blandy Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 4 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: I'd like English league games played in England Cardiff and Swansea won't like you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 Just now, blandy said: Cardiff and Swansea won't like you Or Greater England, sorry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 7 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: The main thing for me is protections around things like the league structure, so that Premier league B teams don't go into League 1 and 2 and so that we can't have further fracturing of the league structure with super leagues and so on. I'd like to see more protection of the cultural aspects of clubs so that if the owner of the LA Rams buys Sunderland he can't force them to play in Blue and Yellow and so that someone can't buy Burnley and move them to Dublin, I'd like English league games played in England, I'd like the success of the game to be measured by its impact on communities rather than the size of its TV deals. I like the idea of having fans voices at board level and a greater concern for the overall health of the game rather than the continued concentration of its wealth into less and less hands and where that will inevitably take us. The pandemic has fractured some things and there are elements of the game competing and eating each other because of the impossibility of the model of permanent growth - that's giving us an awful lot of stupid ideas at all sorts of levels of the game, from FIFA's fortnightly world cup, to the European Super league, to 25 minute half times to world cups in a sandcastle of blood, the frantic grabbing for the largest slice of the income that's out there is putting the integrity of the game at risk. If this can help with that in any respect, then I'm all for it. That's all fair and good. I want the Prem (and EFL etc.) to address that, rather than Joris Bonson or Jacob Cayman-Mogg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 1 minute ago, blandy said: That's all fair and good. I want the Prem (and EFL etc.) to address that, rather than Joris Bonson or Jacob Cayman-Mogg I get where you're coming from, The Prime Minister and his government are a vile, greedy, corrupt organisation, but they got that way because of the type of people that own football clubs - I'm not sure that because the people that should be looking out for us are jackals we should instead hand the keys to the sheep shed to lions. I'm not prepared to settle for feudalism yet, there will be other governments. Democracy good, government bad, banking billionaires worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted December 1, 2021 Share Posted December 1, 2021 On 29/11/2021 at 21:08, The_Steve said: Rigged Jorginho third???!!! Old farts club. Need fresh blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 8 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said: Democracy good It's the least bad system. But the entertainment industry/sport isn't a democracy, nor should it be. I think we've seen with the abortive Super League that the PL can act swiftly to address things they don't like/agree with. Your or my utopian/common sense* (*delete as applicable) ideas are one thing, and they may be shared by many, but my instinct is to keep politics out of football, and for sure politics is always going to be a part if Football is regulated by the Government (even at arms length) - whether it's Tory or Labour or some other version. The government could make law(s) outlawing foreign ownership, or moving clubs from Sunderland to Dublin, or whatever. Equally, they could do favours to rich Russians who donate to their party, or who they meet at Tennis, or to Middle Eastern nations who pay them for TV appearances or whatever. Basically, I'm OK with the parliament of the day setting down laws to require or prohibit whatever, but not with a party in power regulating football. I'd rather stick with the twunts running the PL and EFL than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted December 1, 2021 Share Posted December 1, 2021 27 minutes ago, blandy said: Cardiff and Swansea won't like you What is it with people forgetting about the mighty Newport County today?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted December 1, 2021 Moderator Share Posted December 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, bobzy said: What is it with people forgetting about the mighty Newport County today?! That's not fair! We didn't forget today, we forget every day 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 1, 2021 Share Posted December 1, 2021 23 minutes ago, The Fun Factory said: Old farts club. Need fresh blood. Its like the Catholic Church. The pup Ronaldo finished 6th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Disgusted that only one club gave a statement on this - it’s really shameful that we are involved in crypto this way as a club 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 If you are stupid enough to buy those club tokens you deserve to lose your money. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 hour ago, villa89 said: If you are stupid enough to buy those club tokens you deserve to lose your money. I don't disagree, but I think I would want to hedge that by noting that as far as I can see, there is literally nothing to stop children from buying and trading them, and there are no warnings given on the website about your capital being at risk. These 'tokens' are such a dismal load of crap honestly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 (edited) Having read a bit more about them, it's going to cost a couple of quid, to gain some perks, is it really that big a problem? Buying loads of them as an investment is daft, but there seems to be no incentive to buy multiple tokens? Edited December 11, 2021 by Davkaus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 1 hour ago, Davkaus said: Having read a bit more about them, it's going to cost a couple of quid, to gain some perks, is it really that big a problem? Buying loads of them as an investment is daft, but there seems to be no incentive to buy multiple tokens? from: https://www.socios.com/fan-tokens/ So, short answer, it depends on the club and how they decide to 'price' the rewards. But I think we need to look down the line a bit here. This is not going to be a sustainable, growing business if every customer can just buy one token and then never have to engage with them again. I think we need to assume that there will be a lot of inflation in pricing in 'chiliz' and also attempts to push people towards trading. If your more optimistic take is right, and in fact people won't need more than a handful of tokens, then your conclusion is also right, and it won't have been very harmful. All we will have done is rather inefficiently outsource our reward scheme. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 That's fair - I'd only read about the Villa tokens and didn't realise it worked a bit differently depending on the club, it's certainly reasonable that if they hook in enough suckers I could see it spreading in influence a little. If I were to buy one I'd be doing it with the presumption I'm simply paying for the service, but pushing it as a currency is the clubs helping to exploit their fans, which is disappointing but not surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, HanoiVillan said: from: https://www.socios.com/fan-tokens/ So, short answer, it depends on the club and how they decide to 'price' the rewards. But I think we need to look down the line a bit here. This is not going to be a sustainable, growing business if every customer can just buy one token and then never have to engage with them again. I think we need to assume that there will be a lot of inflation in pricing in 'chiliz' and also attempts to push people towards trading. If your more optimistic take is right, and in fact people won't need more than a handful of tokens, then your conclusion is also right, and it won't have been very harmful. All we will have done is rather inefficiently outsource our reward scheme. It's a really dishonest scheme - any fan can buy any token and the companies behind said coins set the value. Fandom should not be linked to such dangerous forms of currency in any form. We've seen the big, big problem of loot boxes for young people on FIFA. Much how like 'white label' gambling is re-branded as 'entertaintment' - this stuff doesn't look like the gambling it is - especially when many, many (myself included) have no idea how Bitcoin and other crypto currencies work. Edited December 11, 2021 by The_Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted December 11, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 11, 2021 2 hours ago, The_Steve said: It's a really dishonest scheme - any fan can buy any token and the companies behind said coins set the value. Fandom should not be linked to such dangerous forms of currency in any form. We've seen the big, big problem of loot boxes for young people on FIFA. Much how like 'white label' gambling is re-branded as 'entertaintment' - this stuff doesn't look like the gambling it is - especially when many, many (myself included) have no idea how Bitcoin and other crypto currencies work. I'm not a fan of these tokens but how can you be so sure that it's "really dishonest" and "dangerous" when you "have no idea how... Crypto currencies work"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 18 hours ago, Rds1983 said: I'm not a fan of these tokens but how can you be so sure that it's "really dishonest" and "dangerous" when you "have no idea how... Crypto currencies work"? To be honest I don't think you need to know how cryptocurrencies work to think that it's dishonest not to have any kind of warning either that gambling is addictive or that your capital is at risk and the value of investments can go down as well as up, or to think that it's dangerous for a financial product to be 'regulated in Estonia' where presumably British consumers will find it impossible to make a claim or get any regulatory relief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted December 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2021 3 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: To be honest I don't think you need to know how cryptocurrencies work to think that it's dishonest not to have any kind of warning either that gambling is addictive or that your capital is at risk and the value of investments can go down as well as up, or to think that it's dangerous for a financial product to be 'regulated in Estonia' where presumably British consumers will find it impossible to make a claim or get any regulatory relief. I agree that crypto-currency is dangerous and that a lot of people are completely unaware of the risks involved. There 100% are some dodgy characters involved in publishing tokens, but there are some completely genuine people involved too. There is a lot more to it than people perhaps think and I feel statements like those I queried perhaps come from fear, misunderstanding and misinformation. Which can be dangerous in itself. What stood out to me though was making such bold statements followed directly by stating a complete ignorance of how they work. People are of course free to dislike something, I just feel perhaps it would be better to build some level of knowledge of something before judging it. Not trying to sound preachy or that I'm judging anyone, so apologies if it reads that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Kuwabatake Sanjuro Posted December 12, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted December 12, 2021 Good stuff from the Palace fans. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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