hippo Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 1 minute ago, blandy said: More than "some" IMO. The system we have of strong tribal adversarialism is disadvantageous. The FPTP voting system gives disproportionate power compared to "the will of the people". The Political party is given higher priority than the wellbeing of the nation. Patronage for donations, the second chamber stacked with cronies and massively too large...I could go on. Need to keep the BBC + Channel 4 - privatising those is a real threat to our democracy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Davkaus said: Cameron gets off too easy, for kicking off the last 7 years of a shitshow to settle a small backbench rebellion, then **** off into the sunset, whistling, for some other word removed to pick up the pieces. It was an absolute failure of leadership that initiated everything that came afterwards. Yeah, don’t get me wrong he wasn’t great, but look at the other 2. It was a lot more than a small backbench rebellion though. He was backed into a corner on the EU and his biggest crime was not educating people what the benefits of EU membership were. The remain campaign being so shit was on him. Still better than May and Johnson though. Edited July 7, 2022 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ingram85 Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 They should blow up Eton. That place has done more damage to this country then any other. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 13 minutes ago, hippo said: Still May 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted July 7, 2022 Author Moderator Share Posted July 7, 2022 Just now, Mandy Lifeboats said: the UK Government acting in a democratic way Give over! It was the conservative party acting in a self preserving way. The democracy argument is flawed, IMO, because they did not act because of the perceived benefits of the country of the actions, but because of the perceived harm to the Tory party's chances and their own, if they didn't act.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam-AVFC Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 I don't know the price of milk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Lifeboats Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 1 minute ago, blandy said: More than "some" IMO. The system we have of strong tribal adversarialism is disadvantageous. The FPTP voting system gives disproportionate power compared to "the will of the people". The Political party is given higher priority than the wellbeing of the nation. Patronage for donations, the second chamber stacked with cronies and massively too large...I could go on. We could debate this forever and I don't intend to. I am not saying that out system is perfect. I am not saying that it can't be improved. The only thing I disagree with in your post is that FPTP is a bad thing. But you have to acknowledge that Bozo was ousted by his own party and the UK Government in a peaceful and democratic way. No-one died. No-one has fled to Poland in fear of their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 7, 2022 Moderator Share Posted July 7, 2022 5 minutes ago, Genie said: He was backed into a corner on the EU No he wasn't. The Party was worried about the threat from Farage and the ERG. There were plenty of other ways to solve the problem 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 35 minutes ago, cyrusr said: "I've gone because I was forced to, not because I thought it was the right to do" Absolutely not sorry for anything, he has only ever been sorry he has been caught. "Them the breaks" - yeah because you are utterly incompetent and you have no further use to the Tories. F*** off. Yep, ‘exit’ speech very much in line with every other speech he’s ever given on any topic which is to say that’s it’s entirely based on lies, bullshit and an extraordinary lack of self awareness. The fat fk can’t get out of there quickly enough for me, absolute travesty of a human being. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuart_75 Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Carrie will be busy with the wallpaper steamer this afternoon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 1 minute ago, bickster said: No he wasn't. The Party was worried about the threat from Farage and the ERG. So he was backed into a corner then and needed to act Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandy Lifeboats Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 4 minutes ago, blandy said: Give over! It was the conservative party acting in a self preserving way. The democracy argument is flawed, IMO, because they did not act because of the perceived benefits of the country of the actions, but because of the perceived harm to the Tory party's chances and their own, if they didn't act.. 100% Correct. It was the Conservative Party acting a self preserving way because the democratic process ultimately worked. Democracy forced them to act. But all those resignations were from the Government. None resigned from the Conservative Party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 7, 2022 Moderator Share Posted July 7, 2022 Just now, Genie said: So he was backed into a corner then and needed to act No he wasn't backed into any corner. Boris was backed into a corner, Cameron was not, he had plenty of different options he just came up with a f***ing stupid one, that he actually thought he'd win easily 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicho Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 30 minutes ago, Wainy316 said: He's given himself 2 months to try and find a way round this and he is definitely going to try. I actually want to see this, backed by MPs who still support him against the rest. Him holding on, others selecting a new leader and him telling them to sodd off essentially becoming a dictator is nightmare stuff. But the kind of damage that needs to happen to the conservative ideal and ethos for it to take a very long time to recover. Or on the other hand people applaud Boris for it as they love him no matter what and we fall further into the abyss. Can this country handle some really catatrophic short term political horror to improve. Probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Just now, bickster said: No he wasn't backed into any corner. Boris was backed into a corner, Cameron was not, he had plenty of different options he just came up with a f***ing stupid one, that he actually thought he'd win easily David Cameron had to do something he didn’t want to do (address the issue of the perceived EU control over the UK). That’s being backed into a corner. He couldn’t do nothing. Whether he chose the wrong course of action is another matter. Tbh, I don’t think offering a referendum was wrong. The major error was assuming remain would comfortably win and therefore not making much effort to sell the remain vote. That’s what sent us on this 7 years of shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troglodyte Posted July 7, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted July 7, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Nicho said: Can this country handle some really catatrophic short term political horror to improve. Edited July 7, 2022 by Troglodyte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Interesting times we live in. Sunak in next please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, Risso said: Interesting times we live in. Sunak in next please. I just don't think he has it. Looks a bit lightweight to me. Reminds me of George Osborne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Just now, hippo said: I just don't think he has it. Looks a bit lightweight to me. Well, he is only 4'9". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparrow1988 Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 17 minutes ago, stuart_75 said: Carrie will be busy with the wallpaper steamer this afternoon. She'll be busy going through potential candidates so she knows which one to get down on her knees in front of next so that she can keep living there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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