VillaForever1970 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Is this a good old fashioned Villa 3-5-2, I'm thinking like an Alan Wright, Mark Delaney from the 90's 3-5-2 or is it something different? I wonder when concrete Ron is fit will he play alongside Clark and Baker in the three, sounds pretty solid to me but he may not be used to it. I know Lambert is not like MON and changes formations regularly but currently this one seems to be working a treat.. Always good to have 2 actual strikers up there, seems rare these days... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-Reacho Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 It's seems a bit different to John Gregory's in that it's 5-4-1 when we don't have the ball and we just let them have it in their own half. It springs into life and becomes 3-5-2 when we bring the ball forward short quick passes. I don't remember JG's being as sexy as this, or as counter attacking. We had Merson, Dublin, Taylor, Carbone, and Boateng then so we could keep the ball better in the final third but it was still much more direct IIRC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 This is Lambert, we will be changing to a new formation soon enough , we shouldnt get too attached to this one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 It's great away from home or in matches where we expect to be under the cosh a bit. When it's up to us to go forward and make things happen it needs a bit more quality from the wing backs I feel, and more creative impetus from the midfield, but in reality we don;t have the players at the moment. I'd stick with it for the next two games certainly, might try something more attacking for Wigan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 The only time I would play 3-5-2 is a short term measure after a couple of heavy defeats. Exactly what Lambert has done - its worked better than anyone dared hope. Will it work in the long term - I have my doubts. Up until yesterday every club we play away must have been rubbing there hands - 'oh its villa - can't score - can't defend' - as the result the home team comes on to us - but we counter with deadly efficiency ! Teams will start to give us more respect - and will come to VP happy with a point - the onus will be on us to break it down - thats when I fear it may flounder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiezels Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 A back 3 of Clark, Vlaar, Baker looks damn fine. Would allow Vlaar to make those tubs forward too, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 17, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted December 17, 2012 I'll admit to being a subscriber to the train of thought that 3-5-2 is dead. But it certainly seems to be working for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBM Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 no matter how you dress it up, if youre playing 4 defenders, 4 midfielders and 2 strikers, its a 4-4-2, or in our current case, 5 defenders, 3 midfielders and 2 strikers, its a 5-3-2, which everyone used to moan at during JG days saying it was negative, it guess this time round, its a little more attacking players clearly dont stand still, so whats it matter where they are positioned before kick off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 It worked well away from home on Saturday and last Tuesday. We parked the bus with 5 at the back and two sitting midfielders but were able to break forward with purpose through the middle when the chance to came. We still havn't been able to get the more attacking formations to work when we are at home and expected to break teams down. I can not see us playing this formation when Wigan come to Villa park in the new year for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Can't complain, having 3 at the back has tightened us up no end whilst the full full backs offer us the width that have traditionally been missing from Lambert's line ups in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I said earlier in the season we should switch to 3 at the back, we were leaking too many goals, the young fullbacks (particularly Man Utd, everything they did went straight at Enda - he played well but he was being targeted heavily) were being put under too much pressure without the protection of proper wingers. 3-5-2 allows them to make mistakes and have the 3 CB's make up for them. It's working a treat and I would expect us to use it until they are improving their game. I would also mention how easy it is to switch from -----CB--CB--CB LB------------------RB To -----CB------CB LB-------DM------RB with the DM effectively being a 3rd CB when defending but moving the ball forwards in attack. With a DM rather than a CB it is the same 4-1-2-1-2 formation we were playing at the start of the season (and that Lambert favoured at Norwich). Wouldn't surprise me to see us bring in a proper Defensive Midfielder in January and go back to the original formation once Clark/Baker and Lowton, Bennett and Lichaj have accounted for some of the mistakes they will no doubt make as they progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamsonwoodVillan Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I think the back 3 system does actually suit the players we've got at the moment. As has already been said it takes a bit of pressure defensively off some of the likes of Lichaj and Herd and Lowton. It definitely suits all of Herd, Clark and Baker, who from looking vulnerable and error prone last season, all look very decent players right now! I also think it suits midfielders like Bannan and Holman, who benefit from the security of extra players in there with them. The drawbacks of the system are your wing-backs need to be effective at both ends of the pitch and just need to be all round very efficient players, I don't feel qualified to judge our options here as good enough yet. Also it's a bit inflexible, and all defending teams need to do really to stop you from being dangerous at their end is to pin back your wing-backs and play high up the pitch. On Saturday it worked because we got the first goal and they had to leave space behind as they chased the game. The Fulhams, West Hams and Newcastles of this world will be well capable of coming to VP and getting a result with the current system. I guess my point is its important to have a back 4 system ready straight away if needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8pints Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I think Lambert's' idea has been to play a flexible formation all along, he's just been tinkering with selection and placement. When I first saw the 3-5-2 we play, I looked at it as the 4-4-2 diamond a lot of people didn't like with the full backs pushed up slightly and the bottom part of the diamond dropped back a little FROM THIS - -----ST---ST --------AM- ----LCM----RCM ---------DM LB---CB---CB---RB TO THIS --------ST---ST -----------AM -----LCM-----RCM LWB---DM/CB---RWB ---------CB---CB Because Herd does seem to line-up just in front of Clark and Baker. So we haven't changed formation that much, we've just started playing closer to how Lambert wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Yeah possibly. That is the sort of thing that is difficult to get an understanding of from the TV which is always following the ball around. You really need to be at the game to get an understanding of the positioning of the players off the ball. I will have to try and get up to Villa Park in the new year for a couple of games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8pints Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Yeah possibly. That is the sort of thing that is difficult to get an understanding of from the TV which is always following the ball around. You really need to be at the game to get an understanding of the positioning of the players off the ball. I will have to try and get up to Villa Park in the new year for a couple of games. I go to the games and it does look to me that Herd has sat in front of the back two and Holman's played in front of a central pairing. Herd has seemed to try and stay behind Lowton and whoever's played left back, covering whichever side the opposition attack down, if either wing-back isn't back yet. Herd certainly looks to be the first line of defence anyway and although Holman does drop back, it does seem to be that he's been told to be a link between midfield and the forwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I think it is working just fine so far allowing alot of players flourish. If it's not broken and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody1000 Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I don't think that the 3-5-2/5-3-2 will be our formation long term as I don't think that's how PL operates. He strikes me as someone who likes to have a plan A, B, C and D when it comes to formations. He doesn't just stick to one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamsonwoodVillan Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Having a choice of formations is certainly fine by me. If we could just score goals at home with the 3-5-2 though I think it could make us a very solid side over 2nd half of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daweii Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I don't think that the 3-5-2/5-3-2 will be our formation long term as I don't think that's how PL operates. He strikes me as someone who likes to have a plan A, B, C and D when it comes to formations. He doesn't just stick to one. I think we do have a plan B, C & D but to be fair since employing this formation we haven't been in many positions where we have been losing. If we are losing I think Lambert has it in his locker to swap up the formation, but while we aren't losing and barely conceding Lambert doesn't have to change much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 3-5-2 isnt really dead for me, Juventus play a similar version and has served them well in last few seasons and in fact a lot of the recently consistent Italian teams are playing 3 at the back like Napoli and Udinese, not 100% sure but think Inter playing it as well this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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