bickster Posted December 12, 2022 Moderator Share Posted December 12, 2022 15 minutes ago, Genie said: Spending $44b on an app that was losing about $1b a year is possibly the worst deal in history isn’t it? Not for the former shareholders of Twitter 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, bickster said: Not for the former shareholders of Twitter Give it 6 months and they can offer to buy it back off him for $2b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Genie said: Give it 6 months and they can offer to buy it back off him for $2b That’s the stupidest part of it all, he knew he was overpaying for it hence why he tried to get out of the deal but he must realise what he’s doing is devastating its value. Yes he’s incredibly rich but he’s playing with Twitter like a rag toy than a business. He obviously thought he could bring back right wing members, make it a cross political platform for US purposes and while adhering to free speech and make it worth the value he paid which was optimistic at best but he’s gone well off course and he’s throwing his extreme right wing/conspiracy theory views in has blown that. The question is will he get worse or realise the business impact, I’m guessing it’s gone too far and he’ll get worse. I’m guessing one of the tech giants will buy at the small valuation in a few years time when Musk has gone too far. Edited December 12, 2022 by nick76 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 I saw another "what if" opinion the other day that was funny. Apparently Tesla owners are seen as lefty woke snowflakes in Republican circles so "what if" Musk is going all right wing crazy to attract loads of MAGA types to buy his cars thinking he's a good old boy after all. The mans genius knows no bounds for some people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Genie said: Spending $44b on an app that was losing about $1b a year is possibly the worst deal in history isn’t it? It wasn’t losing that kind of money before he bought it was it? In fact I thought I’d read they had started to have a couple of years in the black before the pandemic? The billion $ a year figure is down to the interest payments on the loans he took out isn’t it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, LondonLax said: It wasn’t losing that kind of money before he bought it was it? In fact I thought I’d read they had started to have a couple of years in the black before the pandemic? The billion $ a year figure is down to the interest payments on the loans he took out isn’t it? It’s actually higher than I thought That’s just as he bought it. That’s over $1.46b a year it would be losing. Most people seem to think it will be worse now as many advertisers have pulled out of Twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 15 hours ago, sidcow said: I stumbled across a Tesla forum earlier where Tesla owners were discussing if the way Musk was conducting himself would put them off buying another Tesla. Certainly some felt that way, most felt they had no option though as Tesla were simply the best electric car they could buy. Think they need to look a bit harder....... Or indeed at all. I have toyed around with the idea of buying an electric car and from what I can see the Tesla models are still the market leader (frustratingly). On metrics like range and charging networks, and performance, they are difficult to beat. I think the Ford MachE and the Kia EV6 are in the ballpark, the Polstar 2 looks ok, the Skoda Enyak is cheaper, Volvo and Volkswagen, BMW and Mercedes all have options but the Teslas still come out on top dollar for dollar for me. The others are gaining ground year on year though so hopefully it’s not long before it becomes much more of a decision on which you’d opt for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Just now, Genie said: It’s actually higher than I thought That’s just as he bought it. That’s over $1.46b a year it would be losing. Most people seem to think it will be worse now as many advertisers have pulled out of Twitter. That 4m a day would include his loans. In 2018 Twitter made a profit of $1.2b and $1.46b in 2019. They took a huge hit in 2020 during the pandemic (when sponsors pulled out of everything) losing $1.1b but stemmed the losses to $221m in 2021. It was looking like a very profitable company at one point. https://www.businessofapps.com/data/twitter-statistics/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, LondonLax said: That 4m a day would include his loans. In 2018 Twitter made a profit of $1.2b and $1.46b in 2019. They took a huge hit in 2020 during the pandemic (when sponsors pulled out of everything) losing $1.1b but stemmed the losses to $221m in 2021. It was looking like a very profitable company at one point. https://www.businessofapps.com/data/twitter-statistics/ So he’s laid off people due to the payments on the loans he took out to buy Twitter? That’s even more mental! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 9 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I have toyed around with the idea of buying an electric car and from what I can see the Tesla models are still the market leader (frustratingly). On metrics like range and charging networks, and performance, they are difficult to beat. I think the Ford MachE and the Kia EV6 are in the ballpark, the Polstar 2 looks ok, the Skoda Enyak is cheaper, Volvo and Volkswagen, BMW and Mercedes all have options but the Teslas still come out on top dollar for dollar for me. The others are gaining ground year on year though so hopefully it’s not long before it becomes much more of a decision on which you’d opt for. Still living off past reputation really. If you are looking at range only they are right up there. And their software I understand is excellent. And charging less of a ball ache than other electric cars because they only use their own chargers so its own brand talking to own brand rather than independent brand talking to 30 other brands. But in terms of build quality they're pretty shoddy. Does an extra 20 miles or range really make up for it? Charging networks will overtake them soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Genie said: So he’s laid off people due to the payments on the loans he took out to buy Twitter? That’s even more mental! The loan repayments were not as onerous when he agreed the deal as interest rates were virtually 0 at that time. Since then the US has raised rates multiple times and now the repayment plan is over a $1b a year (and still growing). At the time he agreed the purchase it was not a disastrous deal but market conditions quickly changed. He tried to get out of it but had signed a water tight contract and is left holding the baby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, LondonLax said: The loan repayments were not as onerous when he agreed the deal as interest rates were virtually 0 at that time. Since then the US has raised rates multiple times and now the repayment plan is over a $1b a year (and still growing). At the time he agreed the purchase it was not a disastrous deal but market conditions quickly changed. He tried to get out of it but had signed a water tight contract and is left holding the baby. He should have just paid the $1b to exit the deal (and then tried to renegotiate if he really wanted it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Just now, sidcow said: Still living off past reputation really. If you are looking at range only they are right up there. And their software I understand is excellent. And charging less of a ball ache than other electric cars because they only use their own chargers so its own brand talking to own brand rather than independent brand talking to 30 other brands. But in terms of build quality they're pretty shoddy. Does an extra 20 miles or range really make up for it? Charging networks will overtake them soon. Yeah I have seen some of the build issues (like examples of the boot lid clipping the body frame when closing etc) but they seem pretty minor compared with the advantages in both software and performance. I’ve watched a number of comparison reviews on YouTube etc and if I was going to spend the £ today it would probably have to be Tesla. I’m hoping a couple more years of development (and time for me to save up ) and it might be one of their competitors I’d opt for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted December 12, 2022 Moderator Share Posted December 12, 2022 All pretence of being "centrist" has now disappeared 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HKP90 Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 41 minutes ago, bickster said: All pretence of being "centrist" has now disappeared Are we absolutely sure that his 'blue tick' hasn't been co-opted by a 12 year old simpleton? No? Oh dear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 50 minutes ago, bickster said: All pretence of being "centrist" has now disappeared I don't use Twitter - but those comments are largely depressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 The man is dangerous. He keeps going unchecked and he's going to encourage another march on Washington. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, bobzy said: I don't use Twitter - but those comments are largely depressing. I'm actually astounded anyone is at this point who isn't a raging right wing nutter. He needs taking down and using Twitter only helps prop him up. I've never used it but if I did I would definitely have closed it down by now. And I'd rather drive a **** Milk float than a Tesla. Edited December 12, 2022 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 I'd wager there's a decent correlation between those vociferously claiming the centre ground and those actually being quite right wing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted December 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Chindie said: I'd wager there's a decent correlation between those vociferously claiming the centre ground and those actually being quite right wing. Oh yes. Oldest trick in the book pretend to be what you are not when you are a heinous organisation that you know will be rejected by society as a whole if they really knew what you are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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