High Line ..Pros and Cons

[chrisvilla4]

Pro's: 5th. Most goals scored. 

Cons: 

[OutByEaster?]

2 hours ago, BigJim said:

Even Fulham very nearly got through several times.

That's the plan.

[OutByEaster?]

6 hours ago, MikeMcKenna said:

An interesting thing about the high defensive line strategy is that it effectively dictates the oppositions playing style. It forces their attackers to play in a very limited area of the pitch. However,   I am sure that Emery will make a few tweaks against the likes of Man city as they are so good at running across the line. 

Absolutely - you hear a lot of pundits talking about us being susceptible to the ball over the top or in behind us - we're "too open to runners in behind" they'll say, and who knows, maybe we're more susceptible to that than other sides - but in playing the way we do, it's pretty much the only option we give you - if you want to play through us, you're starting on the edge of your own box, not in our half - if you want to feed a frontman and have him hold the ball up and bring people into play - he'll be lucky to be across the halfway line.

It gives you a way to attack us, if you can get it right, and takes away a whole lot of other ways.

[one_ian_taylor]

1 hour ago, DJBOB said:

From a passer perspective, it is very difficult as usually it is left to one of the back line players to try and hit that through ball.

The way we play the offside line, it is incredibly rare someone will receive the ball in space between our midfield and defenders and play a through ball. Think of it in a training scenario with the training dummies. They probably practice the through ball receiving it in the half space and then around one dummy.

But how often will they practice a long ball trying to find the runner between two or three lines of players (our forwards line, our midfield line, and our defence line). You have to get the timing, the accuracy, Watkins or Diaby pressing with the runner very far away from you. On the occasion that they get in between the lines, it's usually out wide and that's still not an easy ball to play.

Look at the perfect trap by Pau here. It's a still image, but Pau checks over his shoulder several times to see who's being played on. As the defender closer to the ball, it's going to be his responsibility to step up as the player is blind side of him. Konsa and Cash are looking down the line to make sure no one breaks and Pau is eyeing Iwobi. As soon as Iwobi puts his head down to make a pass, Pau steps up to trigger the trap, knowing Konsa and Cash will not be deeper than him. Where smarter opponents have been catching on is maybe faking the first pass and then making the pass for Wilson as Pau's momentum will be carrying him the wrong way.

It will be interesting to see what Unai chooses to do against City and Arsenal. Fan logic would think to play more defensively and he might as he did against Wolves - showing a level of respect to O'Neil that the little ponce didn't return back by not shaking Unai's hand at FT immediately. But Unai strikes me as a calculated gambler and, like in poker, aggression will win you a lot of hands...as long as you don't get trapped yourself.

 

I haven't  seen enough to have a definite view, but my hunch is that Pau's ability to read the game  and organise is as crucial to our defending as his passing is to our attacking. Which is lucky as he is one of the most ungainly defenders I think I've  seen at this level

[MrBlack]

13 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Absolutely - you hear a lot of pundits talking about us being susceptible to the ball over the top or in behind us - we're "too open to runners in behind" they'll say, and who knows, maybe we're more susceptible to that than other sides - but in playing the way we do, it's pretty much the only option we give you - if you want to play through us, you're starting on the edge of your own box, not in our half - if you want to feed a frontman and have him hold the ball up and bring people into play - he'll be lucky to be across the halfway line.

It gives you a way to attack us, if you can get it right, and takes away a whole lot of other ways.

It's for this reason I hope we'll be able to cope quite well with City in a few weeks.  Haaland is always a threat, but he's not exactly a pace merchant so hopefully they'll lose a bit of their threat. 

It's a crazy new world that I'm not worried about playing man city and actually looking forward to seeing how Emery sets us up. We will be aiming to win, and I love it.  

Up the high line!

[cheltenham_villa]

44 minutes ago, chrisvilla4 said:

Pro's: 5th. Most goals scored. 

Cons: 

Cons. Lack of cleansheets and more exposed against better oppositions. Newcastle and Liverpool both founds ways through it easily. 

(note I'm a fan, just highlighting the cons) 

[Pinebro]

Posts like this is just another indication that there still is a portion of the fanbase who still isn't fully onboard with Unai's philosophy.

Absolutely mind boggling. I have no idea what to say to you.

[MWARLEY2]

4 minutes ago, Pinebro said:

Posts like this is just another indication that there still is a portion of the fanbase who still isn't fully onboard with Unai's philosophy.

Absolutely mind boggling. I have no idea what to say to you.

Mate. Its called making a post interesting. Its not just my opinion. I love the high line. I love how well we hold it.. But interested to hear others opinions on it. Otherwise it would be high line is brilliant. Dont dare say otherwise. 

[villaslash]

Pro: exciting attacking football packed with loads of goals

Con: my blood pressure rating by the end of the game and my dog’s anxiety as I yell “he’s got to be offside right!” a dozen times during the game.

Edited November 15, 2023 by villaslash
Punctuation

[jimmygreaves]

18 hours ago, cheltenham_villa said:

Newcastle and Liverpool both founds ways through it easily. 

I'm not inclined to read too much into those games or results. Both matches we lost a key defender early on and both were away. It was also Newcastle's first home match of the season so that was always gonna be tough.

[cheltenham_villa]

3 hours ago, jimmygreaves said:

I'm not inclined to read too much into those games or results. Both matches we lost a key defender early on and both were away. It was also Newcastle's first home match of the season so that was always gonna be tough.

Ill be honest, i dont base it just on the games. In all of our games i see opportunities for teams to get in behind us, it stands to reason that better teams will be more successful at doing that. 

For me the high line will give more opportunity to score, but it should also allow us more opportunity to score. The best attacking side will win. 

[The Fun Factory]

Pros- a year of almost unprecedented success in the Premier League era

Cons- like every Villa fan a nagging feeling that we are going to get found out and we will  go back to mid-table mediocrity once again

[Pongo Waring]

What do you call the opposite of a high line then? Is it a normal line or low line?

[LondonLax]

With FIFA looking to change the offside rules so attackers are not offside if just a part of their body is onside it will likely kill the offside trap as a tactic.

We might have to go back to the drawing board next season. 

[Kiwivillan]

On 15/11/2023 at 07:33, cheltenham_villa said:

Cons. Lack of cleansheets and more exposed against better oppositions. Newcastle and Liverpool both founds ways through it easily. 

(note I'm a fan, just highlighting the cons) 

Newcastle game we lost Buendia 48 hours before and Mings early in the game with injury that clearly rattled our players. Massive outlier. Liverpool 1st early goal was debatable offside from Salah blocking keeper view. Not really justifiable examples

[Keyblade]

15 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

Newcastle game we lost Buendia 48 hours before and Mings early in the game with injury that clearly rattled our players. Massive outlier. Liverpool 1st early goal was debatable offside from Salah blocking keeper view. Not really justifiable examples

I think Liverpool would have beat us convincingly us anyway. TAA was killing us with the ball over the top to Nunez all game. Was the same at VP last Boxing Day.

[meregreen]

Like all “systems” teams will study it, and find ways to counter it. Once it’s found to be a liability, top coaches will move on and adapt. We’ve got a top coach, someone I’ve got faith in.

[MotoMkali]

9 hours ago, Pongo Waring said:

What do you call the opposite of a high line then? Is it a normal line or low line?

 

Low block - standard - high line

[MotoMkali]

4 hours ago, Keyblade said:

I think Liverpool would have beat us convincingly us anyway. TAA was killing us with the ball over the top to Nunez all game. Was the same at VP last Boxing Day.

Was a game we very much missed Ramseys pressing and pace on TAA. He makes it a lot harder to have time on the ball to pick those passes. 

[Pongo Waring]

49 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

Low block - standard - high line

We was absolutely sh*ite playing the Low block - standard then. We was fighting relegation, we lacked creativity. Konsa had a 72% pass completion rate compared to his 93% pass completion rate playing the higher line..... Why the hell would anyone wanna go back to it?