Isa Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Triple post Edited October 22, 2015 by Isa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 He would have loaned Grealish to Forest in January if he had his way but I'm not bothered to get into it anyway. Full league debut and first real run in the team came under Sherwood therefore he gets the credit for blooding him. Not a chance does he in my book Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 With Villa doing a Villa alphabet, I thought I'd do one for Sherwood:A - Arrogant B - Bored (by his own team)C - CharlatanD - Delusions of grandeur.E - Easily outwittedF - G - Gilet.HI -J - K - Kozak, his mortal enemy (apparently).L - Losers. As in everyone else and not him, apparently. M - Media. The only people talking him up right now. NO - Out of his depth.P - Pragmatic. QR - Responsibility (lol)S - Substitutions (lol)T - Tactics. (lol)UVW - Westwood. His untouchable prince of set pieces. XYZ - Zero clue about what he's doing. Got to go back to work, feel free to add your own or finish it off. F= FA Cup a tournament he got us to the finalJ= Jack who he trusted with a debutGrealish's debut was under Lambert. Sorry, 'G' is already taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 22, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2015 I think he gets credit for improving Jack's performances.I don't think he gets credit for "blooding" him. Lambert was using Grealish, he just wasn't performing. That is Lambert's fault, but I have never bought this idea that lambert wasn't playing Grealish. He was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 To be competitive in this league. To survive even. The vast majority of those players have so far shown that they're not up to it.West Brom are currently outside the relegation zone are very likely to survive this season. Their team in the last game, which they won, was Myhill / Dawson / McAuley / Evans / Brunt / Sessegnon / Fletcher / Yacob / McClean / Rondon / Berahino. I don't honestly believe our players are far worse, or that it's absolutely impossible to manage Villa into some better results. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Full league debut and first real run in the team came under Sherwood therefore he gets the credit for blooding him. It think that is fair. Pre Sherwood he had started two cup games against lower league opposition and had never started a league game and had only played one full half in the Premier league as the rest was the odd 5 to 25 mins here and there. After Sherwood arrived he eventually started the last 9 games all against top flight opposition in either the league or cup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Where the hell are these Monk rumours coming from? I certainly dont want him taking over from Sherwood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Full league debut and first real run in the team came under Sherwood therefore he gets the credit for blooding him. It think that is fair. Pre Sherwood he had started two cup games against lower league opposition and had never started a league game and had only played one full half in the Premier league as the rest was the odd 5 to 25 mins here and there. After Sherwood arrived he eventually started the last 9 games all against top flight opposition in either the league or cup. I also think Lambert had no faith in him and feel he only played him to appease the fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Lambert was playing Grealish for the last 10 minutes of matches for the main. Grealish performed in a few of those games and still didn't get more of a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 22, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2015 Full league debut and first real run in the team came under Sherwood therefore he gets the credit for blooding him. It think that is fair. Pre Sherwood he had started two cup games against lower league opposition and had never started a league game and had only played one full half in the Premier league as the rest was the odd 5 to 25 mins here and there. After Sherwood arrived he eventually started the last 9 games all against top flight opposition in either the league or cup. I also think Lambert had no faith in him and feel he only played him to appease the fansThat's complete conjecture though.Under Lambert he didn't perform. He never looked any good when he played.Again, I'm not saying that's not Lambert's fault. His performances clearly picked up when Sherwood came in.But this idea that lambert didn't want to play him is just wrong, imo. He did want to play him. The problem was he couldn't get him to look anything other than average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 22, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2015 Lambert was playing Grealish for the last 10 minutes of matches for the main. Grealish performed in a few of those games and still didn't get more of a chance.That's not true on both counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Grealish got the bulk of his substitute appearences prior to his renewal also, which was probably to lull him into agreeing to it. In Lambert's final couple of months he didn't play at all bar the one game in the cup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 To be competitive in this league. To survive even. The vast majority of those players have so far shown that they're not up to it.West Brom are currently outside the relegation zone are very likely to survive this season. Their team in the last game, which they won, was Myhill / Dawson / McAuley / Evans / Brunt / Sessegnon / Fletcher / Yacob / McClean / Rondon / Berahino. I don't honestly believe our players are far worse, or that it's absolutely impossible to manage Villa into some better results. I agree with this. There are some poor teams around and we are certainly no worse than Norwich, West Brom, Sunderland, Watford, Bournemouth and I'd argue on paper Leicester are no better than us. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I don't know if you can give him massive credit for it as surely anyone would have done the same, but Sherwood is responsible for giving Grealish his starting role. Maybe it was because he was ready, but then again he got to manage Benteke 'at the right time so was lucky' etc etc. I'm not a Sherwood fan but i'm not going to snatch away the small wins he has managed as manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 It isn't just about buying cheap.It's buying players who are outstanding in one attribute which is why they're not expensive and training up their other attributes to make them more complete.It isn't just hoping that a cheap player will come good. It's heavily scouted.An example would be Amavi, You'd look at his tackles and interceptions; assume he has those attributes because he has the ability to be a complete defender, you train up the attributes he's lacking in and you get a complete player. The alternative would be to target a more complete, polished player but the price will obviously be higher.I think it needs to be acknowledged that the reason the Oakland A's had to shop in the cheaper end of the market was because they had one of the lowest budgets in MLB. Their annual budget of $40 million was the 3rd lowest in the league whilst the New York Yankees had the highest budget at $140 million.Finding value in players who were overlooked because of outdated scouting methods was essentially the approach taken. Nothing about re-sale value but simply about buying runs instead of buying players and placing an emphasis on looking at stats that weren't looked at by other teams.Eventually teams with bigger budgets cottoned onto what the Oakland A's were doing and adopted a similar strategy but with far higher budgets and essentially destroyed the approach that the A's had because once again the playing field was no longer equal.Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Lambert was playing Grealish for the last 10 minutes of matches for the main. Grealish performed in a few of those games and still didn't get more of a chance.That's not true on both counts.Here is Jack's minutes against all teams last year. Whilst 10 minutes may be hyperbole on my part he still didn't really get that much of a chance under Lambert. The last 20 minute of matches for the main and no starts in the PL. 24-05-15Aston Villa0 - 1Burnley9016-05-15Southampton6 - 1Aston Villa8209-05-15Aston Villa1 - 0West Ham United9002-05-15Aston Villa3 - 2Everton9025-04-15Manchester City3 - 2Aston Villa9011-04-15Tottenham Hotspur0 - 1Aston Villa6307-04-15Aston Villa3 - 3Queens Park Rangers7003-03-15Aston Villa2 - 1West Bromwich Albion3101-01-15Aston Villa0 - 0Crystal Palace2628-12-14Aston Villa0 - 0Sunderland2226-12-14Swansea City1 - 0Aston Villa1307-12-14Aston Villa2 - 1Leicester City2829-11-14Burnley1 - 1Aston Villa2304-10-14Aston Villa0 - 2Manchester City1920-09-14Aston Villa0 - 3Arsenal4431-08-14Aston Villa2 - 1Hull City1516-08-14Stoke City0 - 1Aston Villa19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Young player in "continually playing in more games before becoming a regular" shocker. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) To be competitive in this league. To survive even. The vast majority of those players have so far shown that they're not up to it.West Brom are currently outside the relegation zone are very likely to survive this season. Their team in the last game, which they won, was Myhill / Dawson / McAuley / Evans / Brunt / Sessegnon / Fletcher / Yacob / McClean / Rondon / Berahino. I don't honestly believe our players are far worse, or that it's absolutely impossible to manage Villa into some better results. it depends what is specifically meant by our players are not worse......technically, I think we are better....but the Albion players are far more premier league savvy.....it takes time and much work on the training ground to improve that.....we have had too many players who are not only young and still learning their trade, but new to a league too.....one or two will blend in, we have too many all at once.we play some good football at times, but the TEAM is too light in its approach, we are like a pretty flower Been broken in the wind.....we are not durable enough and not mentally strong. Edited October 22, 2015 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Young player in "continually playing in more games before becoming a regular" shocker.I would normally agree but last season we couldnt buy a goal for the 1st 6 months and manager consistently played Weimann and Gabby without giving Jack a start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted October 22, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Lambert was playing Grealish for the last 10 minutes of matches for the main. Grealish performed in a few of those games and still didn't get more of a chance.That's not true on both counts. Here is Jack's minutes against all teams last year. Whilst 10 minutes may be hyperbole on my part he still didn't really get that much of a chance under Lambert. The last 20 minute of matches for the main and no starts in the PL. 24-05-15Aston Villa0 - 1Burnley9016-05-15Southampton6 - 1Aston Villa8209-05-15Aston Villa1 - 0West Ham United9002-05-15Aston Villa3 - 2Everton9025-04-15Manchester City3 - 2Aston Villa9011-04-15Tottenham Hotspur0 - 1Aston Villa6307-04-15Aston Villa3 - 3Queens Park Rangers7003-03-15Aston Villa2 - 1West Bromwich Albion3101-01-15Aston Villa0 - 0Crystal Palace2628-12-14Aston Villa0 - 0Sunderland2226-12-14Swansea City1 - 0Aston Villa1307-12-14Aston Villa2 - 1Leicester City2829-11-14Burnley1 - 1Aston Villa2304-10-14Aston Villa0 - 2Manchester City1920-09-14Aston Villa0 - 3Arsenal4431-08-14Aston Villa2 - 1Hull City1516-08-14Stoke City0 - 1Aston Villa19Well exactly.But the main point is he didn't perform. He got plenty of minutes under Lambert but even in our team he never looked like he should be starting.Sherwood didn't start him straight away either.Jack got his chance when his performances demanded it. Sherwood gets credit for getting those performances out of him. But it wasn't a case that Lambert wasn't playing him. Edited October 22, 2015 by Stevo985 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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