TheAuthority Posted May 31, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted May 31, 2018 1 minute ago, Wainy316 said: We are the only club I’ve ever known be this crippled by FFP. Everyone else just ignores it or sponsors their ground for £400m. Or breastmilk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrjc Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 11 hours ago, markavfc40 said: I am not sure what to make of the statement but I'd have hoped for something more optimistic and fully focused on the fight back from Saturday having already started. Plenty of clubs have shown over the years, most fresh in my mind Cardiff, Brighton, Huddersfield, Wolves, Burnley, Bournemouth, Fulham that you can be out of the Prem league for 3+ years, or never have been in it, and still get promoted from the Championship. I hope this is the last time I see the owner state he is still hurting/still can't recover from Saturday. With the new season under 10 weeks away it is already past the time he moved on and now shows he has the means, business acumen and had the foresight to plan for this eventuality so he can now ensure we can still move forward and be succesful. I hope that is not wishful thinking on my part. I see your point. But those clubs didn't have the legacy of costs / players / losses that we have. I know this may sound obvious, but we are suffering from several years of bad decision-making. The FFP rules are simply there to stop that spiralling. The last year we were in the PL we lost around £80m...£80m! This still features in the FFP test (this season) and therefore is still holding us back. There were one-offs in there, admittedly, but then we went and bankrolled a serious push at promotion. I'm not sure any of those clubs mentioned have the combination of legacy losses and investment in current squad...to have then not delivered. We are a fairly unique case, I think. Maybe it wasn't a rallying cry, but I took it as an honest assessment to the fans of what is to come - and actually, for that I take it positively. Whether it works immediately or takes time, I would rather someone takes proper control and hard decisions at this time than simply glossing over issues. Where I completely agree - whatever was in the statement, the action from here is critical. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 8 hours ago, TRO said: Well, we are not too dissimilar to Sunderland really....they are just a worse version. Despite our valiant attempts.....I think Neil Warnock would have got us up.....but with his type of players. I am not trying to belittle the fashion of the attempts to raise the ship....I just happen to think he has a better eye for the type of players we now need. Its easy to say this after he has got promotion, but i just think he does the simple things right....and sets his team up to fight, much more then we did. I said in an earlier post, we surrender initiative too easily....He would not be having that and I am surprised Steve Bruce did to be honest and that is the main reason why I think he willlet someone else have go. I agree now in hindsight Warnock probably would have done a better job but imagine the ructions had Warnock got the job 2 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 9 hours ago, markavfc40 said: Impossible dream? I'd put my house on our budget/wage bill next season being higher than Burnleys, Bournemouths, Huddersfields, Brightons and Cardiffs was when they were promoted over the last handful of years. Why would it matter how the budget compares to teams in the past, what matters is how it'll compare to next season's Stoke, Swansea, etc. Not that budget is a guarantee if you spend it like a drunk as we saw from RDM and Xia 2 years ago. 3 more years to Champions league football.Can't believe same man who said this was taking a poke at the plans from the last 10 years in his statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, BG_Villa_Fan said: Why would it matter how the budget compares to teams in the past, what matters is how it'll compare to next season's Stoke, Swansea, etc. Not that budget is a guarantee if you spend it like a drunk as we saw from RDM and Xia 2 years ago. 3 more years to Champions league football.Can't believe same man who said this was taking a poke at the plans from the last 10 years in his statement. Let’s not totally exempt Bruce from poor spending too - hogan and Bree cost the best part of £20m to play bit roles last season -had he spent that £20m better we may well not be sitting in this mess now - yes he also made some decent buys but so did rdm in Chester , kodjia ,adomah . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Villa_Fan Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, Eastie said: Let’s not totally exempt Bruce from poor spending too - hogan and Bree cost the best part of £20m to play bit roles last season -had he spent that £20m better we may well not be sitting in this mess now - yes he also made some decent buys but so did rdm in Chester , kodjia ,adomah . This is fair but my beef is not with the managers, it's with an owner who thinks he can spend his way to get where he wants and fails due to poor decisions. Carbon copy of Lerner's first few years. Lerner had a great reputation among Villa fans in his first 4 or 5 years too. Not saying Xia is the same, I don't know, but so far he's doing similar things, only worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didiersix Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 How many shrewd decisions do you think Dr T. has made so far in his time at Villa Park? I know we had a big rebuild etc. but I can't help feel he has got more leeway just by not being Randy Lerner. I believe he maybe well intentioned - just as Lerner was - but is he about to lose interest now that his plans for world domination have gone awry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 4 minutes ago, Didiersix said: How many shrewd decisions do you think Dr T. has made so far in his time at Villa Park? I know we had a big rebuild etc. but I can't help feel he has got more leeway just by not being Randy Lerner. I believe he maybe well intentioned - just as Lerner was - but is he about to lose interest now that his plans for world domination have gone awry? This is my fear - now the dream has died will he want to stick around . The plan was premier league and fast - would he be prepared to stick in this league another 2 or 3 years or will he lose interest . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted May 31, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted May 31, 2018 7 minutes ago, Eastie said: Let’s not totally exempt Bruce from poor spending too - hogan and Bree cost the best part of £20m to play bit roles last season Fake News - Not £20 million. 3.5 Million Euro for Bree 10.5 Million Euro for Hogaon 14 Million Euro total or £12.25 Million (pounds) £12.25 million total for both according to transfermkt.com 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 4 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: Agree with this. He needs to get his head back in the game. Yes, it's going to be difficult, yes, we're going to have to do more with less, but we can't give the impression we're giving up because it's all just a bit hard right now. Reading this thread it seems that is the impression he has given. We are in the Championship now not the Premier League. Year in year out clubs show you can get success in this division without spending a fortune in fees and without paying players silly wages. We are in danger here of setting the bar so low that we don't just look to stagnate at this level we drop down another one. As you said there was always a fair chance we may face this scenario of going into a third season in the Championship. Wyness stated in February the club had planned for it apparently and if he planned for it to be financil meltdown we"d already failed. Fulham showed last season what you can do in your third season outside the top flight. We now need to stop looking back, grow a pair and show some imagination in terms of off setting the reduced parachute payments/sidestepping ffp and ensure we go into next season with a squad capable of again competing for promotion, the nucleus of which is acually already here. Edited May 31, 2018 by markavfc40 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbr600rr Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 DR T..few alarm bells are ringing,,why did he not buy the club when RL put it for sale when it was in the prem league? with very little ffp then he could have got us in top 6 (his words) so now hes saying the same as randy "cuts" etc but using other words, other clubs get around the ffp as stated with ground "rename" etc, lets be honest.. if he wanted to ..he could, other teams like city take the fine & says its whats needed to compete at the higest level, thats the difference between owners Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 7 minutes ago, markavfc40 said: Reading this thread it seems that is the impression he has given. We are in the Championship now not the Premier League. Year in year out clubs show you can get success in this division without spending a fortune in fees and without paying players silly wages. We are in danger here of setting the bar so low that we don't just look to stagnate at this level we drop down another one. As you said there was always a fair chance we may face this scenario of going into a third season in the Championship. Wyness stated in February the club had planned for it apparently and if he planned for it to be financil meltdown we"d already failed. Fulham showed last season what you can do in your third season outside the top flight. We now need to stop looking back, grow a pair and show some imagination in terms of off setting the reduced parachute payments and ensure we go into next season with a squad capable of again competing for promotion, the nucleus of which is acually already here. The nucleus is or was here but how many of those first 11 at Wembley will be here in August ? i think we need to be competitive next season and hopefully challenge for the play offs - I think people need to realise a rebuild in strategy may take 2 or 3 years to pay off though and patience will be needed . ‘We are now in a much more difficult ball game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 9 minutes ago, cbr600rr said: DR T..few alarm bells are ringing,,why did he not buy the club when RL put it for sale when it was in the prem league? with very little ffp then he could have got us in top 6 (his words) so now hes saying the same as randy "cuts" etc but using other words, other clubs get around the ffp as stated with ground "rename" etc, lets be honest.. if he wanted to ..he could, other teams like city take the fine & says its whats needed to compete at the higest level, thats the difference between owners The rules have changed - the punishments now include points deduction or demotion - that is why he has to adhere to ffp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 53 minutes ago, Wainy316 said: We are the only club I’ve ever known be this crippled by FFP. Everyone else just ignores it or sponsors their ground for £400m. Have a google for QPR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 15 minutes ago, TheAuthority said: Fake News - Not £20 million. 3.5 Million Euro for Bree 10.5 Million Euro for Hogaon 14 Million Euro total or £12.25 Million (pounds) £12.25 million total for both according to transfermkt.com Either way had that money been spent better we could have been in a much better position - whether £12m or £15m or more - it was enough to bring in 2 or 3 regular first teamers at this level and not 2 reserves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post markavfc40 Posted May 31, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Eastie said: The nucleus is or was here but how many of those first 11 at Wembley will be here in August ? i think we need to be competitive next season and hopefully challenge for the play offs - I think people need to realise a rebuild in strategy may take 2 or 3 years to pay off though and patience will be needed . ‘We are now in a much more difficult ball game Terry will need replacing. As for Snodgrass, Grabban, Hutton, Johnstone see Green and Kodjia being fit next season not injured for 90% of it like the last one and Bree and Jed Steer to step up to the plate. In fact we have a handful of younger players in Bree, O'Hare, Green, Murphy and Davis who should be capable of being part of match day 18's week in week out next season. You don"t have to have to have really good players all over the pitch to do well at this level. Look at Cardiff last season hardly sprinkled with stardust, Huddersfield the previous season. In fact look at the squads at the likes of Reading, Sheff Wednesday, Derby, Cardiff, Huddersfield, Brighton over just the last couple of seasons who either achieved promotion or made the play offs and you won't recognise many of the names as they are filled with mediocrity. You don't need millions and star names to have succes at this level although it helps. What you definately don"t need though is wallowing in self pity and throwing the towel in before a ball has been kicked next season. This club still has plenty going for it and more than most at this level. Lets embrace the positives, see some imaginative thinking from the owner and set our ambitions accordingly. Edited May 31, 2018 by markavfc40 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 36 minutes ago, cbr600rr said: DR T..few alarm bells are ringing,,why did he not buy the club when RL put it for sale when it was in the prem league? with very little ffp then he could have got us in top 6 (his words) so now hes saying the same as randy "cuts" etc but using other words, other clubs get around the ffp as stated with ground "rename" etc, lets be honest.. if he wanted to ..he could, other teams like city take the fine & says its whats needed to compete at the higest level, thats the difference between owners Down to Randy wanting a ridiculous amount of money for a sinking ship. Only when we went down he cut his losses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 9 hours ago, Rob182 said: They got relegated. I wonder if Tony (or Recon) can somehow gift, er, I mean invest, £15m into Melbourne City, so they can sign Ross McCormack. That sounds like a plan along the lines of the whole Mendez bullshit at Wolves. Melbourne City already have a richer dodgier owner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 30 minutes ago, hippo said: Have a google for QPR So just a fine then. Would've been a drop in the ocean if they'd not got relegated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Wainy316 said: So just a fine then. Would've been a drop in the ocean if they'd not got relegated. Rules have tightened since then - we are abiding by ffp and that’s it - do you really want xia to put the whole future of the club at stake by taking such a risk ? ‘It’s not happening mate - you can kick and stomp as much as you like , the club Will abide by the rules . Ps - we know the rules are unfair but so is life . Edited May 31, 2018 by Eastie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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