Demitri_C Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 8 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said: I agree with this, apart from the 'right manager' bit. I'm not, thus far, convinced he's right for anything. Based on performances, tactics and decisions during games, he's like Lambert and McLeish's love child. The only thing that will convince me is us actually getting some wins, especially against the Watford's and Newcastle's of this world. I dont even think guardiola could save these losers. Just not enough quality and too much of a loser mentality for us to succeed. In my view Remi has a very tough job but I have seen improvement. Just a shame there is so much shit in the squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nabby Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 There no games that we should win now , the league is too tight this season and teams like United and Chelsea (though with Jose gone thats looking like it could change) have dropped points to the so called lower clubs 3 points is needed but a battling 1-1 was a decent enough result as we were behind and Newcastle had some decent form coming into the game.I don't think we could of been more attacking we matched them with 4 midfielders and the conditions would have not suited Grealish/Traore/Gil ,Gestede was the best choice off the bench and he created the corner and was close to getting on the end of a cross from Ayew. West Ham will be tricky they might have some players back according to Gold and haven't conceded in 3 games.Norwich next who are pretty well drilled and will have confidence after the result at United. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcTheObsession Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I am wondering whether the belief that Remi will do well is partly down to the fact he's a foreign manager who speaks well. I can't help thinking if Pearson had come in and got 3 points from 6 games there would be zero praise. However the current squad isn't up to scratch so he should be given the tools in January to give him the best chance here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Surely the debate over the last couple of pages, if it shows nothing else, shows that there are different, equally well thought out, ways we could have tackled the second half at Newcastle. As such it seems a bit daft to knock the Manager, it wasn't clear cut as, for example, Lambert's set up away at Arsenal was, or Sherwood's changes against Leicester. As for the guy saying he's making the same errors as Sherwood, you then just list who YOU think should play. That's really not an argument against who HE chooses to play, is it ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfingers Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 2 hours ago, Zatman said: we are definitely at the stage when we need go all our for wins. If we drew our next 22 games we would still not stay up We went for the win. I see no reason to go all gung ho at present. Drawing away at Newcastle has not relegated us. It might be a springboard to enter the Xmas period though. We do need wins, I agree but I don't see how gambling with the formation on Saturday night when we were already in the driving seat was the right thing to do. And lets be realistic here-Gil & Grealish have hardly produced all season-Giving one of them 20 minutes on Saturday would not have guaranteed anything-Especially as we had the upper hand at that point anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 23 hours ago, Dr_Pangloss said: I'm not so sure about that, personally I'm embarrassed by this team and it's 'achievements' this season. Yesterday we saw Norwich do a job on United yet some of us are happy with a point away to an abysmal Newcastle team. It's just not good enough, a total farce. I think there is a danger your stance could be dismissed out of hand and that we have to improve in baby steps....little bits of encouragement are all very fine and sensible and balanced views are usually the most listened too.....but a few hard, cold retorts may be useful too. However, I think in terms of creating some fight in this team....you may have a point " ZERO TOLERANCE" to failure. I think we have adopted a patient view and its still being employed after c 10 years.....This club needs a rocket up its **** It is clear what, Watford, Leicester,Crystal Palace,Norwich are doing.....We had a Illfated " get out jail" card when Chelsea,Man city, Man Utd & Arsenal were buying all the best players. The old chesnut was quickly rolled out....."The landscape has changed" we are excluded because we haven't got enough money.....whilst them above just got on with it. The Ron Saunders Model was dismissed as unachievable in this day and age by some.......and yet that is precisely what these former teams mentioned are doing. ( mind you i have never listened to the red herring football has changed, when trying to explain our demise.....of course its changed......AND) Dr P...... I am embarrassed at some of the players poor attempts at times and If I was them I would be working every afternoon on my game to make sure that the fans were proud of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) 56 minutes ago, terrytini said: Surely the debate over the last couple of pages, if it shows nothing else, shows that there are different, equally well thought out, ways we could have tackled the second half at Newcastle. As such it seems a bit daft to knock the Manager, it wasn't clear cut as, for example, Lambert's set up away at Arsenal was, or Sherwood's changes against Leicester. As for the guy saying he's making the same errors as Sherwood, you then just list who YOU think should play. That's really not an argument against who HE chooses to play, is it ? I think too much has been made of Manager errors....for sure they make them, but not to the extent some profess to. The top boys would struggle with this. We have players with good skills, but we are short on the type of players that would thrive in those kind of conditions.....I don't believe we have just one kind of problem we have many, but one for sure, is we have too many players that are lightweight.....You have to have a very special set of skills to negate that, and I don't think we have.Jordan Ayew is showing the kind of form we need to see from about 7-8 players minimum. The players that are doing ok are being worn out with the low graders and there is more of them than the others. For years now we have let go of better players than we have bought/brought in and it is now showing. I would say as a priority, we need some players that are up for a scrap/fight.....not literally of course......Then you might see some effect from Grealish-Traore-Gil. These players have great skills, we just need to give them the platform to display them. Ps Newcastle are not a great example, but the conditions suited their players better, by not having as many lightweight players as us.....bringing on the 3 amigo's would have been catastrophic in those circumstances.....The manager did right.....but moving forward on a good surface, I agree with the argument. Pps maybe going from our low ebb of confidence to wins might be too much right now and on that basis a draw was a good result....in terms of points to stay up i can see the disappointment. Edited December 21, 2015 by TRO 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted December 21, 2015 Moderator Share Posted December 21, 2015 Exactly. You need about 8 highly competent payers and 3 gifted/flair players as the cherry on the cake. At the level (premier league) we're in, we don't have the 8 to allow the 3 to make an impact (I'm not sure we've got the 3 either). Whichever manager we've had, the results have been similar. The squad is not good enough. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 1 hour ago, terrytini said: Surely the debate over the last couple of pages, if it shows nothing else, shows that there are different, equally well thought out, ways we could have tackled the second half at Newcastle. As such it seems a bit daft to knock the Manager, it wasn't clear cut as, for example, Lambert's set up away at Arsenal was, or Sherwood's changes against Leicester. As for the guy saying he's making the same errors as Sherwood, you then just list who YOU think should play. That's really not an argument against who HE chooses to play, is it ? ----Gil--- Traore---Gil---Kozak---Gil Gil---Kozak---Traore Traore----------Gil -------Kozak---------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 team should be for next game and go from there Guzan Hutton Richards Okore Lescott Sanchez Gana Veretout Grealish Gabby Ayew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 21, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 21, 2015 I'm still on a knife edge about Saturday's game. I do see the logic behind making sure we didn't lose at the death at the end. I think people have made some good points in here since I posted about how the further loss of confidence to lose form there again would have been devastating. I just think it was such a good opportunity to win that it's a shame we didn't take it. We were in the ascendancy. And I couldn't help thinking "If this was the other way round and the other team brought on a new attacker to shake things up just when we thought we'd weathered the storm, we'd collapse" I still think it's an opportunity lost. But if we go and win the next two games it won't look half as bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 5 minutes ago, Zatman said: team should be for next game and go from there Guzan Hutton Richards Okore Lescott Sanchez Gana Veretout Grealish Gabby Ayew If Sanchez starts then that is it for me. I'm bringing the bed sheets out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 21, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted December 21, 2015 Just now, rodders0223 said: If Sanchez starts then that is it for me. I'm bringing the bed sheets out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 well West Ham are a big team still and I would prefer as many tall players on pitch as possible against them, why i went with Lescott at full back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 14 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: If Sanchez starts then that is it for me. I'm bringing the bed sheets out. With the performance guaranteed to be a snooze-fest, that doesn't sound like a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 51 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: ----Gil--- Traore---Gil---Kozak---Gil Gil---Kozak---Traore Traore----------Gil -------Kozak---------- Well it is christmas may as well give this formation a try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 3 hours ago, AvfcTheObsession said: I am wondering whether the belief that Remi will do well is partly down to the fact he's a foreign manager who speaks well. I can't help thinking if Pearson had come in and got 3 points from 6 games there would be zero praise. However the current squad isn't up to scratch so he should be given the tools in January to give him the best chance here. If anything, I sometimes wonder whether part of the negative sentiments people are expressing towards him are precisely because he's foreign and is somebody many people here had never heard of before. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 1 hour ago, Mantis said: If anything, I sometimes wonder whether part of the negative sentiments people are expressing towards him are precisely because he's foreign and is somebody many people here had never heard of before. I sometimes wonder whether it is one or the other or both or neither. But then other times I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 1 hour ago, Mantis said: If anything, I sometimes wonder whether part of the negative sentiments people are expressing towards him are precisely because he's foreign and is somebody many people here had never heard of before. I dont rate him because he is foreign and i wanted him to come in but he has done nothing at all to suggest that he knows what he is doing. Attacking or defensive wise we dont have a style of play or any real ideas from the start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfingers Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 1 hour ago, Mantis said: If anything, I sometimes wonder whether part of the negative sentiments people are expressing towards him are precisely because he's foreign and is somebody many people here had never heard of before. It's the same people who express negative thoughts to every manager Sherwood got slaughtered for his gung ho approach & trying to play the game in the opponents half. Garde got slaughtered for not changing things despite the fact that the majority of the 2nd half on Saturday was played in the opponents half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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