The Video Assistant Referee (VAR)

[sharkyvilla]

12 hours ago, MrBlack said:

Using an eye brings subjectivity and a whole heap of inconsistency into it.

Use AI or some none world-ending computer-based tool to automate where the lines are drawn. Add in a heap of allowance for the fact the timing of the ball release, the angle of the camera, and the possible % error that the positioning of the line may give, and then let a computer do the decision. Takes seconds.

Then they only overrule the onfield decision Ilif it passes that test and reaches a different conclusion.

Consistency and largely keeps ownership on the field.

The technology already exists and was used at the world cup, that's the bizarre thing about it all imo.

[villa4europe]

3 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

The technology already exists and was used at the world cup, that's the bizarre thing about it all imo.

100%

They also ran it using 5 man VAR specialists rather than superstar pitch refs 

Also new to me as I learned it during the commentary of the England game last week, fifa don't use the terminology "clear and obvious" in their rules, that's a PL and MLS thing only 

They operate it on a complete different level and at 2 world cups now it's worked, it's night and day 

[Villan_of_oz]

37 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

100%

They also ran it using 5 man VAR specialists rather than superstar pitch refs 

Also new to me as I learned it during the commentary of the England game last week, fifa don't use the terminology "clear and obvious" in their rules, that's a PL and MLS thing only 

They operate it on a complete different level and at 2 world cups now it's worked, it's night and day 

Yeah the "clear and obvious" saying does my head in, who sets the the bar on what is classified as clear and obvious. 

Just another variable leading to differing and subjective decisions allowed to be made with no duty of care.

VAR is basically a business that is run with business plan or agreed protocols. Just a bunch of blokes sitting a room watching football talking shite.

[fightoffyour]

Sometimes VAR does work well though:

 

[fightoffyour]

Ok seriously:

Not in the Premier League of course though.

Edited November 28, 2023 by fightoffyour

[rodders0223]

They're absolutely beyond inept.

It's a national embarrassment every week.

[Pongo's Socks]

Just heard Adrian Durham on TalkShite saying we shouldn't fall into the trap of believing this is only an English problem. He's just given some examples of terrible VAR decisions elsewhere in Europe, apparently someone smashed up a VAR pitch side monitor in frustration. 

[foreveryoung]

9 minutes ago, rodders0223 said:

They're absolutely beyond inept.

It's a national embarrassment every week.

This! When people realise its the refeeress not the actual technology, things might change.

It's like they have been using pencils for years and now been asked to use a computer. No ref enjoys it in the VAR room  that's more than obvious. It needs specialists, not old skool referees in there.

[S-Platt]

Villa use VAR for our advantage though with our offside trap.

The technology is fine its the idiots interpretation of the rules that needs to change pronto.

[Spoony]

4 minutes ago, Pongo's Socks said:

Just heard Adrian Durham on TalkShite saying we shouldn't fall into the trap of believing this is only an English problem. He's just given some examples of terrible VAR decisions elsewhere in Europe, apparently someone smashed up a VAR pitch side monitor in frustration. 

Yeah I don’t really get the narrative that it’s just English refs. We have literally seen it in the conference with Villa let alone anything else. 

[MaVilla]

1 hour ago, S-Platt said:

Villa use VAR for our advantage though with our offside trap.

The technology is fine its the idiots interpretation of the rules that needs to change pronto.

ye, i honestly think our offside traps benefit from it.

However, VAR does need fixing.

VAR needs to be run by entirely independent people who are trained/competent to an extremely high degree, and it needs to be is the decision right, or wrong, not this clear and obvious, grey area, blah blah, just....is it right or wrong.

honestly, i dont think anything is wrong with VAR, the system in isolation is more than capable of working, it works perfectly well in other sports, its just VAR in football (PL), is managed and ran by at best incompetent people, and at worst corrupt people.

[imavillan]

1 hour ago, Pongo's Socks said:

Just heard Adrian Durham on TalkShite saying we shouldn't fall into the trap of believing this is only an English problem. He's just given some examples of terrible VAR decisions elsewhere in Europe, apparently someone smashed up a VAR pitch side monitor in frustration. 

you lost me at Adrian Durham 

what an absolute 

[imavillan]

10 hours ago, gwi1890 said:

 

i thought he articulated himself really well here as opposed to Arteta, a stark contrast, and lets be honest he has and made some really valid points

PGMOL and officials change the goal posts every week and they're reactionary to whats gone on the week before.

We have them in Stockley Park re-refereeing the game, then it just becomes someone else's opinion. It's ok though, Howard Webb can come on the tv and defend them and apologise and just carry on. It's bull shit. Everyone can see it.

The camp of VAR fans is diminishing with every week.

I pray for the day when the eff it off all together and confine it to the rubbish tip

[bobzy]

11 hours ago, Spoony said:

The blame can’t all be at the refs doors. Players buying fouls, exaggerating contact, etc. has a huge part to play. The premier league is just a ridiculous soap opera now. 

To some extent I agree, but the refs have to know what the **** they're looking at.

That Fulham penalty at the end of the game last night - it's just not a foul, right?  There's a] Not enough contact to actually impede Wilson and b] Wilson is going down as soon as he feels any contact whatsoever.

The referee, actually refereeing the game, waves play on which - to me - is the right call.  VAR then suggest he looks at a monitor where they slow the play right down so you lose any context of pace or intent or anything, just a real slo-mo of some contact on Wilson's leg.  That's enough - penalty.  It's just not good enough.  They need to understand what a foul is, not "well there's contact and it isn't with the ball".

 

(FWIW, I reckon most fans of most clubs would want a penalty for it because this is what the game is now).

[Jonesy7211]

One of the biggest issues with VAR is that those in the stadium and those watching at home get no live audio of what the officials are looking at and how they get to the decisions they make. If people could hear why they were making these decisions then even if you don't agree with the outcome, you might at least understand it.

The next issue is consistency. Just using the game last night as an example for the yellow the headbutt received, and the penalties. They never get this right.

VAR isn't going anywhere, the genie is out of the bottle. We just need people or a system that can implement it at the right times, and get the right outcome more often than they do. With the money involved in the Prem, every point is precious, and VAR has too much of an effect on this. People lose jobs with relegations, and clubs lose money depending on their final placings and Euro qualification.

Finally, the on the patch officials need to be braver. Refs know most contentious actions will be reviewed so they don't need to make a decision at the time, and linesmen never need to raise their flags. At the moment linesmen are completely superfluous.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Jonesy7211

[StefanAVFC]

24 minutes ago, bobzy said:

(FWIW, I reckon most fans of most clubs would want a penalty for it because this is what the game is now).

I lean towards this too, but this is also the fault of the refs for giving such pens in the first place.

I would have been ok with the 1st pen standing and the 2nd not being given, I wouldn't agree at all with the 1st pen but at least there's a consistency in not re-reffing the game. The same with the headbutt.

But why get involved in some subjective decisions and not others?

Edited November 28, 2023 by StefanAVFC

[luckyeddie]

33 minutes ago, imavillan said:

i thought he articulated himself really well here as opposed to Arteta, a stark contrast, and lets be honest he has and made some really valid points

PGMOL and officials change the goal posts every week and they're reactionary to whats gone on the week before.

We have them in Stockley Park re-refereeing the game, then it just becomes someone else's opinion. It's ok though, Howard Webb can come on the tv and defend them and apologise and just carry on. It's bull shit. Everyone can see it.

The camp of VAR fans is diminishing with every week.

I pray for the day when the eff it off all together and confine it to the rubbish tip

Yeah, I thought he handled the situation well. Two penalties, neither of them close to being a foul denied them points. Refereeing and VAR, are killing the game.

Human error is acceptable but taking five minutes to **** up is rediculous.

[villa4europe]

3 hours ago, fightoffyour said:

Ok seriously:

Not in the Premier League of course though.

cant remember which game it was at the weekend but in the bundesliga not only did VAR overturn a penalty the attacker got booked for diving afterwards

[The_Steve]

How VAR gave Fulham that penalty last night is a joke. Sack them. 

[AndyM3000]

Wilson one is a pen. Player sticks his leg across Wilson's run, might be minimal contact but he's impeded his run and not got the ball, you can't stick your leg out like that you are just asking for trouble.