VamosMiAstonVilla Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 And who cares what a few deluded fantasists think they could see happening in their crystal **** balls under GH! Whatever we were seeing in our crystal balls was far more exciting than what we can see now, which is basically nothingness. I will say one thing in defence of Mcleish though - Ashley Young. We don't have him now, I think many of us are guilty of under-estimating the affect his departure had on us. I watch a lot of football as it's my job and one thing that always strikes me is how one player can have such a dramatic affect on a team. Liverpool's demise has been put down to many things but the loss of a fit Steven Gerrard was essentially the main reason - he carried them for years. Chelsea last season were flying looked like they were going to walk the league but then Drogba gets injured/malaria and they fall to pieces. However this doesn't excuse Mcleish's lack of vision, lack of blueprint, lack of knowledge in attacking cohesion or how he wants them to play. In a way I feel bad for him tonight from the sounds of it he tried to play tippy-tappy style (or pass and move as he calls it) but it comes across like he doesn't have the knowledge or know-how to implement it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 And who cares what a few deluded fantasists think they could see happening in their crystal **** balls under GH! Whatever we were seeing in our crystal balls was far more exciting than what we can see now, which is basically nothingness. I will say one thing in defence of Mcleish though - Ashley Young. We don't have him now, I think many of us are guilty of under-estimating the affect his departure had on us. I watch a lot of football as it's my job and one thing that always strikes me is how one player can have such a dramatic affect on a team. Liverpool's demise has been put down to many things but the loss of a fit Steven Gerrard was essentially the main reason - he carried them for years. Chelsea last season were flying looked like they were going to walk the league but then Drogba gets injured/malaria and they fall to pieces. However this doesn't excuse Mcleish's lack of vision, lack of blueprint, lack of knowledge in attacking cohesion or how he wants them to play. In a way I feel bad for him tonight from the sounds of it he tried to play tippy-tappy style (or pass and move as he calls it) but it comes across like he doesn't have the knowledge or know-how to implement it. i totally agree McLeish is a god awful manager and the Board couldn't really have made a worse appointment other than employing a serial killer or despotic dictator. However GH was no legendary manager with a trophy cabinet that every other manager envies? He was mediorce with the Plop and rubbish with us which has been his only true indicator of his coaching skills. We do really miss Ash (winger Ash not 'in the hole' Ash) and Downing! Proper players who gave their all on a Saturday afternoon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Well look on the bright side at least under McLeish we will give the Cups a go? Doh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I think that's harsh to say he didn't give it a go. 4 changes from what I see as our first XI, Heskey and Bent injured with Delph and Zog underperforming. Ultimately the blame comes down on the manager, but Mourinho couldn't have done anything with the shite the players put on yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.I.C.O. Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Blame the players, not the manager for that. I hope they got a right royal bollocking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I blame the manager just as much as the players for yesterdays game we really did look clueless and did the manager make many subs to actually try and change things its quite clear for the whole game tactically it just was not working at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Amazing how this thread suddenly sees posters swaying back toward Houllier - a manager who completely threw the last Cup game he was in charge for. The bottom line is that just as nobody wanted Houllier, nobody wanted McLeish - and with plenty of good reason on both counts. I have tried to see the virtue in what McLeish has tried to do since he arrived and could see some encouraging signs during the first couple of games. Things are looking increasingly bleak though now we're a few weeks into the season, and last night was appalling. There is simply no defence for it. But I have zero faith that we wouldn't have seen the very same performance with Houllier in charge. Perhaps the most frustrating thing as a Villa supporter at the moment is that such a thread as this exists; Houllier of McLeish? Talk about the lesser of two evils. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 The bottom line is that just as nobody wanted Houllier, nobody wanted McLeish I wanted Houllier, definitely didnt want McLeish. Was always a dead man walking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa_shere Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 This thread should really have been Hughes or Mcleish. But then that would be far too onesided. GH was pants and glad to see the back of him but AM is equally as bad, even though we are only 5 games in i'd say we are about 3 points off what we should have collected by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Houllier was found out a bit at Villa, though, wasn't he? Whether he ever was the towering genius in his early career that some on here portrayed, what he produced at Villa was largely gash, purchase of Bent excepted. (So his greatest achievement was to buy a big English centre forward, Hmmm...) Since he has himself admitted he's not well enough to return to football management, it is quite perplexing that anyone could vote for him. What are you voting for? An unwell man who took Villa to the brink of relegation and upset the players and fans. Quite, quite perplexing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Mcleish was up against it from the moment he set foot at Villa. He had a limited window of time to win the supporters over, but i fear thar time has now come and gone and he has failed. This season im sorry to say might turn out just as bad as many of us feared. Dreary football with mixed results played in front of half empty seats, just waiting for the inevitable to happen. More and more people will start booing and protesting and sooner or later Lerner will have to adress the situation. This season im afraid there will be no £20 m signing to save us. I don't think we'll get relegated but Lerner stands to loose almost as much money in missed revenue as he saved by trimming the wage bill. And then we'll have start all over again next season... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Amazing how this thread suddenly sees posters swaying back toward Houllier - a manager who completely threw the last Cup game he was in charge for. Yes, Houllier made a mistake with his team selection, but he played a second string team against Citeh away and they put up just as good a show as McLeish's first XI against Bolton at home!! I am not a Houllier fan. I just think McLeish is pants! :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savosleftboot Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Amazing how this thread suddenly sees posters swaying back toward Houllier - a manager who completely threw the last Cup game he was in charge for. Yes, Houllier made a mistake with his team selection, but he played a second string team against Citeh away and they put up just as good a show as McLeish's first XI against Bolton at home!! I am not a Houllier fan. I just think McLeish is pants! :winkold: Doesn't that say as much as the players that played last night? They're professionals and should know the standard required and that they're falling way below that standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Doesn't that say as much as the players that played last night? They're professionals and should know the standard required and that they're falling way below that standard. They have a share of the blame but it is ultimately the Manager's responsibility. Look at the difference with Spurs with Ramos to Redknob - same squad virtually just a manager that knew how to get the best out of that squad and what to add to it to make it work. I am not suggesting our squad is as good as Spuds but it should be good enough to compete with and beat (the majority of times) Premier League teams outside of the top 6. We are currently in Ramos territory as far as I can see BUT I don't trust RL to find us our Redknob! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savosleftboot Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Im not excusing AMC completely but we were poor under GH last year and now AMC. Time for some players to step up to the mark, especially the experienced pros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honest_bertie Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Im not excusing AMC completely but we were poor under GH last year and now AMC. Time for some players to step up to the mark, especially the experienced pros. I think many fans have convinced themselves that Villas senior players are still top players. Apart from Bent and Given I don't think we have any top players in our team anymore. People like Dunne, Warnock, Ireland, Petrov and collins all live off past glories, namely when they were playing well under MON (bar Ireland, he lives off 1 good season at Man C). I think AM is and will always be the wrong manager for Villa but the main problem these last few years is the ineptness of the board who have sanctioned over the top wages and contracts which has led to the mess Villa are now in. Just my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted September 21, 2011 VT Supporter Share Posted September 21, 2011 This squad (minus Bent) is as bad as the squad we had before MON took over. AM would be a magician if he could make it work. I would even argue Blues had a stronger squad last season (minus Bent) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I would even argue Blues had a stronger squad last season (minus Bent)Nowhere near. Our squad may have seen better times but it's still miles better than SHA's squad last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Who was the last scotsman to manage our club and how did that end up Gary Mcaliister did alright got wins vs Liverpool adn Arsenal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holtender_in_Sky Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 This squad (minus Bent) is as bad as the squad we had before MON took over. AM would be a magician if he could make it work. I would even argue Blues had a stronger squad last season (minus Bent) we both know that, that is absolute horseshit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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