Ratings & Reactions: Forest v Villa

[duke313]

1 minute ago, bannedfromHandV said:

The results are frustrating yes, we should have won the last two games. 

We’re not firing in attack, obviously, but we are looking pretty solid in defence, again last night Forest did nothing of note except for put in one decent set piece which a) we should have defended better and b) was a dubious decision from the ref.

I don’t know if it’s poor coaching or the players are not carrying out the plan / simply not playing well enough or are just not good enough. We are also missing some key players at the moment.

People are going on as if we look like the side that went down 6 or 7 years ago, that team was getting battered week in week out which isn’t happening now, half of the overall approach is working well enough (defence), we just need to find a way to get it going up top.

If we had we would be in 8th with 13 points, only 2 off Man Utd.  He would definitely be going nowhere if we were in that position.  The only silver lining to us being in 16th with 9 points is that hopefully it has utterly exposed SG for the fraud he is.

[tomav84]

1 minute ago, bannedfromHandV said:

The results are frustrating yes, we should have won the last two games. 
 

We’re not firing in attack, obviously, but we are looking pretty solid in defence, again last night Forest did nothing of note except for put in one decent set piece which a) we should have defended better and b) was a dubious decision from the ref.

I don’t know if it’s poor coaching or the players are not carrying out the plan / simply not playing well enough or are just not good enough. We are also missing some key players at the moment.

People are going on as if we look like the side that went down 6 or 7 years ago, that team was getting battered week in week out which isn’t happening now, half of the overall approach is working well enough (defence), we just need to find a way to get it going up top.

do you mean on paper or based on chances created? you could maybe argue that for leeds, but definitely not last night. there was 1 save from henderson from a watkins header other than that he had nothing to do

[Mister_a]

Just now, MWARLEY2 said:

Wasnt it something line 17 crosses yesterday with only one being successful ? Bit like against Bournemouth 

It's just Einstein's theory of insanity. Again lol.

[DCJonah]

4 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

The results are frustrating yes, we should have won the last two games. 
 

We’re not firing in attack, obviously, but we are looking pretty solid in defence, again last night Forest did nothing of note except for put in one decent set piece which a) we should have defended better and b) was a dubious decision from the ref.

I don’t know if it’s poor coaching or the players are not carrying out the plan / simply not playing well enough or are just not good enough. We are also missing some key players at the moment.

People are going on as if we look like the side that went down 6 or 7 years ago, that team was getting battered week in week out which isn’t happening now, half of the overall approach is working well enough (defence), we just need to find a way to get it going up top.

What game did you watch last night?

 

[bannedfromHandV]

13 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

do you mean on paper or based on chances created? you could maybe argue that for leeds, but definitely not last night. there was 1 save from henderson from a watkins header other than that he had nothing to do

We had 60% possession and twice as many efforts on goal, although admittedly I don’t recall many of them. Forest were camped in their final third for most of the game, same as the second half versus leeds, we should have won both and with a better striker, one who a) has a reasonable amount of technical ability and b) understands the concept of staying onside, we’d have won both. 
 

There are blatantly obvious deficiencies in our attacking play at the moment but Watkins, as much as I love the guy for his work rate and endeavour, seems to be a major problem for us. Ings hasn’t shown much more so I’d be tempted to give Archer a couple of starts in the next two games.

[StefanAVFC]

5 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

There are blatantly obvious deficiencies in our attacking play at the moment but Watkins, as much as I love the guy for his work rate and endeavour, seems to be a major problem for us. Ings hasn’t shown much more so I’d be tempted to give Archer a couple of starts in the next two games.

And then when that doesn't work, what's next? A new top striker in January (to get better than what we have, we're talking 30m+)

Watkins has 2 double figure campaigns in the PL. Ings the same, or more.

The players are shit because the tactics are shit because the manager is shit.

I'm staggered anyone still doesn't see that.

Edited October 11, 2022 by StefanAVFC

[ROTTERDAM1982]

34 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Are you really asking for ONE example of potentially creative tactics, from a professional coach earning millions a year?

The bar may as well be underground.

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

Ings, no movement, no pace, or Archer, unconfirmed potential?

In place of?

Midfdield..   Dendonker/Sansom....in place of?

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

[PieFacE]

1 minute ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

Ings, no movement, no pace, or Archer, unconfirmed potential?

In place of?

Midfdield..   Dendonker/Sansom....in place of?

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

The way you writing this kinda gives me the impression that you believe the players out on the pitch are either

a) playing to the best of their ability
b) playing in a system that suites them

I believe none of the above to be true. Sure players and teams have off days. And if it was a one off you'd accept that. But when the same issues occur every game then you have to look elsewhere. 

[Tom13]

1 minute ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

Ings, no movement, no pace, or Archer, unconfirmed potential?

In place of?

Midfdield..   Dendonker/Sansom....in place of?

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

In place of McGinn, give us some balance. We don't have any pacey/tricky wingers because Steven feels he only needs one 

I also feel sorry for Buendia, he's not gonna get any intelligent runs from Watkins. He would have done from Archer/Ings.

[StefanAVFC]

4 minutes ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

Ings, no movement, no pace, or Archer, unconfirmed potential?

In place of?

Midfdield..   Dendonker/Sansom....in place of?

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

The apologism is outstanding.

We have no quality up front?

Watkins - 2 PL seasons 10+ goals

Ings - One of the best strikers in the PL in recent seasons

Either way, either we don't have quality up front and Gerrard didn't do enough in that area in the summer and pre-season, or we do, and it's on the coaching.

Without Kamara we have no quality in midfield? I don't agree, but if it's the case, who's fault is that? Who's had 2 transfer windows and a full pre-season to ensure that one midfielder being missing doesn't completely derail our only tactic?

What's your solution?

Edited October 11, 2022 by StefanAVFC

[Mic09]

1 minute ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

What I saw was passing the ball around the final third with no intention to get it to a striker or out wide with the aim to cross in to the danger area.

We played well as in we controlled the game, but yet again, Gerrard has failed to coach his team to get the ball in the danger zone. 

We have a good forward line that fails to get the ball in the face of the goal and within 12 yards of it for the 3rd game in a row. That is 100% on Gerrard. 

[PussEKatt]

Just now, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

And why is that not Gerrards fault ? He has had 2 transfer windows about 30 games 100% backing from the owners,and this is the result. ?! 

[villa4europe]

3 minutes ago, Mic09 said:

What I saw was passing the ball around the final third with no intention to get it to a striker or out wide with the aim to cross in to the danger area.

We played well as in we controlled the game, but yet again, Gerrard has failed to coach his team to get the ball in the danger zone. 

We have a good forward line that fails to get the ball in the face of the goal and within 12 yards of it for the 3rd game in a row. That is 100% on Gerrard. 

Strange isn't it, about the 80th minute mcginn and Konsa for nearly 2 minutes just played 10+ 5 yard passes to each other while jogging around to find space to get it back, absolutely nothing in front of them, nothing wide either, the alternative was a 30 yard ball back to mings, forest stayed in shape, compact, closed down all the space, we had all of the ball but could do absolutely nothing with it

Is that villa in control or forest?

[ChesterDad]

13 minutes ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

I'm always amazed at how you miss the point.

What alternatives were there last night?

Ings, no movement, no pace, or Archer, unconfirmed potential?

In place of?

Midfdield..   Dendonker/Sansom....in place of?

We are bereft of quality up front, and without Kamara , in midfield also. Tinkering around will not hide the fact that since Jack we win half as many games.The void has not been filled with Ings, Bailey or Emi, thats not Gerrards fault.

It’s totally his fault that we look bereft of ideas, cohesion, identity and so forth.

There is enough good players in this squad to be doing so much better than we are currently doing - Bertie and Morgan say hi 

[StefanAVFC]

Just now, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

Now somebody has just told me that you can'yt judge Emery at Arse on his signings because Edu made them, so how can you blame Gerrard for not signing players.

The implications were that he wanted to sign Bissouma, never going to happen unfortunately, and Sarr, who didn't sign for whatever reason. They both would have dramatically improved the team.

Carry on rating Watkins, and Ings, thats fine, thats your opinion, i don't . We are allowed to have different views

I asked you what your solution is. Clearly you don't think Gerrard is the issue, despite 99.99% of everyone else thinking differently and that the players aren't good enough. That Gerrard shouldn't be expected to be creative with tactics and the blame lies with the players.

So bear in mind, we're not in the transfer window right now, what should be expected of Gerrard to make us better? He's the manager, he's done his qualifications, he's earning a shit tonne of money. 

[ROTTERDAM1982]

4 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

Is that villa in control or forest?

Forest at home played like an away team.

Our options up front atm are Watkins up front, lack of control, poor movement, doesn't find pace, not brilliant in the air, so limit the space behind you and hes ineffective.

Ings, slow, limited ability outside the area, dangerous in the area, crowd him in the area.

Thats what they did. Theres limited danger elsewhere, PC is off form and Emi doesn't get many goals, so there whole tactic last night was keep it solid at the back and try and get something on the break or from a set piece, which is what they did.

We did it against Citeeeh, and will probably do it on Sunday.

Spuds do it every week under Conte

[StefanAVFC]

3 minutes ago, ROTTERDAM1982 said:

Forest at home played like an away team.

Our options up front atm are Watkins up front, lack of control, poor movement, doesn't find pace, not brilliant in the air, so limit the space behind you and hes ineffective.

Ings, slow, limited ability outside the area, dangerous in the area, crowd him in the area.

Thats what they did. Theres limited danger elsewhere, PC is off form and Emi doesn't get many goals, so there whole tactic last night was keep it solid at the back and try and get something on the break or from a set piece, which is what they did.

We did it against Citeeeh, and will probably do it on Sunday.

Spuds do it every week under Conte

I'm just baffled.

We have a squad containing Leon Bailey, Emi Buendia, Phillipe Coutinho, Ollie Watkins, Danny Ings and your post sounds defeatist that 'how could we expect to win when they sat back when we have so little quality?' against bottom of the table opposition.

As I said, the bar cannot get any lower.

Edited October 11, 2022 by StefanAVFC

[ROTTERDAM1982]

10 minutes ago, ChesterDad said:

There is enough good players in this squad to be doing so much better than we are currently doing - Bertie and Morgan say hi 

Thats the kind of quality you want at VP?

[StefanAVFC]

I'd kill for a winger who gets 7 goals and 7 assists in a season.

Dean Smith got those sort of numbers out of a player that you don't think is good enough.

Yet Gerrard can't get more than a single goal or assist out of Coutinho and Buendia and apparently they're the problem and not the coaching.

It's just completely nonsensical.

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by StefanAVFC

[Podster]

Our club is being run by fools, from owners right through the scouts who recommended that we spend millions on the leftover crap that no one else wanted, a whole bottle of bleach needs to be poured down the pan and the chain needs to be pulled.

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by Podster