Popular Post sexbelowsound Posted February 23, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted February 23, 2015 Unfortunately even if we do stay up i fear the cycle of piss poor funding from the owner and relegation scraps are likely to continue. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eames Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Even working on us needing 36 points, thats still 14 more needed. We're 3 points adrift now so those closest to us need 11 to get there? Minimum we need is 5 wins for 37 points and I can't pick 5 winning games from the remaining fixtures. We've been dog shit since October and we deserve whats coming unless Sherwood has got something magical planned. We're adrift on goal difference! The minimum required to stay up is that we gain a point more than Burnley, QPR and Leicester do between now and the end of the season. Harbingers of doom relax! Having score just about half the goals everyone else has. Goal difference won't save us. It is really tight from 12th down, one win puts us on the same number as Everton, but there is plenty to be worried about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam3773 Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 I'm still optimistic. I think there are worse teams than us out there, when we're in good shape. The players are there, and have enough to get us out, but I think we're into mentality grounds now. Tim needs to work on making the players hungry and giving them that belief that they can stay up. For me, a lot of it is going to be next week. We face a Newcastle side that have been tripped up by lower teams, have taken a battering. The current backroom have only been there a week or so. I think this weekend will be very telling as to what we can hope for in the remaining games. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villastine Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Even working on us needing 36 points, thats still 14 more needed. We're 3 points adrift now so those closest to us need 11 to get there? Minimum we need is 5 wins for 37 points and I can't pick 5 winning games from the remaining fixtures. We've been dog shit since October and we deserve whats coming unless Sherwood has got something magical planned. We're adrift on goal difference! The minimum required to stay up is that we gain a point more than Burnley, QPR and Leicester do between now and the end of the season. Harbingers of doom relax! Having score just about half the goals everyone else has. Goal difference won't save us. It is really tight from 12th down, one win puts us on the same number as Everton, but there is plenty to be worried about. Hence I said a point more, which would put us ahead on points. Goal differnce would not come into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Unfortunately even if we do stay up i fear the cycle of piss poor funding from the owner and relegation scraps are likely to continue. At least in that scenario we can at least hope for a decent takeover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) That's the bit that worries me. Yes Sherwood has time to turn it around, but I was really hoping, as we all were, for that "bounce" to kickstart the players. And it really didn't seem to be the case. Like you say we started well. Went a goal up and then I think went into old habits of sitting back too much. Then the kick in the balls just before half time and the confidence seemed to drain. I think you also have to take the crowd into consideration here. The atmosphere certainly after Stoke scored was very edgy and I felt it did transmit itself onto the pitch. I therefore think playing away in the next game could well be beneficial in that regard. Add that to the fact Sherwood and his staff will have had a full week with the players and I am hopeful that we can get a result to build from be it a draw or a win. I don’t think the time for new manager bounce has passed but I do think it is a small window and we need a win in the next couple of games. Otherwise Sherwood will become associated with negative results and the players and supporters will start to believe that the change won’t have the positive impact we’d all hoped it would. For now though I am in a relatively positive frame of mind and still believe we can turn things around and do enough to stay up. After we lost to Hull I didn’t feel that there was any hope of staying up under Lambert. Now despite another defeat since then I at least feel that we have a chance. I said it yesterday that I also feel the supporters have a big part to play in our chances of survival. The first part of that is at least to give the new manager a fair chance before beginning to write off his chances of turning around the total mess he inherited. The hangover from Lamberts time was still felt with in the ground on Saturday. I do hope come the West Brom game a similar atmosphere to what was created in recent seasons against Sunderland and QPR when the chips were down can be created and we can play our part alongside the new manager in lifting these players. Edited February 23, 2015 by markavfc40 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 He's got to pick a team and a formation and , in the main, stick with it. They players have to have the confidence that not much will change in terms of that and he has to have that stability to work with, not changing tactics / multiple players regularly. He has to make sure it supports our best striker and he has to make sure Benteke knows that and can work with it In terms of back 5 I think its pretty clear on that --------------------------Guzan Hutton------Okore--------------Clark ------------Cissohko (I'd stick with him but I think he'll change it either way its pretty stable) It's the front 6 that is debate and personally I'd go -----------Westwood-------------Delph Bacuna-------------------------------------Sinclair <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Gil>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------Benteke I would go with that to be honest. Gabby just isnt good enough to start so him and Weimann can battle it out on the bench along with Cleverley and Sanchez. Benteke got some stick on saturday but to be honest he did what was asked of him as a targetman, trouble was he got nothing back after the lay-off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 23, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2015 Just read The Guardian's write up and think it's pretty much spot on. Focuses on our weaknesses as a 4-4-2 Aston Villa left exposed as Tim Sherwood opens up against Stoke City Rudyard Kipling did not need his Uefa Pro Licence to know that a manager cannot afford to get too up or down after meeting with triumph and disaster so it was disarming to hear Tim Sherwood agree that losing at home to Stoke City was as low as he had felt in football. While the new Aston Villa manager’s honesty is endearing, it is unconventional. A most upbeat first week in the job had led to a conviction that three points from his first game would be a formality but, as the 19th-century poet forewarned, Sherwood needs to “start again at your beginnings” in training on Monday after this setback. Asked if, in the context of his pride in taking charge of Villa, this was one of the lowest moments of his football career, the former Tottenham Hotspur manager said: “Yeah, it’s low. I’m low tonight.” As well as realigning his emotions over the weekend, it is to be hoped that Sherwood brings a gameplan to Bodymoor Heath this week in preparation for the forthcoming games with Newcastle United and West Bromwich Albion that could shape his managerial future and Villa’s Premier League fate. No one should be judged on one game, of course, but as Stoke recovered from going behind to Scott Sinclair’s fine header to win with goals in stoppage time at the end of each half from Mame Biram Diouf and, from the penalty that brought Ron Vlaar his second yellow card, Victor Moses, there were disturbing signs that Villa may be throwing the baby out with the bathwater in replacing Paul Lambert’s stodgy approach with Sherwood’s free-wheeling. Villa have changed from a mediocre long-ball team to a mediocre short-passing team over the past two years. On Saturday, they looked neither. Dispensing with the third central midfielder left Fabian Delph and Carlos Sánchez exposed by third-man runs and neat passing triangles. In trying to liberate his players from the shackles of cautious ball retention, some took that as an excuse to kick the ball back in the vague direction of Christian Benteke even when under no pressure. In the midst of this mess lies a reasonable group of players quite capable of staying up. But confidence after four years of struggle and six successive league defeats is shot. Sherwood needs to implement his own messages quickly and clearly or the mixing of styles will lead to relegation. Reverting to 4-4-2 all felt a bit 1980s; it’s not as if Sherwood has Christian Eriksen drifting in from the left side to impose international-class guile to proceedings. “I want them to play a bit more relaxed in the final third and go and get on the ball and go and express themselves a little bit more,” the manager said. Villa played with higher tempo and enthusiasm, epitomised by Sinclair’s contribution, but this needs coupling with football intelligence. If only. Man of the match Steven N’Zonzi (Stoke City) 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 I was absolutely devastated on Saturday. Not so much at the result, there was always a good chance we might lose. I think it was more to with it being almost like a microcosm of life as a Villa fan in general. The first 20 minutes or so were really promising. It was great to see us on the front foot, geed up by the support and taking the game to Stoke. After we scored I think Stoke tightened up to great effect and the game could we have petered out all the way from there. That goal just before half time was a sucker punch and from then we looked as deflated as ever. He couldn't pick them up at half time. I didn't agree with bringing Weimann on but don't think he was as bad as some have made out. I thought Sanchez looked isolated by the formation but he didn't help himself either (and neither did Delph help him). I am concerned that these players are just too far gone, mentally and physically they look shattered. I don't think they have the fight in them, no matter who the manager or what the tactics. Then the final blow, gut wrenching. I almost broke the **** seat I was that angry, I can only hope the players felt the same. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marka Ragnos Posted February 23, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2015 Unfortunately even if we do stay up i fear the cycle of piss poor funding from the owner and relegation scraps are likely to continue. Yeesh ... sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villarocker Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 There are four specific matches that Sherwood has to target as must wins - WBA at home, Sunderland away, QPR at home, Burnley at home. Win those four games and the rest will take care of itself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marka Ragnos Posted February 23, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23, 2015 I am concerned that these players are just too far gone, mentally and physically they look shattered. I don't think they have the fight in them, no matter who the manager or what the tactics. "Fight in them." It's an interesting concept, but if you're talking strictly psychology, I actually think the players are still accessible to the influence of good coaching. No "fight" would suggest they're beyond that. I've said for a while that I think Tekkers actually does have some kind of psychological block, but other than him, I don't know. It seemed to me that the players were fighting pretty fudging hard against Stoke but Sherwood was still hoping against hope for Benteke to come to life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimzk5 Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Reflecting back on saturday has made me even more certain that we will struggle to win the games required to stop up, that defeat I fear could be the defining result of why we go down. Stating the obvious but we need a massive turn around in results, with just 12 games left we need to win nearly half those to be certain, winning a third of those games will possibly bd enough also, but as we saw Saturday, the confidence of the players is non existent and I don't think Sherwood will have the time to make it happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 I've just looked at the respective fixtures of us, QPR and Burnley and I'd take ours for sure. Thing is, as things are it almost doesn't matter who we play, it's hard to see us picking up a result against anyone. I didn't see the game on Saturday thank goodness, so I can't apportion blame to him or otherwise, but I hope Sherwood ditches the 442, it really doesn't suit our players. Unfortunately I think he's a bit of an amateur. We have to get a win from somewhere, and fast. Beat Newcastle on Saturday and the whole complexion looks very different. It's difficult to see that happening though. One thing I will say is that if Sherwood turns it round from here he deserves every accolade going. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Stevo985 Posted February 23, 2015 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) 4 wins and we'll be safe I reckon Edit: worth saying that I'm not very confident that we'll get 4 wins! Edited February 23, 2015 by Stevo985 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 I am concerned that these players are just too far gone, mentally and physically they look shattered. I don't think they have the fight in them, no matter who the manager or what the tactics. "Fight in them." It's an interesting concept, but if you're talking strictly psychology, I actually think the players are still accessible to the influence of good coaching. No "fight" would suggest they're beyond that. I've said for a while that I think Tekkers actually does have some kind of psychological block, but other than him, I don't know. It seemed to me that the players were fighting pretty fudging hard against Stoke but Sherwood was still hoping against hope for Benteke to come to life. I thought they fought pretty hard - you could almost 'get it forward' ringing in their ears - It was the technique of getting it forward that they seemed to struggle with. Like I say points available v points required its still very do able - but its going to take some turnaround - if it happens it will be a great escape style of thing - right now I would bite your arm off if we got to Burnley at home needing a win to stay up.....performances wise it looks ropey to me... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Even working on us needing 36 points, thats still 14 more needed. We're 3 points adrift now so those closest to us need 11 to get there? Minimum we need is 5 wins for 37 points and I can't pick 5 winning games from the remaining fixtures. We've been dog shit since October and we deserve whats coming unless Sherwood has got something magical planned. We're adrift on goal difference! The minimum required to stay up is that we gain a point more than Burnley, QPR and Leicester do between now and the end of the season. Harbingers of doom relax! Having score just about half the goals everyone else has. Goal difference won't save us. It is really tight from 12th down, one win puts us on the same number as Everton, but there is plenty to be worried about. Yippee, Villa get 6 points for a win. We are bound to stay up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Even working on us needing 36 points, thats still 14 more needed. We're 3 points adrift now so those closest to us need 11 to get there? Minimum we need is 5 wins for 37 points and I can't pick 5 winning games from the remaining fixtures. We've been dog shit since October and we deserve whats coming unless Sherwood has got something magical planned. We're adrift on goal difference! The minimum required to stay up is that we gain a point more than Burnley, QPR and Leicester do between now and the end of the season. Harbingers of doom relax! Having score just about half the goals everyone else has. Goal difference won't save us. It is really tight from 12th down, one win puts us on the same number as Everton, but there is plenty to be worried about. Yippee, Villa get 6 points for a win. We are bound to stay up. I don't even think that would save us..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 I am concerned that these players are just too far gone, mentally and physically they look shattered. I don't think they have the fight in them, no matter who the manager or what the tactics. "Fight in them." It's an interesting concept, but if you're talking strictly psychology, I actually think the players are still accessible to the influence of good coaching. No "fight" would suggest they're beyond that. I've said for a while that I think Tekkers actually does have some kind of psychological block, but other than him, I don't know. It seemed to me that the players were fighting pretty fudging hard against Stoke but Sherwood was still hoping against hope for Benteke to come to life. I thought they fought pretty hard - you could almost 'get it forward' ringing in their ears - It was the technique of getting it forward that they seemed to struggle with. Like I say points available v points required its still very do able - but its going to take some turnaround - if it happens it will be a great escape style of thing - right now I would bite your arm off if we got to Burnley at home needing a win to stay up.....performances wise it looks ropey to me... Agree with both of you, I'm not sure I explained myself particularly well. I think that whilst I am sure they are giving it 100% I think that they are too physically and mentally broken for that to have enough of an effect. Basically, I am worried that their valiant effort is going to go unrewarded because they simply no longer have the legs or the mental capacity for it. They are playing afraid right now, understandably. That said, all it will take is one win and maybe the bounce will return to their step. Saturday can't come soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 4 wins and we'll be safe I reckon Edit: worth saying that I'm not very confident that we'll get 4 wins! 4 wins and 2 draws. 3 wins and 5 draws. Basically 36 points. IMO. I've got this horrible feeling we left it 1 game too late. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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