsible.

I'm not responsible for the actions of my government and my government still has an electoral mandate which Hamas do not, it’s 17 years since they were elected and half of the population of Gaza didn’t even have the opportunity to vote for them, they have no mandate and the people have even less responsibility for their actions than I do for the governemnt in power in the UK.

Similarly an Israeli is not responsible for its governments actions.

You really need to accept that

I'd say over 70% of Gazans weren't able to vote. Over half of them weren't even alive. It's also ironic because Israel (which existed then and now) had a part to play in Hamas' rise to power too.

[Tumblerseven]

1 minute ago, KentVillan said:

No worries, but don’t you agree that it shows that most of the Palestinian population really don’t deserve what is happening to them right now?

And I say this as someone who thinks the attack on Israel was absolutely, utterly indefensible too.

Can’t we oppose atrocities against innocent civilians without saying one side deserves them more than the other? I feel like sometimes this whole debate is devoid of any humanity.

Yah i agree i dont think Palestinians deserve death or bombed hospitals or schools or bombs on safe passages. But we have to be realistic and not live in some fantasy land and expect that we can just talk everything into peace and expect 0 bombings and 0 casualties. This narrative that Israel is carpet bombing Gaza and purposefully trying to kill civilians is ridiculous yah they bombing alot if they would try to kill civilians we would not see 7000 dead we would see 30 000. WW2 carpet bombed multiple cities in days you would see 20 000 dead not in a month.

I think we have to be honest that this conflict is almost 100 years old and nothing is changing only Israels occupation in West bank. I think october 7 is a game changer after that i think its clear that something needs to be changing. Palestinians and Israelis cant live like this anymore.

We cant just open Gaza with Hamas in charge. We cant talk them into peace and surrender either. We cant implement two state solutions because the red lines from both sides.

So there needs to be Arab countries and US leadership to force some kind of deal to open Gaza. I think israel made some kind of statement that after Hamas destruction they want to open Gaza.

I think if US after Gaza war would come and force the deal and say to Israel to Egypt to Jordan to Iran and any other neighbor. Hamas is dead we now open Gaza. Israel have responsibility to help Palestinians in Gaza for few years with infrastructure water so they dont die. Israel destroys West Bank settlements. And then after few years we let Israel to fully disengage.

Condition is if there is a state sponsored terrorist act once from Palestine! Israel has the right to annex Gaza and neighboring Arab countries have a responsibility and promise to take Palestinian population whole population from Gaza however they want to themselves.  I think that would solve Gaza problem. And i think only Israel would accept. I think it would be a fair deal.

[maqroll]

5 hours ago, Rustibrooks said:

 

 

Things fall apart

[LondonLax]

18 hours ago, Tumblerseven said:

how many one israeli life worth to me? i dont count it like that.

I see a terrorist organization who needs to be destroyed i see 40 0000 terrorists who needs to be destroyed i would say for me 80 000 civilian casualties deaths would be acceptable or justified. 

Can you now answer the question? If number is zero and war always requires civilian deaths in your opinion what Israel had to do after October 7? nothing?

Just so we’re clear, you do realise don’t you that if you wiped out every single Hamas terrorist in Gaza, (all 40,000 of them to the last man, or whatever your numbers might be), the killing of thousands and thousands or innocent civilians would cause thousands of Gaza’s population to become new Hamas members in their search for justice. They will then likely go and get their revenge on Israel, Oct 7 style, at some point in the future. 

 

[HolteExile]

Maybe it's a play on that US maxim 'destroy the village to save the village.' 

Or perhaps it's just gibberish from some sort of Israeli/ far right bot. 

Remove most of the current leadership (if that is even possible with all their connections abroad) at the cost of thousands of Palestinian lives will ensure that whatever comes next is far far worse than Hamas. 

[TheAuthority]

6 hours ago, VILLAMARV said:

Of all the f***witted posts I've had to contend with over the years yours are without a doubt the most pathetic and disingenuous of the lot. Of course I don't want "to ask you a question or something"  . I've asked you plenty of direct questions and you've ignored them all! Hence your undeniable, on the record hypocrisy. I'm the word removed you have made personal accusations about in this thread. Including ones calling me a hypocrite. You have posted some of the most childish responses to any posts I have ever witnessed in my many years on this site. And yet here we are.Feel free to prove what you say by completely changing the personality and attitude that your posts project to the outside world, or, alternatively, just carry on acting and conversing like a spoilt child.

But your posts, just extreme merriment. The world outside your echo chamber is laughing at you.

He informed me that I was going to espouse Soros conspiracy theories in my next post even though I've worked with his son   

[Tumblerseven]

2 hours ago, LondonLax said:

Just so we’re clear, you do realise don’t you that if you wiped out every single Hamas terrorist in Gaza, (all 40,000 of them to the last man, or whatever your numbers might be), the killing of thousands and thousands or innocent civilians would cause thousands of Gaza’s population to become new Hamas members in their search for justice. They will then likely go and get their revenge on Israel, Oct 7 style, at some point in the future. 

Okay. Tell me after october 7 before Israel response bombing and stuff. Hamas goes back into Gaza they dance in the streets they party.

I magically Thanos snap all the leaders of Hamas and force Palestine to have a democratic election on october 8.

What do they elect?

1.Another terroristic group who will say from the river to the sea we will fight till our last brother until we free the whole Palestine.

2. They elect people who will accept peace they stop making rockets and stop terrorizing Israel and from now on they will accept that they only have Gaza and West Bank and new elected government devotes themselves to diplomatic solutions only. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

8 hours ago, Tumblerseven said:

Israel has the right to annex Gaza and neighboring Arab countries have a responsibility and promise to take Palestinian population whole population from Gaza however they want to themselves.  I think that would solve Gaza problem. And i think only Israel would accept. I think it would be a fair deal.

I reckon Putin annexing Ukraine would sort out the issues there too.

I'm happy we are getting closer to your true sentiment with your posts though.

Yeah get all the Palestinians off their land to put an end to this.

You've obviously got access to the Zionist handbook as I suspect the real intention is ( And always has been ) to drive them out anyway.

Nothing like a bit of ethnic cleansing to sort out world issues ay?

Bravo!

 

 

Un - **** - believable

Edited November 5, 2023 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Mic09]

8 hours ago, Tumblerseven said:

Arab countries have a responsibility and promise to take Palestinian population whole population from Gaza however they want to themselves.  

Why do they? 

[meregreen]

I wonder if a single person on this site has changed or modified their opinions due to reading these posts. I doubt it, and that in itself is indicative of the entrenched views on this issue. It’ll take both sides to move for any solution to be found. After the events of 7th October and after, I’d say we’re further away than ever. 

[Tumblerseven]

20 minutes ago, Mic09 said:

Why do they? 

Why wont they?

So the constant crying and virtue signaling about palestine and palestinians the commitments to go into war for them i think they present themselves like they really really care. If they want peace stability and life and freedom for Palestine they surely would agree right?

Oh wait are you saying that Arab countries know that Palestine would fail as a country and just start terrorizing neighbors again? uh oh.

[delboy54]

All the arguments about this conflict on this forum represents what's happening elsewhere.

The issue is how will this conflict ever be resolved? Not really seen any practical suggestion anywhere to be honest, and I have no idea in case I get asked!

The problem is how far back in time do you go to see who was the original lot who started this hatred - last 10 years?, last month?, last century?, 500 years ago?, 2000 or more years ago...?

Hamas covenant (agenda/manifesto) is to kill all Jews and destroy Israel so that is a difficult position to start to negotiate a resolution.

What I still feel uneasy about is the brutal slaughter of 1400 civilians by hamas. Now Israel are now obviously doing the same thing by indiscriminate aerial bombing. I wonder if hamas had been brave enough to try targeting the military instead of unarmed civilians on October 7th, then there may have been a different response to this conflict by nations around the world.

I despair of humanity and the human race at times

 

[sne]

3 minutes ago, delboy54 said:

All the arguments about this conflict on this forum represents what's happening elsewhere.

The issue is how will this conflict ever be resolved? Not really seen any practical suggestion anywhere to be honest, and I have no idea in case I get asked!

The problem is how far back in time do you go to see who was the original lot who started this hatred - last 10 years?, last month?, last century?, 500 years ago?, 2000 or more years ago...?

Hamas covenant (agenda/manifesto) is to kill all Jews and destroy Israel so that is a difficult position to start to negotiate a resolution.

What I still feel uneasy about is the brutal slaughter of 1400 civilians by hamas. Now Israel are now obviously doing the same thing by indiscriminate aerial bombing. I wonder if hamas had been brave enough to try targeting the military instead of unarmed civilians on October 7th, then there may have been a different response to this conflict by nations around the world.

I despair of humanity and the human race at times

 

Not that it matters but wasn't around 350 of those killed in the terror attack IDF? Not sure it makes Hamas any braver as far as I'm concerned.

[Tumblerseven]

57 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I reckon Putin annexing Ukraine would sort out the issues there too.

Yeah get all the Palestinians off their land to put an end to this.

You've obviously got access to the Zionist handbook as I suspect the real intention is ( And always has been ) to drive them out anyway.

Nothing like a bit of ethnic cleansing to sort out world issues ay?

So i dont think that population cleansing is inherently a bad thing. I think that Ukraine had the right to try population cleanse the Russians in Donbas and Luhansk in 2014 who wanted to take land from Ukraine. I guess you disagree you would just roll over and let them take anything they want becouse population cleansing looks bad.

Yes actually annexing Gaza and population cleanse would put an end to the Gaza conflict. I dont believe that any country have the inherent right to exist. Maybe you do?

You've obviously got access to the Zionist handbook thats hilarious after my comments about settlers.

So the question for you i Thanos snap and put 300 000 North Koreans in your city tomorrow.

What do you choose? 1. population cleanse  2.kill them  3.roll over like a good boy and just move 

[meregreen]

2 minutes ago, Tumblerseven said:

So i dont think that population cleansing is inherently a bad thing. 

Wow. You lost me completely there. And I speak as someone who has sympathy with Israel. 

[bickster]

3 minutes ago, Tumblerseven said:

So i dont think that population cleansing is inherently a bad thing. I think that Ukraine had the right to try population cleanse the Russians in Donbas and Luhansk in 2014 who wanted to take land from Ukraine. I guess you disagree you would just roll over and let them take anything they want becouse population cleansing looks bad.

You appear to be believing Russian propaganda