The Randy Lerner thread

[tarjei]

Try the link, much better

[dounavilla]

Good peice

[NurembergVillan]

Reads like a summary of this thread really.

The Sporting Director was my idea

[briny_ear]

Reads like a summary of this thread really.

The Sporting Director was my idea

According to the article, the Baggies got there first!

[NurembergVillan]

I was advisor at the time.

[VillaAndLoyal]

Brilliant article which sums up perfectly the fact that Lerner has been taking this club down from the minute he stepped foot in this place with his desperate lack of sporting knowledge and business acumen.

[MikeMcKenna]

This is a "blog"and there is as absolutely nothing that is new and lots of people I know

could have produced this article.

I know why, who and when? All I want to know now is what happens Now?

[MikeMcKenna]

Brilliant article which sums up perfectly the fact that Lerner has been taking this club down from the minute he stepped foot in this place with his desperate lack of sporting knowledge and business acumen.

Disagree it's. shit article which many of us could have dine

[dounavilla]

^ not with spelling like that !

[LondonLax]

It was May 2010 and Randy Lerner was holding court in the Holte pub, a landmark building that Aston Villa's benevolent owner had spent £4m restoring in an early demonstration of his generosity. Villa had finished sixth for a third successive season and there was a feeling that, with Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester City emerging as major players, the Midlands club had hit a glass ceiling. Lerner, however, disagreed. "I'm not so sure the game's over yet in terms of us catching up or doing better," he said.

That was the last time Lerner gave a press conference at Villa. His words have a hollow ring to them now. These days Villa are closer to the Championship than the Champions League. They flirted with relegation in 2010-11, under Gérard Houllier, finished only two points above the bottom three last year, during Alex McLeish's miserable tenure, and face a major battle to retain their Premier League status in Paul Lambert's first season in charge, which started full of optimism but has turned into little short of a disaster.

Villa, who make the short trip to West Bromwich Albion on Saturday, are third bottom in the Premier League and, to put it bluntly, playing relegation football. Only Queens Park Rangers have scored so few goals (17) and only Reading have conceded as many (42). Perhaps most damningly of all, Villa have picked up only 30 points from their past 38 games, which is one point fewer than QPR, who went 16 games without winning at the start of this season, and 13 points fewer than any other Premier League club.The Capital One Cup, which promised to deliver some much-needed good news when Villa were drawn to face League Two Bradford City in the semi-final, threatens to bring further ignominy if Lambert's players are unable to overturn the humiliating 3-1 defeat they suffered at Valley Parade in the first leg. The second leg takes place at Villa Park on Tuesday and is followed by an awkward fourth-round FA Cup tie at Millwall on Friday night and a crucial Premier League home game against fellow strugglers Newcastle four days later. It looks like being a season-defining period, especially with the transfer window open and Villa in dire need of new players to inject fresh life into a callow and struggling team.

All clubs go through peaks and troughs but Villa's sharp decline over the past few years feels more alarming because of the huge amount of money Lerner has pumped in during his six-year reign to underwrite considerable spending on transfer fees and wages in particular. According to the last set of accounts for Reform Acquisitions Limited (RAL), Lerner's holding company which owns Villa and a number of related companies, the overall wage bill in the 2010-11 season climbed to £83m, which was £25m more than Everton's corporate equivalent. The club's net transfer spend over the last five years is the fourth-highest in the Premier League, behind only Manchester City, Chelsea and Stoke. Yet despite those figures, Villa find themselves in the slipstream of clubs such as Albion, Swansea and Norwich, who have performed far better over the past 18 months even though they are operating at a completely different financial level.Villa finished 16th last year, which was also their final position when David O'Leary was in charge in 2005-06, the season before Lerner's takeover and the appointment of Martin O'Neill as manager. The average attendance in 2005-06 was 34,111 compared to 34,084 now. Villa, in other words, are back to square one on the pitch and in the stands, which must be hard for Lerner to accept when he reflects on the £200m he has invested and thinks back to the days when the club were chasing a place in the Champions League with plans to increase capacity at Villa Park to 50,000.

Lerner is rarely seen at Villa these days – since his divorce much of his time is spent in the States, where he watches most of the games on live television feeds – although he has previously insisted that his absence on match days should not be interpreted as evidence that he has lost interest and intends to sell. He knows and respects Villa's history and his affection for the club stretches beyond the rampant lion, taken from the club crest, that is tattooed on his right ankle. The bottom line, though, is that for all Lerner's good intentions, he has made some bad decisions at Villa and paid a heavy price for them.

It was a mistake to allow Steve Stride, the club's operations director and a highly respected football administrator who had worked for Villa for 35 years, to leave less than 12 months after the takeover was completed. Arguably Lerner's biggest error of judgment, though, has been to overlook the contribution that a sporting or technical director could have made throughout his reign, especially as the American had no experience of running an English football club.

Lerner had hoped that his investment would ultimately lead to qualification for the Champions League and the club came close. Some big signings worked out – the club received £25m more for Stewart Downing, Ashley Young and James Milner than they had paid – but other expensive acquisitions, including Curtis Davies, Marlon Harewood, Steve Sidwell, Nicky Shorey and Habib Beye, did not.

At the end of the 2009-10 season, Villa finished runners-up to Manchester United in the Carling Cup and were in the hunt for fourth place until the final two games, only to miss out to Tottenham. Factors other than football may have been involved but at that point the holding company's wage bill stood at £80m, which accounted for 88% of its turnover.

Despite three consecutive sixth-place finishes in the league, Martin O'Neill walked out five days before the start of the 2010-11 season, and subsequently claimed constructive dismissal. Villa agreed a seven-figure settlement with O'Neill after a tribunal, which is one of many paymentsmade in relation to managers in the past few years. In June 2011 Villa settled with Houllier and his assistant, Gary McAllister, after the Frenchman fell ill and left his post nine months after he was appointed. Later that summer Villa paid Birmingham City compensation for McLeish. The following May, McLeish was sacked less than 12 months into his three-year contract. Villa reached a settlement with the Scot and his assistant, Peter Grant. Last month Villa agreed to pay Norwich compensation for Lambert. The total cost of those departures and arrivals is believed to be in excess of £15m.

That mess has been made worse by the fact that the absence of a sporting director means the squad is overhauled each time a new appointment is made because player recruitment strategy is dictated by the manager at the time. Villa, as a consequence, have got themselves into a situation where players are signed for significant fees and given lucrative contracts, only for the same players to be quickly discarded or dropped – Jean Makoun, Alan Hutton, Shay Given, Stephen Warnock and Darren Bent, signed for a club-record £24m by Houllier, spring to mind – when the manager changes. It is an expensive way to run a football club.

For an example of how the sporting director role can work well for a Premier League club, Villa need look no further than Saturday's opponents, who, despite having had three managers in as many years, have made few changes to a playing squad that is balanced and was assembled at a fraction of the cost. Albion made a £9m profit in their last set of accounts, which cover the 2010-11 season. Villa's holding company lost a record £54m that season and the club finished only a point above Albion. Last year Albion came 10th, six places above Villa. In the summer Villa spent more than £20m and Albion's transfer budget was the lowest in the Premier League. Albion are currently seventh and Villa are 18th.

Lambert was supposed to be the manager to get things back on track. After the unfathomable decision to appoint McLeish, who had just suffered relegation from the Premier League for a second time with Birmingham, Lambert felt like a sensible choice.

He had enjoyed considerable success at Norwich, where he won back-to-back promotions before finishing 12th in the Premier League last season, and his reputation as a young, ambitious and dynamic manager made him a popular choice with supporters, who could not wait to see the back of McLeish.

Although Villa needed to bring down the wage bill, which accounted for 90% of RAL's turnover in 2010-11, Lambert made it clear that it was his choice to promote youth and sign players from lower leagues and overseas in favour of Premier League experience. It seemed like a gamble at the time, although Lambert insisted otherwise when it was pointed out to him at the end of August, on deadline day, that Villa could end up where some of the signings had come from, namely in the Football League. "I had exactly the same question last year and the Norwich lads surpassed everything," Lambert said.Different club, different circumstances. Norwich were buoyant, full of confidence after sailing through League One and the Championship. Villa, in contrast, had spent large periods of the previous two seasons struggling. Some of the senior players had underperformed and there were doubts as to whether some of the academy graduates were good enough, which made it even more of a risk to sign seven players who had only 45 minutes of Premier League football between them. To compound things, Lambert marginalised several of the bigger names, leaving Villa painfully short of experience.

The results have been hugely disappointing and, although Lambert's position is not under immediate threat, it is hard to be positive about Villa's chances of pulling clear with the current squad. Lambert clearly wants to play a more expansive, free-flowing style of football than McLeish, who unquestionably had to be sacked, but consider these Opta statistics: under McLeish, Villa, on average, scored more goals, conceded fewer goals, picked up more points, registered more shots, made more crosses and won more tackles. McLeish's season, lest it be forgotten, went down as one of the bleakest on record at Villa.

The worry for Villa is that the clubs below them, Queens Park Rangers and Reading, who seemed to be cut adrift a few weeks ago, are getting their acts together, picking up points and strengthening in the transfer window.With the new TV deal kicking in next season, guaranteeing every Premier League club a minimum of £60m, it would be a particularly bad year for Villa to go down, although whether that influences Lerner's approach to the transfer window remains to be seen. All we can say for now is that the talk of Champions League football in the Holte pub seems a hell of a long time ago

A great summery of our situation

[Big_John_10]

The total cost of those departures and arrivals is believed to be in excess of £15m.

And i thought it was MON who only wasted money.

I **** hate this word removed of a man.

[Richard]

Disagree it's. shit article which many of us could have dine

to be honest and totally blowing my own trumpet, my op in the plea to randy Lerner thread was a great precursor to articles such as the one above.

At the time I wrote it mike I remember you disagreeing with me but saying "who knows Richard, you could turn out to be a prophet".

[Villarocker]

Richard, you seemed to calm your thoughts of Lerner in the summer. I recall that you believed he would be re-investing? Do you still have hope of that happening or has your opinion of the man returned to what it was before? Or, perhaps it's even less than before?

Just interested to get your current feeling about Lerner, without having to trawl through loads of pages.

To be fair to you, I recall you expressing your concerns way back. I even criticised you for having a go at General Krulak but it seems clear that you had every right to. I apologise to you for questioning you on that! The strange thing here is that my uncle, who attended the games as a ST holder along with me, my Dad & my Brother, also warned of Lerner way back when he sold Gareth Barry. My uncle argued that Barry would have committed to us had we shown him that we were really serious about challenging for honours. My uncle didn't renew his ST the next season, forecasting that other big names would now follow and we'd be left with a load of shit from the reserves. He claimed that Lerner's bubble had burst and that he wasn't going to continue investing because if he was going to our Captain wouldn't have left. We all laughed at him and said he was being daft. How wrong we were!

Edited January 19, 2013 by villarocker

[Richard]

Fair question , I answered it some days ago but can't find my post, never mind I'll answer again.

Last summer I believed lambert would be backed, everything pointed to the question "why would he come here if he wasn't going to be significantly backed " being true and I bought into that. Perhaps that was led by me wanting lambert here, believing he was totally the right man for us. I still believe that by the way and that's why I am not totally on the same bus I was before. I accept that people could say my judgement may be clouded by my faith in lambert and I have sympathy for that but I would say it is my faith in lambert that is helping my judgement. I still believe he wouldn't be here unless he was given the right tools and that if promises where made and then withdrawn he wouldn't be here now. But who knows

Have to say with under two weeks left to go it doesn't look promising. I actually still want Lerner out by the way but as he is going nowhere soon I have to hold onto the thought he may still repent.

If he doesn't invest in the next two weeks I'll be more disappointed in myself to be honest for shifting slightly last summer and falling for what will have proven to have been pr shite once again

[Villarocker]

Cheers for the reply Rich.

I fell for that PR bollocks for a long time! I genuinely thought they cared about us fans but now it's easy to see that all they cared about was getting our money off us. For me, it's clear to see that Lerner has turned and I very much doubt he will ever invest decent money in the club again. I liken him to a man who once had lots of money and was the proud owner of a classic car who spent loads doing it up. Then one day he loses his money and suddenly realises that the thing in the garage is now a burden. Now all he does his turn the engine over once in a whole to keep it ready for a potential buyer. Quite sad really.

I am not sure about Lambert. He worked wonders at Norwich and I thought he would do a decent job here. Perhaps he still could. I certainly won't write him off because I very much doubt that anyone else could do much better with what we have. But, his appointment didn't overwhelm me. I wasn't gutted that we got him, far from it. I just wasn't very excited at the prospect of him being manager. I was actually more enthused by the Ole Gunnar Solskjaer rumours.

I like character managers. People like Big Ron & John Gregory had a lot about them. The likes of O'Leary, Houllier, McLeish and even Little (sorry Brian) just bored me. When I see Lambert's interviews, he pretty much does the same.

I just feel resigned somehow to the fact that we are going down. It feels like we deserve to go down, simply because we're not doing things right and have made too many mistakes to be in the top flight.

I hope I am wrong!

[Woodytom]

Any worse than what Doug, Mcleish, Heskey and a few others have had over the years?

I don't think Lerner has done anything to be spoke about with respect when it comes to how he's run our club.

The abuse for Doug, Mcleish and Heskey was out of order too.

Too other posters who have commented: abuse is different to criticism. Something Lerner shouldnt be immune to by any stretch of the imagination. However as 4th biggest net spenders over the last 5 years shows that the criticism of him not investing is well wide of the mark. The fact he spends it poorly and we have managers who spend it poorly is a different matter. But the numerous posts suggesting that its about time Lerner got his wallet out are incorrect imo.

[Big_John_10]

But his whole net spend over the last 5 years completely ignores the recent lack of spending and more importantly the wage restrictions in which the new manager had to work with. It's good for fans like you to put out there but anyone who actually bothered to look at how the club has been run the last few years knows that's irrelevant.

That's why people are calling for him to spend now.

[Woodytom]

How is it out of order? He has run this club to the ground since MON left, failed mangement appointments, authorisiing idiotic contacts (a five year deal for shay given who is what 35 on 50k contract?

now to your points

Ok,

If this is the case and he has been watching how can he justify not giving and supporting the manager who is working with one hand behind his back with the lack of money available to him? I acnnot believe ateam liek Southampton can go get a Cb and we cant

Exactly you said it yourself no-one from the club has said anything so we all speculate why is their restrictions in place? Cowardly from Lerner, we have been provided no explanation why this is done? For me and I speculate here, just seems there is no plan other than hoping we stay up ecah season until the loans are paid back and he gets his cash back. Just liek trent has said I absolutely believe this. He has been a joke over the last two seasons and has made our club an embarrassment from the humilation of getting rejected from Martinez who was bottom of the pile of managers at the time, to then the frankly idiotic embarassing decision to appointing Mcleish.

3 - I cant answer this one, I doubt Randy will have thought too much about it either, baring in mind we are not relegated and there is still half a season to go. If anything,the vibes coming from the club is that they will stick by Lambert so I would imagine they believe he can get us out of this mess.

But we have a hell of a better chance of staying up if he does and with new TV deal he will make his money back come summer. He stands to lose a hell of a lot more when we are relegated. As for Lambert yes there are so poor signings, bennett and KEA to name a couple but he was given peanuts to build a squad. If lerner backed him just a tad bit more I reckon we would have a far better squad. Two good quality experienced signings and I really believe we will be out of this mess by end of Feb

And its not planely obvious your just speculating like the rest of us

Ok, your points mainly point to the money issue.

I dont know the exact figure but for the sake of arguement lets say we get 100m if we stay up. If you go down you don't 'lose' that £100m as you never had it. Obviously you miss out on it of course. However, lets say we spend 20m in Jan, we only actually get 80m from the TV (admittedly you have the players you bought as well), but the reward is lowered, for a higher risk.

Its clear that Lerner is balancing the books. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to work that one out. And rightly so imo (if I was him). Id love him to spend 100m in January but don't expect him to, and I certainly wouldnt invest in this pile of shit if I was him. Bar a few teams, we have been well invested in over 2 decades and its proved pretty worthless in terms of historic football success.

There is nothing, absolutely nothing that suggests to me that another 20m will keep us up any more than 0m being spent. Not with Lambert spending it. Nor the 3 managers before him either.

So I would suggest Lerner is looking at the 'risks' in terms of balancing the books. The way we are cutting costs - we WILL balance the books if we go down, as you don't 'lose' money for going down. You lose out on potential money but, you just cut costs even further to balance the books. Its easier to balance the books by cutting costs, than it is taking money. Spending 20m and going down would make this very very difficult.

So, and this is plain & simple for me - Lerner wants to balance the books whilst remaining in the premiership. He doesnt need to text me, or give me a bell to let me know. Its obvious. Just put yourself in his shoes and you will get your answers. He gets nothing from being relegated and actually he gets nothing from being in the premiership really, because the price to stay up next season will just elevate anyway. What he gets something from is having a profitable business - and why anybody thinks/expects he was/is here for anything else is beyond me?

[Harry]

A very good article that, for me at least, accurately sums up what has happened. We can blame the likes of MON as much as we like but the buck stops with owner. The simple truth is we have been mismanaged from the moment he stepped through the door. Virtually every call he has made has been wrong not least because he has not put a management structure in at the club who were capable of advising him correctly.

I think where we stand today is quite simple in Lerner's eyes. He think we will be relegated and the only way out of it is to spend and spend big which he is not prepared to do as it will not guarantee survival. It may be that he cannot afford to, which I doubt, I think he just does not want to.

Perversely I think he best decision was to appoint Lambert who I think is the right manager for us in the longer term. I suspect he bought into a bigger vision of completely re engineering the club and the squad. I would even believe that relegation was discussed and that was deemed an acceptable risk. The players the club have bought very much supports that longer term vision.

I'm not saying I agree with any of that but I just cannot see any other rational explanation for what is happening. The simple fact is, short of a miracle, we will be relegated as we just do not have the players to keep us in the PL. For me at least survival will seem like winning a trophy.

I would say though as a final thought that I very much doubt Lerner has really understood the implications of relegation on the fans and what they spend - 34,000 gates try 20,000 in the Championship.

[Woodytom]

But his whole net spend over the last 5 years completely ignores the recent lack of spending and more importantly the wage restrictions in which the new manager had to work with. It's good for fans like you to put out there but anyone who actually bothered to look at how the club has been run the last few years knows that's irrelevant.

That's why people are calling for him to spend now.

Well actually, the 'club' is lowering its losses so its been run 'better' off the field now, than at any point during Lerner's tenure. The fact we are still unable to string 3 forward passes together on a regular basis is still the main issue. And 24m Bent, 6m on Makoun, 10m on Nzogbia, 23m in the summer tells me that spending any money now is far from guaranteed to change that. Regardless of how appauling the players are in terms of pro-footballers they really should be able to get the very very basics right.And they can't. its not as if we are watching them - and thinking wow, what great potential - they just need 1 or 2 signings and it will click. Well im not anyway. Im watching it in embarrassment of how they cant get the basics right. Moussa Sissoko et al, wont change that.