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The Rémi Garde thread


KJT123

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Over the last three games we would be 15th in the league in the league. This is two away games, and a home game against a challenger for the title. We created 7 shots on target away from home, against a team who had previously beaten Spurs and Liverpool.

If we were not so far behind, I feel most would be happy with the return, sadly because of our position it isn't good enough. I believe there is an improvement, but it's looking likely it won't be enough. 

I looked at the team before the start of the game yesterday, and I was thinking WTF. I'm not 100% with his team selections, but for me, yesterday was a good result, even if we needed three points. As some as said, I think he could have brought on some fresh legs towards the end of the game. Saying that, if he had, and they would of scored, he would of been slated for that.

Lets just take 9 points from the next three games, and we can all be happy for a short while. :)

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5 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

A concern for me is that for the 3 points we've got we've relied on the opposition missing some absolute sitters. De bruyne, de Jong and the 3/4 Southampton chances are truly terrible misses that don't usually happen. 

I think we've been quite fortunate to get 3 points out of 6 games. 

And yet people still say we are unlucky...

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5 minutes ago, Arj Guy said:

And yet people still say we are unlucky...

Teams miss great chances all the time, its not unique to teams playing us. People have been going on about how Newcastle, Bournemouth, Sunderland and Norwich have been showing the bottle we haven't. Well yes they have showed some fight, but they've all had some huge slices of luck as well.

For example, Newcastle against Liverpool - Benteke missed an open goal from 4 yards out, Newcastle first goal was a huge deflection on a shot that was going wide, and Liverpool were denied a perfect legitimate goal.

Norwich at Man U yesterday, Smalling missed a great chance late on to equalise.

Bournemouth against the baggies- benefited from a sending off, got the winner from a penalty that should have been a free kick outside the box, and West Brom had a couple of great chances as well.

Sunderland - look at their game at Palace, they were shit all game, palace had loads of chances, and then sunderland were gifted a winner.

You could say we have been lucky in our 3 draws, but then could you not argue we were unlucky against Watford? (we missed some great chances and all three goals against were deflections and an own goal that you could say do not usually happen).

We are a poor team, we are pretty much nailed on to go down, but i don't think its fair to denigrate the few hardworking points we actually have managed to get by such overly critical analysis. If you apply it to villas results, do the same for other teams around us - and you will find a similar outcome imo.

 

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8 hours ago, danceoftheshamen said:

I don't think we'll know much about Garde until he gets a proper chance to build his team, that's provided he's allowed to properly do so of course. Draws against City, and away at Saints & Newcastle are decent results in reality if it wasn't for the fact we are 10 points adrift i'd be quite pleased with them. It's our home form which concerns me most however. We are shocking at VP and have been for years. If Garde can somehow make us strong at home then he'll go a long way to solving our problems. It won't be with the current squad however in my opinion.

Midfield needs to be stronger in order to improve the home form.

we have relied on the counter attack for too many years, where you can get away with being so strong in midfield.

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14 minutes ago, andym said:

Teams miss great chances all the time, its not unique to teams playing us. People have been going on about how Newcastle, Bournemouth, Sunderland and Norwich have been showing the bottle we haven't. Well yes they have showed some fight, but they've all had some huge slices of luck as well.

For example, Newcastle against Liverpool - Benteke missed an open goal from 4 yards out, Newcastle first goal was a huge deflection on a shot that was going wide, and Liverpool were denied a perfect legitimate goal.

Norwich at Man U yesterday, Smalling missed a great chance late on to equalise.

Bournemouth against the baggies- benefited from a sending off, got the winner from a penalty that should have been a free kick outside the box, and West Brom had a couple of great chances as well.

Sunderland - look at their game at Palace, they were shit all game, palace had loads of chances, and then sunderland were gifted a winner.

You could say we have been lucky in our 3 draws, but then could you not argue we were unlucky against Watford? (we missed some great chances and all three goals against were deflections and an own goal that you could say do not usually happen).

We are a poor team, we are pretty much nailed on to go down, but i don't think its fair to denigrate the few hardworking points we actually have managed to get by such overly critical analysis. If you apply it to villas results, do the same for other teams around us - and you will find a similar outcome imo.

 

I'm not so sure about that, personally I'm embarrassed by this team and it's 'achievements' this season. Yesterday we saw Norwich do a job on United yet some of us are happy with a point away to an abysmal Newcastle team. 

It's just not good enough, a total farce. 

Edited by Dr_Pangloss
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18 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

I'm not so sure about that, personally I'm embarrassed by this team and it's 'achievements' this season. Yesterday we saw Norwich do a job on United yet some of us are happy with a point away to an abysmal Newcastle team. 

It's just not good enough, a total farce. 

Clearly drawing away at Newcastle is not, in itself, a 'total farce'. In the context of an in-any-case-highly-improbable relegation-avoidance attempt it wasn't helpful, but certainly not 'farcical'. Losing to Bradford over two legs was farcical, drawing away at a team of similar quality to ourselves just isn't. 

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2 hours ago, Butterfingers said:

Man to man marking at corners is pretty straight forward. You cannot blame the manager if a defender fails to keep track of the player that he's supposed to be marking, or that our goalkeeper is not very good.

And yet Sherwood and Lambert got the blame for the exact same mistakes of the players.

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7 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said:

And yet Sherwood and Lambert got the blame for the exact same mistakes of the players.

Not from me they didn't but I'll take your word that they did. Either way, Garde cannot be blamed because a man of Lescotts experience lost his man or that Guzan couldn't catch a cold.

 

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33 minutes ago, Dr_Pangloss said:

I'm not so sure about that, personally I'm embarrassed by this team and it's 'achievements' this season. Yesterday we saw Norwich do a job on United yet some of us are happy with a point away to an abysmal Newcastle team. 

It's just not good enough, a total farce. 

I think there is a danger your stance could be dismissed out of hand and that we have to improve in baby steps....little bits of encouragement are all very fine and sensible and balanced views are usually the most listened too.....but a few hard, cold retorts may be useful too.

However, I think in terms of creating some fight in this team....you may have a point " ZERO TOLERANCE" to failure.

I think we have adopted a patient view and its still being employed after c 10 years.....This club needs a rocket up its ****

It is clear what, Watford, Leicester,Crystal Palace,Norwich are doing.....We had a Illfated " get out jail" card when Chelsea,Man city, Man Utd & Arsenal were buying all the best players. The old chesnut was quickly rolled out....."The landscape has changed"  we are excluded because we haven't got enough money.....whilst them above just got on with it.

The Ron Saunders Model was dismissed as unachievable in this day and age by some.......and yet that is precisely what these former teams mentioned are doing.

( mind you i have never listened to the red herring football has changed, when trying to explain our demise.....of course its changed......AND)

Dr P...... I am embarrassed at some of the players poor attempts at times and If I was them I would be working every afternoon on my game to make sure that the fans were proud of me.

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15 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think there is a danger your stance could be dismissed out of hand and that we have to improve in baby steps....little bits of encouragement are all very fine and sensible and balanced views are usually the most listened too.....but a few hard, cold retorts may be useful too.

However, I think in terms of creating some fight in this team....you may have a point " ZERO TOLERANCE" to failure.

I think we have adopted a patient view and its still being employed after c 10 years.....This club needs a rocket up its ****

It is clear what, Watford, Leicester,Crystal Palace,Norwich are doing.....We had a Illfated " get out jail" card when Chelsea,Man city, Man Utd & Arsenal were buying all the best players. The old chesnut was quickly rolled out....."The landscape has changed"  we are excluded because we haven't got enough money.....whilst them above just got on with it.

The Ron Saunders Model was dismissed as unachievable in this day and age by some.......and yet that is precisely what these former teams mentioned are doing.

( mind you i have never listened to the red herring football has changed, when trying to explain our demise.....of course its changed......AND)

Dr P...... I am embarrassed at some of the players poor attempts at times and If I was them I would be working every afternoon on my game to make sure that the fans were proud of me.

Very salient points. 

What you see with the likes of Watford Leicester and Palace are squads full of average players for the most part, but what these average players do is work very hard, leave it all on the pitch and demonstrate a fair amount of concentration on the pitch. They play with aggression and desire, they make themselves hard to beat.

We on the other hand are a dream to play against because we're not aggressive and we do not work hard, we also gift the opposition goals through brainless play. 

Where I'm still uncertain is whether we just simply have an unprecedented collection of brainless and lazy footballers, or whether we have had successive management teams who have been unable to genuinely get inside these players heads and get them to work hard. My hunch is that it's combination, recruitment of players has been poor and has lead to the wrong characters being brought in, but I also think that the recruitment of managers has been poor, managers who don't have a huge amount of tactical nouse and ability to really get the players wanting to burst a gut for cause, and so far I have to include Garde in that bracket. 

Until I see us starting games with genuine aggression and ambition I just can't give Garde any credit for doing anything different than Sherwood. We only play well when we're losing. It would be nice to see us attacking teams like we did yesterday in the second half, without being a goal down in the process.

Edited by Dr_Pangloss
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4 hours ago, lexicon said:

Echoes of Houllier here. Small incremental change that some either don't want to see or can't and as a result are criticising the manager. 

There's definitely something there and this is the right direction for the club IMO - it's long term, granted, and it might take a relegation for it to come together but I'd take that for a modern style of football. You can keep your brash rocket polisher banter merchants, we need a bit of continental style to drag us into the 21st century.

Sound, drop us a PM when it starts!

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3 hours ago, villianusa said:

Over the last three games we would be 15th in the league in the league.

Just out of interest, what is the basis either in statistics, logic (or preferably both) for making any sort of comparison based on the last three games?

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The decision to only use 1 substitution yesterday even thou we were playing on a waterlogged heavy pitch with many of the players clearly exhausted was baffling.

Don't know if he was making a point towards some of the players on the bench or what his reasons was? 

We had Newcastle on the ropes for a spell during the second half and he squandered that chance by not bringing in fresh legs.

Very strange...

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7 minutes ago, sne said:

The decision to only use 1 substitution yesterday even thou we were playing on a waterlogged heavy pitch with many of the players clearly exhausted was baffling.

Don't know if he was making a point towards some of the players on the bench or what his reasons was? 

We had Newcastle on the ropes for a spell during the second half and he squandered that chance by not bringing in fresh legs.

Very strange...

Personnel , adama , gil and grealish on the bench none off them suited to the physicality of yesterdays game in my opinion

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3 minutes ago, sne said:

The decision to only use 1 substitution yesterday even thou we were playing on a waterlogged heavy pitch with many of the players clearly exhausted was baffling.

Don't know if he was making a point towards some of the players on the bench or what his reasons was? 

We had Newcastle on the ropes for a spell during the second half and he squandered that chance by not bringing in fresh legs.

Very strange...

I don't think he had midfield legs on the bench to replace any of the four who started, and the conditions weren't right for the likes of Grealish, Traore or Gil to come on and make a difference.  I guess Gil for Veretout was the best option but the latter is obviously the set piece taker and with Gestede on that was our most likely source of a winner. 

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58 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

I don't think he had midfield legs on the bench to replace any of the four who started, and the conditions weren't right for the likes of Grealish, Traore or Gil to come on and make a difference.  I guess Gil for Veretout was the best option but the latter is obviously the set piece taker and with Gestede on that was our most likely source of a winner.

You say that as if they've never played in the rain,im pretty sure the conditions were the same for both teams.

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1 hour ago, briny_ear said:

Just out of interest, what is the basis either in statistics, logic (or preferably both) for making any sort of comparison based on the last three games?

To show that on recent form we aren't the worse team in the league, showing that there has been some improvement lately. We have been ranked bottom for a while when it comes to point won, so in my opinion it shows Garde is improving things slowly. This is related to points not performance, because we are still awful to watch.

Not enough to save us from relegation, but improvement no the less.

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