Team shape, tactics and personnel

[hippo]

1 hour ago, djdabush said:

I think everyone knows how he likes to play now with full backs providing width and the two 8s covering them in transition. The problem last night was that McGinn and Ramsey didn't seem to be providing much cover and the defence got overwhelmed. I thought our discipline in general was lacking last night and that's why it ended up being so open and frentic. 

Agreed. Must confess Im not sold on the idea of fullbacks providing all the width. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by hippo

[Vive_La_Villa]

7 minutes ago, Zatman said:

I would say Leeds are probably the easiest team to study and play in the league. They dont change system and we played into there hands

Newcastle have taken 4 points from them

I guess they should be bottom of the league then? If only football was that simple. 

[Kiwivillan]

14 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

I havent said im opposed to traore playing up front either, but your point is why should bailey and you seem to have written him off already. Did you write buendia off when he struggled at the start?

Watkins has been useless most of the season. Falling over, poor finishing, runs into brick walls,easy to defend against and even his pressing is poor compared to last season 

 

No to Buendia. This whole string of argument is based on wanting Bailey CF based on no good reason than never played there but think he would do well. Maybe you're visionary like Wenger with Henry. I tracked Buendia for several seasons and knew pre season injury was affecting him. Bailey stats before he joined were worse than Bert for pressures and tracking back from memory and the sideshow unveiling was bizarre. I'm entirely unconvinced on sum total of performances pre injury. How he suddenly is obvious candidate to go CF is strange take for me

[Zatman]

Ings has to start at Newcastle. Ings, Sanson, Chambers In Watkins Konsa McGinn Out

It wont happen but it should 

[Demitri_C]

1 minute ago, Kiwivillan said:

No to Buendia. This whole string of argument is based on wanting Bailey CF based on no good reason than never played there but think he would do well. Maybe you're visionary like Wenger with Henry. I tracked Buendia for several seasons and knew pre season injury was affecting him. Bailey stats before he joined were worse than Bert for pressures and tracking back from memory and the sideshow unveiling was bizarre. I'm entirely unconvinced on sum total of performances pre injury. How he suddenly is obvious candidate to go CF is strange take for me

Im not arguing with you just to clarify just a friendly debate

Before you mentioned henry i was actually gonna say he has those type of qualities (not saying as good) but i think he can play up top. I believe he has played there too. Traore is very hot and cold for him. One week he looks excellent next he cant be asked. 

I think baoleys going to be tops for us once he gets his fitness issues sorted

[Kiwivillan]

Just now, Demitri_C said:

Im not arguing with you just to clarify just a friendly debate

Before you mentioned henry i was actually gonna say he has those type of qualities (not saying as good) but i think he can play up top. I believe he has played there too. Traore is very hot and cold for him. One week he looks excellent next he cant be asked. 

I think baoleys going to be tops for us once he gets his fitness issues sorted

I don't want to come across as unfriendly debate. I base off transfermarkt which is pretty reliable says never played CF. Bert has better than 1 in 2 goals at CF in +70 games since Chelsea days

[Zero7]

Yesterday's 2nd half performance was down to Gerrard, he didn't' want to paly the basket ball end to end game with Leeds. He wanted to be less adventurous and more compact and play a passing game. This is the identify he wants from our team, however it didn't work out yesterday, but probably will 7 times out of 10. I'd rather he continues to build our play in his vision than chop and change it like Smith and previous manager did to counter teams, which ends up a mess with many formations, styles and confused players. 

[tinker]

23 minutes ago, djdabush said:

I think everyone knows how he likes to play now with full backs providing width and the two 8s covering them in transition. The problem last night was that McGinn and Ramsey didn't seem to be providing much cover and the defence got overwhelmed. I thought our discipline in general was lacking last night and that's why it ended up being so open and frentic. 

I agree our defense was overwhelmed but for me it's was through the middle , with McGinn and Ramsey covering the fullbacks they struggled to help Douglas in the middle. 

Our defence has good enough players in it but they need help to stem the amount of chances teams are creating from the edge of our box, goal line clearances are not an affective way to defend over 90 minutes.

If we play this way against Newcastle then it will be a similar game to the Leeds one, hopefully Coutinho is fit because without him we are going to have problems outscoring our opponents. 

 

[Demitri_C]

19 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

I don't want to come across as unfriendly debate. I base off transfermarkt which is pretty reliable says never played CF. Bert has better than 1 in 2 goals at CF in +70 games since Chelsea days

Its not unfriendly from my part matw don't worry

I do wonder if gerrard will trial either of them as strikers. I got to be honest im starting to think cash in ollie. Just does not seem the same player anymore and has been found out this year

[duke313]

8 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Its not unfriendly from my part matw don't worry

I do wonder if gerrard will trial either of them as strikers. I got to be honest im starting to think cash in ollie. Just does not seem the same player anymore and has been found out this year

If we are going to experiment, playing Ramsey as the striker could be worth a shot.  He has certainly shown he has the composure in front of goal.

[Tomaszk]

7 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

You've totally missed the point lol.

The players on " monstrous money " you are referring to, are 2 out of a 25 man squad.

1 of them has directly been involved in multiple goals and assists since joining.

Well so has Digne.

The players who have been letting us down are the lesser players we have had with us in/from The Championship. Namely the defense/midfield ( Which they tried to and want to address ), is what let us down. If we had a Bissouma type on " monstrous money " yesterday we probably run away with that match.

So I've got no clue how it's the " old players on monstrous contracts " who are the issue here.

You make it sound as if we've signed 7 top tier old men on massive wages and we are failing. Lol

Hence why I'm saying, if we go by that logic coupled with the facts, MORE players on bigger money would probably see us do better ( Using this logic ).

I still don't get how the 2 players you are referring to have any bearing on any sort of result. Lol

And yes, we played VERY well in patches, I don't see how we score three top class goals if we didn't .

We also weren't playing against ourselves, the other team played a part in the match as well.

One of the reasons we scored those high class goals, was Philip Coutinho, an acquisition on " monstrous money ".

There is a reason most neutrals thought it was a brilliant match.

I don't give a hoot if neutrals enjoyed the match. Screw those swines.

I think we just disagree to be honest.

You're saying that the newer signings are contributing and if we get more (eg Bissouma), we'll be even better? I think that's your point?

We might be, we might not. Simply signing those players isn't what we should be focussing on though.

Firstly I disagree on Bissouma. Switch him for Luiz last night and we still draw, and probably have less control the ball in our own half.

Secondly, we drew and played terribly against a bad bad side. I don't care who is doing well if we, as a team, are playing terribly because the formation we play every game is easier to open up than a bag of crisps.

[hippo]

1 minute ago, CVByrne said:

Chambers is a utility player, covering Right Back as much as CB and sometime CDM. 

I'm talking about Gerrard signing a bonafide starting CB that is straight into the team like Gomez. 

I still think we'll sell Hause in summer. New contract was to protect the asset and bump his wages. 

Gomez ???  - Feck me ??? - in place of Konsa/Mings ?????    - Really can't see that solving anything at all. 

[hippo]

6 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Chambers is a utility player, covering Right Back as much as CB and sometime CDM. 

I'm talking about Gerrard signing a bonafide starting CB that is straight into the team like Gomez. 

I still think we'll sell Hause in summer. New contract was to protect the asset and bump his wages. 

That should do the trick   ! gulp.

[CVByrne]

Konsa and Targett are suffering the most this season due to the change in formation and our switch from having 2 holding midfielders and a 6 / 4 split defence to attack to a 5 / 5 defence to attack. The full back roles change from primarily defensive to primarily attacking. While we've spread the midfield out, primarily to cover the full backs leaving just Luiz centrally to cover the CBs. 

Add to this we now play out from the back, Konsa is as bad as a CB can be at this so the onus falls all to Mings to do this. Chambers is good on the ball so it will be interesting to see how he plays in place of Konsa on Sunday. 

I see big changes in summer in that central defensive group. A new CDM and a new CB will transform us there hopefully and stop the rot.

Nakamba / Chambers / Mings needs to be used this season too as that has the right balance.

[Demitri_C]

39 minutes ago, duke313 said:

If we are going to experiment, playing Ramsey as the striker could be worth a shot.  He has certainly shown he has the composure in front of goal.

We dont need to ramsey is doing excellently in his current position 

[hippo]

1 hour ago, Zero7 said:

Yesterday's 2nd half performance was down to Gerrard, he didn't' want to paly the basket ball end to end game with Leeds. He wanted to be less adventurous and more compact and play a passing game. This is the identify he wants from our team, however it didn't work out yesterday, but probably will 7 times out of 10. I'd rather he continues to build our play in his vision than chop and change it like Smith and previous manager did to counter teams, which ends up a mess with many formations, styles and confused players. 

Where you getting that from ? 

[tinker]

23 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Chambers is a utility player, covering Right Back as much as CB and sometime CDM. 

I'm talking about Gerrard signing a bonafide starting CB that is straight into the team like Gomez. 

I still think we'll sell Hause in summer. New contract was to protect the asset and bump his wages. 

Striaght to the medical team? 

[A'Villan]

23 minutes ago, hippo said:

Where you getting that from ? 

I'd agree with it. I think it was a huge pitfall of Smiths to stray from the identity within our approach he had cultivated in the championship and into our return to the PL. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by A'Villan

[hippo]

6 minutes ago, A'Villan said:

I'd agree with it. I think it was a huge pitfall of Smiths to stray from the identity within our approach he had cultivated in the championship and into our return to the PL. 

Sorry - Im a bit lost here:-

1.) What are you saying would work 7 times out of 10 ?

2.) Do you have any evidence to support that stat ? 

[A'Villan]

1 minute ago, hippo said:

Sorry - Im a bit lost here:-

1.) What are you saying would work 7 times out of 10 ?

2.) Do you have any evidence to support that stat ? 

I was supporting the essence of the message, I did not, and do not, claim to have any verifiable sources for Gerrard intending to do anything, nor to substantiate claims that his methods will produce at a certain frequency.