Nigel Posted November 21, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2017 16 hours ago, One For The Road said: We are definitely in the hunt for a top 6 finish after Saturday but the real test is yet to come. See this is where the table doesnt tell the whole truth. Since the crap start we have been consistently in and around the top of the form charts, this means we are moving up. Our trajectory is taking us to where are form says we should be, not fighting top 6 but top 3. The start has been proven to be an anomaly if taken in a wider context, and this is skewing judgements. If we carry on the way we are going we will be in with a great shot; Its working atm. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubberman Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 21 minutes ago, Nigel said: See this is where the table doesnt tell the whole truth. Since the crap start we have been consistently in and around the top of the form charts, this means we are moving up. Our trajectory is taking us to where are form says we should be, not fighting top 6 but top 3. The start has been proven to be an anomaly if taken in a wider context, and this is skewing judgements. If we carry on the way we are going we will be in with a great shot; Its working atm. Although so have Sheffield and Wolves. If we all continue at the same rate as for the last 10 home / away, we would overhaul Bristol and Cardiff, but still be 4/5 points off automatic. We either need to improve again, or need others to stumble. Continuing forward at the rate of the last 6 games h/a sees us drop to 7th. It's not going to be easy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 14 minutes ago, rubberman said: Although so have Sheffield and Wolves. If we all continue at the same rate as for the last 10 home / away, we would overhaul Bristol and Cardiff, but still be 4/5 points off automatic. We either need to improve again, or need others to stumble. Continuing forward at the rate of the last 6 games h/a sees us drop to 7th. It's not going to be easy... And that's why we haven't been able to close the gap over the last few months. Because regardless of the form we are showing, the teams above are not dropping enough points. It's an extremely difficult gap to close after our abysmal start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 Saturday 23rd December could be Massive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 The key for us is to stay within 5 or so points from 2nd place come January. We will have the transfer window and hopefully some of our key players returning. 5 point gap with a new signing or two, Kodjia, Hogan and Terry back? I would say we have a good chance of closing that gap. Worry is that we fall further behind in the next month or two. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 (edited) 57 minutes ago, dn1982 said: 7 points is a massive gap to close when everyone keeps doing well. We found that out last year. We closed the gap to 6 from the playoffs at one point but fell away as teams kept on winning. That’s what happens. We’ve not been involved in the top end of a division for ages so people forget how hard it’s can be to close gaps when teams do well. We will always have a bad game in us and losing to Sheffield Wed was a big loss especially with the games in December. If we are still within 7 come January we will be doing well. Let’s get 2 Home wins to set us up for a big month. This is what worries me. I remember drawing with Leeds last season in last game of December to keep in contention for play offs. After that we fell apart. However we are a much better team and squad than the one last year so hopefully we won't see this bad run of form again. But I think the memory of it still keeps fans sceptical. edit: saying that how about Leeds! fell apart right at the end. Brutal league. Edited November 21, 2017 by Vive_La_Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted November 21, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2017 2 hours ago, rubberman said: Although so have Sheffield and Wolves. If we all continue at the same rate as for the last 10 home / away, we would overhaul Bristol and Cardiff, but still be 4/5 points off automatic. We either need to improve again, or need others to stumble. Continuing forward at the rate of the last 6 games h/a sees us drop to 7th. It's not going to be easy... Top 3 would mean we are fighting 2 others.. ..if thats Sheffield and wolves so be it. All we are talking about atm is getting us into contention come the last 5 - 10 games, then its a different game...but thats a discussion for a different day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 Sheffield United could be the new Huddesfiled we just dont know yet. But i Think with them they have a strong team spirit but that can only get you so far here. A few injuries or bad results and they could tumble. We really need beat them at Villa Park and knock the stuffing out of them and show the rest of this league what we are capable of. I think they will be around top 8. I think the teams to challenge wolves is likely us, boro, derby, leeds and cardiff. sheff united i dont think will be bale to sustain this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 39 minutes ago, Nigel said: All we are talking about atm is getting us into contention come the last 5 - 10 games, then its a different game...but thats a discussion for a different day. Being in contention for the last 10 games would mean us being in second place around 3-4 points ahead of 3rd place. That's being in contention to try and finish in the top 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted November 21, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2017 1 hour ago, ender4 said: Being in contention for the last 10 games would mean us being in second place around 3-4 points ahead of 3rd place. That's being in contention to try and finish in the top 2. Rubbish, being in contention would be in and around 2nd, id say realistically if we are 6 points behind with 10 games to go its game on. Its not easy to carry on winning when the pressure really hits, plenty of points will be dropped. Im not saying we would be able to do it from there, but we would have a chance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 7 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: We've dropped points recently as well wheras they haven't. They are top of the 6 game form chart and 10 game form chart. I see where you are coming from though.The poor start has left us playing catchup all season. We're 2 points behind on the 10 game chart, which includes them beating us. That takes us back to Barnsley away, when it seemed to me that we really kicked on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 2 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Sheffield United could be the new Huddesfiled we just dont know yet. But i Think with them they have a strong team spirit but that can only get you so far here. A few injuries or bad results and they could tumble. We really need beat them at Villa Park and knock the stuffing out of them and show the rest of this league what we are capable of. I think they will be around top 8. I think the teams to challenge wolves is likely us, boro, derby, leeds and cardiff. sheff united i dont think will be bale to sustain this. They could be the new Huddersfield and finish in the playoffs. I think they might actually. I have 2nd as ours for the taking to be honest and I'm confident. But we do HAVE to start putting our competitors away, because eventually a banana skin like tonight will catch us out (please don't let it be tonight!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted November 21, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2017 Looking at it positively, we’ve averaged 2 points a game since the first three matches of the season. And I think it’s accurate to say we’ve achieved that without playing to the best of our abilities for a fair amount of it. If we continue that form, we’ll be right in the mix. My worry is we’ve only picked up two points from the four games we’ve played so far against the clubs who make up the rest of the top six. I can’t see us achieving a top two spot without improving our record against those around us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 (edited) 17 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: We're 2 points behind on the 10 game chart, which includes them beating us. That takes us back to Barnsley away, when it seemed to me that we really kicked on. Yeh the Barnsley game was a really statement away from home. For me the turning point was Norwich and playing Davis up front. After that we were poor against Brentford who in my opinion are a very good team so was an ok point. We got a point at Bristol which now looks a decent point. Boro was just one of them games when no matter what we did we wouldn't score. So I guess you're right. We have been playing catchup since the first 3 games when we looked like a mid table championship team. edit: just read the post above. Edited November 21, 2017 by Vive_La_Villa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 44 minutes ago, Nigel said: id say realistically if we are 6 points behind with 10 games to go its game on. Whaaat? Thats just crazy. If we were 6 points ahead with 10 games to go, i still wouldn't be comfortable, but i would feel we were well in contention. Quote being in contention would be in and around 2nd Yep, and being 1st or well ahead in second would be this. Quote "Its not easy to carry on winning when the pressure really hits, plenty of points will be dropped". Exactly!!! And Villa are the worst at dropping points when the pressure really hits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 20 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Yeh the Barnsley game was a really statement away from home. For me the turning point was Norwich and playing Davis up front. After that we were poor against Brentford who in my opinion are a very good team so was an ok point. We got a point at Bristol which now looks a decent point. Boro was just one of them games when no matter what we did we wouldn't score. So I guess you're right. We have been playing catchup since the first 3 games when we looked like a mid table championship team. edit: just read the post above. Whilst Wolves won their first 3, we picked up a point. So since those first 3 we're actually only a point behind them, that's with them beating us in what *seems* like a perfect storm of a game in hindsight. I talk about us beating the teams around us, they have also lost to Sheffield United(A) and Cardiff(H). They also lost to QPR(A). Let's put it this way, I don't quite buy this idea that Wolves are unbeatable. Far from it. Yes they have match winners, as we did with Kodjia last season, but it's still very early on. The harsh, relentless nature of December football is about to kick in and so let's see how they handle that. It only takes a couple of reverse results on the bounce and that gap which looks so huge now is all but gone. It could be gone by Saturday. I'm with Tony Xia - the only thing holding this team back is their mentality. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted November 21, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 21, 2017 Just now, ender4 said: Whaaat? Thats just crazy. If we were 6 points ahead with 10 games to go, i still wouldn't be comfortable, but i would feel we were well in contention. Exactly!!! And Villa are the worst at dropping points when the pressure really hits! I think you will find that there will be nothing 'comfortable' about 2nd place this season. It will be a fight up until the last couple of games. It will all come down to who has the bottle, there are no teams who are used to being in this position. However I would like to think that the likes of Whelan and especially Terry would give us a bit of an advantage in the run in. Im sure that the opposition would be thinking it too. As i said, Im not saying we could turn around a big deficit, but we would still definitely be in it. However we are straying from the original point, its getting to that position which is the immediate aim. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 57 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: They could be the new Huddersfield and finish in the playoffs. I think they might actually. I have 2nd as ours for the taking to be honest and I'm confident. But we do HAVE to start putting our competitors away, because eventually a banana skin like tonight will catch us out (please don't let it be tonight!) They very well.could be however i am not so sure as Huddersfield had some experience in this league. A double promotion is bloody tough. If sheffield united manage it wilder has to get championship manager of the decade! You are also right that we do need to start beating those around us and we have the opportunity with derby, leeds boro coming up. For me the one thing i was delighted about and has held us back for a while is: coming back from a losing position to win. We only managed that against reading last year. Hopefully now with the QPR victory we can put that monkey off our backs. If we have overcome that i think skys the limit i really do once we get key players like kodjia and terry back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dn1982 Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 5 hours ago, Vive_La_Villa said: This is what worries me. I remember drawing with Leeds last season in last game of December to keep in contention for play offs. After that we fell apart. However we are a much better team and squad than the one last year so hopefully we won't see this bad run of form again. But I think the memory of it still keeps fans sceptical. edit: saying that how about Leeds! fell apart right at the end. Brutal league. I think we will make the playoffs even with another dip but if we want to challenge for top 2 we need to be on fire all season. Losing against Sheff Wed is exactly the sort of result we did last year but then it turned into a run of bad results that’s why QPR was such a big win. We have to win our home games so we can settle for a draw some times away and being able to bounce back after a bad result is mass8ve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted November 21, 2017 Author Share Posted November 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, dn1982 said: I think we will make the playoffs even with another dip but if we want to challenge for top 2 we need to be on fire all season. Losing against Sheff Wed is exactly the sort of result we did last year but then it turned into a run of bad results that’s why QPR was such a big win. We have to win our home games so we can settle for a draw some times away and being able to bounce back after a bad result is mass8ve. Yep - bouncebackability. We've shown it a couple of times this season. Moar plz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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