LGBTQ+

[Seat68]

OK, so there has been a few stories that I wanted to share in the past that I didn't feel fitted into an existing thread. I came across one today that I think is a good kick off. Not sure of the thread title. 

This is absolutely **** abhorrent. 

https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/07/18/italy-lesbian-mums-removed-birth-certificates/

Quote

Italy has begun removing lesbian mums’ names from their children’s birth certificates, as part of the government’s crackdown on the rights of LGBTQ+ parents.

The move follows right-wing populist PM Giorgia Meloni’s announcement in March that state agencies should no longer register the children of same-sex couples.

 

I am aware of Italy's politics going further to the right, again but this is completely disgusting. 

[villa89]

10 minutes ago, Seat68 said:

I am aware of Italy's politics going further to the right, again but this is completely disgusting. 

There's a decent growth rate of far right-ism across many countries for a variety of reasons. The west could be moving from a period of progressive liberal politics back to a more conservative, insular society. 

[Wainy316]

The home of fascism doing fascisty stuff

[Genie]

18 minutes ago, Seat68 said:

I came across one today

[Rodders]

**** grim. But not a surprise when people elect these revolting whackjobs. 

[Seat68]

I see you Italy and raise you Kenya. Kenya seeing what Uganda are doing with regards their treatment of homosexuals and think we want a piece of that shitty pie. Uganda currently have the harshest anti gay laws in the world. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-66079603

Quote

A member of the Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender (LGBT) seen reacting after Kenya's High Court ruled to uphold the British-era penal code that criminalises gay sex (Photo: 24 May 2019)IMAGE SOURCE,GETTY IMAGES
In the latest sign of rising homophobia in different African countries, a Kenyan opposition MP is leading a campaign for parliament to further criminalise the country's small LGBTQ community.

George Peter Kaluma's move comes after neighbouring Uganda adopted a tough new anti-gay law, rejecting threats by US President Joe Biden to impose sanctions and travel restrictions on "anyone involved in serious human rights abuses".

When I met Mr Kaluma - a member of veteran Kenyan opposition politician Raila Odinga's Orange Democratic Movement - he was sitting behind his desk at his office in the capital Nairobi, proof-reading and making corrections to a bill that he intends to table in parliament soon.

"We want to prohibit everything to do with homosexuality," Mr Kaluma tells me, adding that his bill will be much broader than the legislation passed by Uganda's parliament and approved by President Yoweri Museveni in May.

I guess it's not like anyone in the developed world would have anything to do with this.

Quote

Although the meeting in Uganda was billed as an attempt to protect the "sovereignty" of African states, it was actually co-sponsored by an American Christian right-wing organisation, Family Watch International (FWI).

Oh. 

[Demitri_C]

Unfortunately whether we agree with it or not its their countries and they can do as they please no matter how bad it is. Isnt most of the middle east against all the LGBTQ movement too?

[villa4europe]

I'll take the thread in a different direction and honestly ask this question - what's a queer? And how does that differ from LGBT

And does the "+" mean and others or something in particular?

I sometimes see criticism of straight people for not always understanding but at the same time I don't understand because deep down I don't really care... But that's as an opposite of prejudice

And at the same time I will throw the old man comment out, some of this moves so fast that if like me you're not paying attention or don't care you lose track of it, there's a huge difference between being a homophobic asshole and someone who simoly makes no effort to understand this world because I've got no interest in it

[Demitri_C]

3 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

I'll take the thread in a different direction and honestly ask this question - what's a queer? And how does that differ from LGBT

And does the "+" mean and others or something in particular?

I sometimes see criticism of straight people for not always understanding but at the same time I don't understand because deep down I don't really care... But that's as an opposite of prejudice

And at the same time I will throw the old man comment out, some of this moves so fast that if like me you're not paying attention or don't care you lose track of it, there's a huge difference between being a homophobic asshole and someone who simoly makes no effort to understand this world because I've got no interest in it

Id say someone who criticises someone who doesnt understand and wants to be educated is ignorant. Whether they LGBTQ person or not.

This subject is not something im a expect on.  It doesnt really effect me that's why im not heavily invested in it.

[LondonLax]

17 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

I'll take the thread in a different direction and honestly ask this question - what's a queer? And how does that differ from LGBT

And does the "+" mean and others or something in particular?

I sometimes see criticism of straight people for not always understanding but at the same time I don't understand because deep down I don't really care... But that's as an opposite of prejudice

And at the same time I will throw the old man comment out, some of this moves so fast that if like me you're not paying attention or don't care you lose track of it, there's a huge difference between being a homophobic asshole and someone who simoly makes no effort to understand this world because I've got no interest in it

I think it’s just a cover all term meaning ‘not straight’. I think the idea is some people don’t like to have a well defined (limiting?) label about themselves and prefer a more broad term. I’m not an expert though so someone will probably be along shortly to correct me

[Chindie]

45 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

I'll take the thread in a different direction and honestly ask this question - what's a queer? And how does that differ from LGBT

And does the "+" mean and others or something in particular?

I sometimes see criticism of straight people for not always understanding but at the same time I don't understand because deep down I don't really care... But that's as an opposite of prejudice

And at the same time I will throw the old man comment out, some of this moves so fast that if like me you're not paying attention or don't care you lose track of it, there's a huge difference between being a homophobic asshole and someone who simoly makes no effort to understand this world because I've got no interest in it

'Queer' is a catch-all that some LGBTQ+ people use. Generally it's because they don't recognise the 'sectionality' that comes from defining a community into neat little boxes, and also often has elements of pushing back against heterosexual norms that have been assimilated by some LGBTQ+ communities. It's usually associated with someone who aligns themselves as 'radical', politically, in the community. It's also an example of reclaiming a derogatory term, which causes it's own problems.

The '+' is just shorthand for all the other communities that are less populous/visible etc. Things like asexuals, intersexual etc, but also various other more minor communities that aren't explicitly called out by the main term.

Theres quite a lot of controversy over the LGBTQ+ definition - there's those that believe you can't treat all those different communities as homogenous in any respect; there's infamously a chunk of the lesbian community that actively wants to cut the T part off entirely (boomboom); there's controversy over whether intersex should be included on various sides (and similarly asexual); Q is controversial because some in the community think it complicates things unnecessarily and involves matters and concepts that they consider are not needed to be discussed under the same banner, as well as problems with using a term that historically is an insult to some; and there's controversy over the + because it opens up the term to things some don't think should be in the same conversations or undermines the whole thing.

I think generally if you're open minded, non-judgemental, people aren't going to attack you for being ignorant of the minutiae of all this, and you'd need to really blunder into things to rile someone on it. Accepting of course that there's arseholes everywhere and some prick might overreact to an unknowing slight. 

[VillaChris]

1 hour ago, villa4europe said:

I'll take the thread in a different direction and honestly ask this question - what's a queer? And how does that differ from LGBT

And does the "+" mean and others or something in particular?

I sometimes see criticism of straight people for not always understanding but at the same time I don't understand because deep down I don't really care... But that's as an opposite of prejudice

And at the same time I will throw the old man comment out, some of this moves so fast that if like me you're not paying attention or don't care you lose track of it, there's a huge difference between being a homophobic asshole and someone who simoly makes no effort to understand this world because I've got no interest in it

Work at a media agency in Brum so know the author of this article and for those who care the LGBTQ+ thesaurus is in all its glory below:

LGBTQ+ terms explained - what you need to know (yahoo.com)

Quote

For decades, the LGBTQ+ community has been bruised by words. My queer younger self used to fear the words that became my labels. Walking on eggshells down school corridors, I was terrified of being called ‘gay’ or ‘poof’ – a sign someone had discovered my secret.

At the time, they were hateful words. But in all honesty, I was a ‘poof’ – always have been, always will be.

 

[Wainy316]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

Unfortunately whether we agree with it or not its their countries and they can do as they please no matter how bad it is. Isnt most of the middle east against all the LGBTQ movement too?

What about the people that are born in these countries that are punished and even killed for something that they have absolutely no control over?

[Demitri_C]

6 minutes ago, Wainy316 said:

What about the people that are born in these countries that are punished and even killed for something that they have absolutely no control over?

Like i said in my previous post whether we like it or not its theie country they can do as they please.  I of course thinks its barbaric however what is 7 people on a villa forum going to do? Your not going to change the way they do things. 

Its going to take time and the people living there are the ones who can implement change by challenging their governments on these issues.

My advice is if you dont like what the country does just dont go there. What more can you do?

Edited July 19, 2023 by Demitri_C

[mjmooney]

14 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Like i said in my previous post whether we like it or not its theie country they can do as they please.  I of course thinks its barbaric however what is 7 people on a villa forum going to do? Your not going to change the way they do things. 

Its going to take time and the people living there are the ones who can implement change by challenging their governments on these issues.

My advice is if you dont like what the country does just dont go there. What more can you do?

My answer to this commonly voiced opinion is: If you had lived in the 1930s, would have said the same about Nazi Germany? "They're gassing Jews in concentration camps? Oh, well, it's their country, well within their rights, none of our business, is it? Doesn't directly affect me, anyway" 

??? 

 

Edited July 19, 2023 by mjmooney

[Demitri_C]

12 minutes ago, mjmooney said:

My answer to this commonly voiced opinion is: If you had lived in the 1930s, would have said the same about Nazi Germany? "They're gassing Jews in concentration camps? Oh, well, it's their country, well within their rights, none of our business, is it? Doesn't directly affect me, anyway" 

??? 

 

The world was a different place back then. What is your expectation? Our government getting involved telling other countries how to run their country?

Not gonna happen and let's say even if they did they would just tell us to piss off its their country we cant tell them how to run theie country.  Its like saudi arabia coming here and saying to our government we dont like  gay people showing signs of affection in public  stop this and ban it like we do. We would tell them to go get ****

 

[VillaChris]

32 minutes ago, Wainy316 said:

What about the people that are born in these countries that are punished and even killed for something that they have absolutely no control over?

Hard to believe given the state of play now that same sex marriage was only granted lawful status on 13th March 2014 here in England and Wales.

Not trying to make excuses for the barbaric countries but was plenty of homophobia flying around on these shores in 70s-90s and yet thing were only rectified less than a decade ago.

Think with the Middle East anti-LGTBQ beliefs and convictions are so enshrined in their religion I can't really see anything changing for the foreseeable future. Hey at least Saudi Arabia lets Women drive cars now so anything is possible I guess.....

[tomav84]

1 minute ago, VillaChris said:

Hard to believe given the state of play now that same sex marriage was only granted lawful status on 13th March 2014 here in England and Wales.

Not trying to make excuses for the barbaric countries but was plenty of homophobia flying around on these shores in 70s-90s and yet thing were only rectified less than a decade ago.

Think with the Middle East anti-LGTBQ beliefs and convictions are so enshrined in their religion I can't really see anything changing for the foreseeable future. Hey at least Saudi Arabia lets Women drive cars now so anything is possible I guess.....

it's not gone away. there's a reason sky sports turns replies off on their tweets about rainbow laces etc

[Follyfoot]

11 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Hard to believe given the state of play now that same sex marriage was only granted lawful status on 13th March 2014 here in England and Wales.

Not trying to make excuses for the barbaric countries but was plenty of homophobia flying around on these shores in 70s-90s and yet thing were only rectified less than a decade ago.

Think with the Middle East anti-LGTBQ beliefs and convictions are so enshrined in their religion I can't really see anything changing for the foreseeable future. Hey at least Saudi Arabia lets Women drive cars now so anything is possible I guess.....

That’s far more objectionable than any of if 

[gwi1890]

35 minutes ago, mjmooney said:

My answer to this commonly voiced opinion is: If you had lived in the 1930s, would have said the same about Nazi Germany? "They're gassing Jews in concentration camps? Oh, well, it's their country, well within their rights, none of our business, is it? Doesn't directly affect me, anyway" 

??? 

 

 

19 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

The world was a different place back then. What is your expectation? Our government getting involved telling other countries how to run their country?

Not gonna happen and let's say even if they did they would just tell us to piss off its their country we cant tell them how to run theie country.  Its like saudi arabia coming here and saying to our government we dont like  gay people showing signs of affection in public  stop this and ban it like we do. We would tell them to go get ****

 

I think this is part of the problem we can’t go back to the times where european countries had a say in what went on around the world it’s scary to think that less than 40 years ago natives were treated like animals in they’re own country. There’s a reason why the world is broken and it has a lot to do with these developed countries.