ml1dch Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 2 hours ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Pardon my ignorance as I know sweet nothing about Uighurs and China, but they are muslims right? And they performed a bunch of terrorism related attacks on Chinese officials? I just read that on reddit mind. I'm not condoning anything, but if that above is correct, what's the difference between that and guantanamo? Straight up question. Educate me. All the things that people above have said. For the Guantanamo Bay comparison to work, the US would have to be rounding up muslims and detaining them just for being muslim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Im guessing western countries aren’t and won’t do a single thing about it? I see India have banned TikTok due to data privacy concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 25, 2020 Moderator Share Posted July 25, 2020 6 hours ago, chrisp65 said: A slight over reach here: She wants here street name over on the island changed because it glorifies Richard Pennant, 1st Lord Penrhyn of Bangor who owned a sugar plantation in Jamaica. No, it’s got nothing to do with Dickie Pennant from North Wales, it’s the Welsh word for peninsular, and you live by a peninsular, so they called it peninsular street. The streets around and either side are called (in Welsh) railway street, dock street, and the seashore street. She’s a lawyer apparently. But doesn’t appear to have access to google translate or any interest in the native language of the country she lives in. This, allows people to dilute and divert. Same goes for the world famous Penny Lane. The was a slaver called (I think) Thomas Penny that sailed out of Liverpool. People just assumed it was named after him but didn't actually look into it to discover that the road was in existence, with that name before the slaver was ever born. And the Penny apparently refers to the toll that was imposed to cross the bridge on that road 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 25, 2020 Moderator Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Man he didnt hold back did he with his attacks. Career suicide for him. He is finished now. Doubt he'll be able to watch his football team ever again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam-AVFC Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Man he didnt hold back did he with his attacks. Career suicide for him. He is finished now. Shocking isn't it. I probably shouldn't have used the word breakdown because that almost suggests a mental health get out. I am absolutely amazed that Twitter deleted individual tweets but he is still able to spur more bile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 What did Wiley tweet? Articles only seem to mention the odd tweet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 25, 2020 Moderator Share Posted July 25, 2020 41 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: What did Wiley tweet? Articles only seem to mention the odd tweet. Well lets just say he hates Jews and he told us in unequivocal terms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 It’s bizarre. Especially during a time when there’s a whole worldwide movement to try and eradicate racism. A movement which I believe he is very supportive of. He’s destroyed everything he has built in a few moments of madness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 7 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: He’s destroyed everything he has built in a few moments of madness. I'm not sure a solid 20 hours of posting racism counts as "a few moments". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, ml1dch said: I'm not sure a solid 20 hours of posting racism counts as "a few moments". 20 hours?? Bloody hell. Still relative to the length of his career you know what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 2 hours ago, ml1dch said: All the things that people above have said. For the Guantanamo Bay comparison to work, the US would have to be rounding up muslims and detaining them just for being muslim. Fair play everything being said, that’s some what what's happened. Loads of muslims that’s completely innocent have been dragged into guantanamo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 17 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Fair play everything being said, that’s some what what's happened. Loads of muslims that’s completely innocent have been dragged into guantanamo. Quite probably. But if so, it's because they've been incorrectly suspected of something that they haven't done. Not just because they are muslim, which is what is happening in China. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Quite probably. But if so, it's because they've been incorrectly suspected of something that they haven't done. Not just because they are muslim, which is what is happening in China. Would the WW2 Japanese internment camps in the US be more apt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted July 25, 2020 Moderator Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Quite probably. But if so, it's because they've been incorrectly suspected of something that they haven't done. Not just because they are muslim, which is what is happening in China. Yes the China situtaion really is more akin to (plays Godwins Joker) Nazi Germany Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted July 25, 2020 Author Share Posted July 25, 2020 1 hour ago, ml1dch said: I'm not sure a solid 20 hours of posting racism counts as "a few moments". You would think if it was a hour or 2 he could argue and say he was drunk. But 20 hrs that is pure hate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Anti semitism is a weird one for me because it's seemingly so prevalent and yet growing in up in Kidderminster, working in the construction industry, being around brum and the west Midlands, now living in Germany... I don't think I know or have ever knowingly spoken to a Jewish person... I've seen Jewish people on various holidays and stuff but I don't really know the first thing about them, certainly not enough to ever garner any kind of hatred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted July 25, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted July 25, 2020 14 minutes ago, villa4europe said: Anti semitism is a weird one for me because it's seemingly so prevalent and yet growing in up in Kidderminster, working in the construction industry, being around brum and the west Midlands, now living in Germany... I don't think I know or have ever knowingly spoken to a Jewish person... I've seen Jewish people on various holidays and stuff but I don't really know the first thing about them, certainly not enough to ever garner any kind of hatred It's a complicated one. For a start there simply aren't many Jewish people, globally. It's something like 10m who consider themselves truly Jewish, and 20m who are considered 'Jewish enough' to be Jewish. There are multiple cities on the planet that could house every Jewish person in existence and have room left over. Personally I've met, knowingly, 2 Jewish people - a fellow student at uni who was in my seminar group, and a colleague. In the UK outside of Manchester and London there fundamentally aren't many Jewish people at all. Unfortunately that also helps contribute to the hatred against them, but we'll get to that. Historically, anti-Semitism has a few roots. Firstly you've got classic religious hatred - Christianity basically has a variety of anti-Semitism baked into it. Despite the Messiah being Jewish, the Bible is very keen to remind us that said Messiah was castigated by the Jewish community and they contributed quite significantly to him ending up dead. Even though it's a good thing he ended up dead (religion is silly). And then there's the stuff like Christians not being allowed to be money lenders which basically have a hated role in society more or less exclusively to Jewish people for centuries. And various other nonsense mythology that basically underlines Jews as being good to hate if you're a god fearing Christian. Then you have the complexities of Judaism and 'Jewishness' itself. Judaism isn't like most other religions. It's more than a religion. It's officially considered 'ethnoreligious' iirc, which is basically a get around on the fact it's both a religion and more than a religion. A great many Jewish people will tell you you can't 'become' Jewish - the religion itself in many of its sects works on the basis that only a person born to a Jewish mother is Jewish. For most aspects of the religion you can't just read the Torah and give up pork and think Jesus is silly and be 'in'. You're born into it, and that's it. That's then magnified by a few things, which is where the idea of Jewish people as a distinct race and identity gets going. Judaism has some of the aspects many cults of the modern day have built in. Most obviously the dietary stuff. This had the effect of isolating and differentiating Jewish communities. Aspects of life weren't fully compatible with non-Jewish life and end up meaning its easier for the Jewish community to stick together. Which is a vicious circle... within a vicious circle. Because the non-Jewish world kinda hates Jews anyway because of the Bible stuff, they're already more than a little ostracised. And then to that you add the fact they, like many communities, stick together, meaning you've got a nasty concoction to get some grim Othering going on. And then you throw the immigrant narrative in too. And then with the dawning of the idea of states and nations being cemented that all gets turbocharged when you can also chuck in the stupid idea that Jewish people aren't really 'of your' nation... And then in more recent times it's taken on a new angle, the idea that 'Jews run the world', which is ridiculous of course. This seems largely to have derived from the fact that in the 20th Century a number of influential and successful businesses and people were Jewish, the US global ascendance having seen it's interests align with that if many Jewish people (partly down to evangelicals who hate Jewish people but want them successful to bring about the end times - really), and also that statistically, in the West, Jewish people are proportionally more likely to be successful than the rest of the population. This becomes even more bizarre when you acknowledge that 150 years ago a common stereotype for a Jewish person was an untrustworthy beggar in essence. Of course the latter point isn't helped by the fact that there's not many Jewish people anyway... And then most recently the Israel narrative which is itself extremely complicated, way more complicated than most people accept, and people clumsily stumble into anti-Semitism when really their point is anti-Zionism... And that kinda boils it down. Ultimately there's all these prejudices and hate narratives and stereotypes, being projected onto a extremely small population, which supercharges the Othering. It's very easy to fall into hatred when there's all these cultural and historical touchstones telling you these people are bad, and you've never met one of these people to see the reality - that they're just people. There's far more subtlety to anti-Semitism than other forms of racism and that makes it a complete minefield. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted July 26, 2020 Share Posted July 26, 2020 Rachel Riley is that classic celebrity that’s waded in to an issue claiming the moral high ground and then dazzled by her own brilliance has kept on speaking on the subject. Her lengthy Channel 4 news interview did her no favours, she spouted stuff that if someone else had said it, she’d have been printing faked up tee shirts about it. But at the end of the day, she’s a tv celebrity, so she should get that as a caveat on anything she says or does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted July 26, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted July 26, 2020 Riley went on a smear campaign, including sharing propaganda videos that had been edited to mislead the viewer, personally attacking someone for position that is fundamentally opposed to what has been a cornerstone of their career, and which has extensive evidence against it. It's not really a surprise she's gotten a hammering over it. People don't like that kinda thing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted July 26, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted July 26, 2020 2 hours ago, chrisp65 said: Rachel Riley is that classic celebrity that’s waded in to an issue claiming the moral high ground and then dazzled by her own brilliance has kept on speaking on the subject. Her lengthy Channel 4 news interview did her no favours, she spouted stuff that if someone else had said it, she’d have been printing faked up tee shirts about it. But at the end of the day, she’s a tv celebrity, so she should get that as a caveat on anything she says or does. I had to unfollow her on twitter. Not that I think she’s wrong. I don’t know if she’s right or wrong to be honest. I don’t claim to know enough about the situation to say either way. But she was utterly relentless about it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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