sne Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 1 minute ago, sir_gary_cahill said: Why not? Are we ‘’better’’ than these other clubs? Once again, Heaton is our starting keeper and we can only field one at a time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 21 minutes ago, sne said: Barring a career ending injury I imagine Heaton will be our first choice keeper for this season and the next, at least. Can't see Kalinic sticking around for 2 years as a fringe player waiting for his chance to shine. Unless he's on crazy money and is content on not playing. And since we can only field 1 keeper at a time I struggle to see how he could have any kind of success here. I agree with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 6 minutes ago, sne said: He's already had success at other clubs, keeper of the year in Belgium a couple of seasons back so I'm sure he can do well again at another club. But can't see it being here. I wouldn’t have thought so now, stranger things have happened though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 I don't think he's a terrible keeper. he got off to a terrible start here and then a lot of things happened, out of his control. Injury, Steer finding form just as the team did, promotion, heavy spending and here we are. He's 4th choice and has lost his place in the national side. Can't imagine him nor Villa happy about the situation. Hope for him and us that he's off in January. And that we get at least some of the money we invested back. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 (edited) Someone certainly **** up. £7m for 9 games, then he can't even get on to the bench with our first choice injured? Got to be one of the biggest ever wastes of money for the club. Edited November 11, 2019 by Davkaus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferguson1 Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 15 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: If his attitude was poor, he shouldn’t have been signed in the first place, Smith should’ve done his homework Agreed, but also consider that the deal to bring him here may have agreed prior to Smith’s arrival or his intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 4 minutes ago, ferguson1 said: Agreed, but also consider that the deal to bring him here may have agreed prior to Smith’s arrival or his intervention. I very much doubt that was the case. If it was, the deal shouldn’t have gone ahead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 42 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: He's clearly 4th choice keeper at this point, I wouldn't be suprised if he never even gets another game for us, in fact that's probably what will happen unless we have a really bad injury crisis or all 3 of our other keepers suddenly turn to shit or both. And if he never gets another game for us, he isn't going to get the opportunity to show that he deserves the spot. If the fact that we wouldn't discard a 7(million) pound Croatia international goalkeeper is the reason why he will eventually get a game, then why hasn't his price tag justified putting him on even the substitutes bench before this? Smith isn't going to randomly decide mid way through the season, "Wait, I have this 7 million pound international goalkeeper in my squad, I should probably give him some game time", I very much doubt that he will play for us again but that’s not to say he isn’t a very good goalkeeper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 39 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: A lot of posters on here were praising Smith for his transfer policy of signing young, unproven players with potential and then he goes and signs Heaton. I’m not saying that Heaton is a bad keeper but he isn’t a long term signing. Kalinic will be first out of the door in January I imagine but I don’t think he has had enough opportunities here and won’t be surprised if he has success at another club here or elsewhere It's not Smith's policy, it's the club's policy. He specifically said that he wanted at least one experienced leader in the squad (Heaton was club captain at Burnley) because we have so many young, unproven players. The two go hand in hand. Heaton's here to set a professional example to the younger players. Heaton could still give us a good 3 or 4 seasons, and I imagine he'll be interested in a coaching role afterwards. Goalkeeper is the one position where I don't think there's any point in chasing potential. Good, proven goalkeepers are relatively cheap, and there isn't enough profit to be made on a young signing unless you unearth a world class goalkeeper, which is very unlikely. I don't really see how Kalinic could have been given more of a chance without selling Steer? Wolves game is the first time since Kalinic got injured where you might make a case for him playing instead of Nyland. You can't honestly say Kalinic should be ahead of Steer in the pecking order for cup games? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 1 minute ago, KentVillan said: It's not Smith's policy, it's the club's policy. He specifically said that he wanted at least one experienced leader in the squad (Heaton was club captain at Burnley) because we have so many young, unproven players. The two go hand in hand. Heaton's here to set a professional example to the younger players. Heaton could still give us a good 3 or 4 seasons, and I imagine he'll be interested in a coaching role afterwards. Goalkeeper is the one position where I don't think there's any point in chasing potential. Good, proven goalkeepers are relatively cheap, and there isn't enough profit to be made on a young signing unless you unearth a world class goalkeeper, which is very unlikely. I don't really see how Kalinic could have been given more of a chance without selling Steer? Wolves game is the first time since Kalinic got injured where you might make a case for him playing instead of Nyland. You can't honestly say Kalinic should be ahead of Steer in the pecking order for cup games? No point chasing potential goalkeepers? They win you the most points in my opinion. We paid £7m for Kalinic and he is Croatia’s number one. I think Steer has been unfairly treated since the play of victory though, almost discarded by Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 2 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: No point chasing potential goalkeepers? They win you the most points in my opinion. We paid £7m for Kalinic and he is Croatia’s number one. I think Steer has been unfairly treated since the play of victory though, almost discarded by Smith Why do we look for long-term potential in the transfer market? It's so we can buy cheap and sell high, and build a team that will stick together over several seasons. With a goalkeeper you can do all of that while still buying proven quality - (a) because keepers are cheap, and (b) because they play well into their late 30s / early 40s. There just isn't the same incentive for us to look for a young bargain with bags of potential. Contrast with outfield, where we can't afford (at this stage) to buy proven top-flight quality up front, because it would cost about £70m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 We might need to avoid signing Croatians at this rate, probably a better striker than Balaban if we tried him there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 22 minutes ago, KentVillan said: Why do we look for long-term potential in the transfer market? It's so we can buy cheap and sell high, and build a team that will stick together over several seasons. With a goalkeeper you can do all of that while still buying proven quality - (a) because keepers are cheap, and (b) because they play well into their late 30s / early 40s. There just isn't the same incentive for us to look for a young bargain with bags of potential. Contrast with outfield, where we can't afford (at this stage) to buy proven top-flight quality up front, because it would cost about £70m. I agree that in the main, it is a good strategy to buy young and sell at a profit but you need a mix, we did it with Konsa and Wesley. To buy experience is also needed, we did it in the Summer with Heaton. Long term potential is a prerequisite for this club, how do you know we can’t afford a striker worth £70m? I think we can but we just aren’t in a position to do it currently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 17 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: I agree that in the main, it is a good strategy to buy young and sell at a profit but you need a mix, we did it with Konsa and Wesley. To buy experience is also needed, we did it in the Summer with Heaton. Long term potential is a prerequisite for this club, how do you know we can’t afford a striker worth £70m? I think we can but we just aren’t in a position to do it currently I don't get your point. Surely, if we're not in a position to do it currently that means we can't afford it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 26 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: I don't get your point. Surely, if we're not in a position to do it currently that means we can't afford it? If we weren’t verging on being embroiled in a relegation battle then we’d do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laughable Chimp Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 (edited) 11 minutes ago, sir_gary_cahill said: If we weren’t verging on being embroiled in a relegation battle then we’d do it 70million on just a striker? I heavily doubt it. The only teams in the PL to shell out that kind of money for only one player have been Arsenal and Man United this summer transfer window and I'd take a gander and say we probably don't have near the amount of financial resources that they do nor make enough profit to circumvent FFP. And yes, even if we pull more shady tricks to get around FFP we still probably won't dump that kind of money on one singular player. Edited November 11, 2019 by Laughable Chimp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 2 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said: 70million on just a striker? I heavily doubt it. The only teams in the PL to shell out that kind of money for only one player have been Arsenal and Man United this summer transfer window and I'd take a gander and say we probably don't have near the amount of financial resources that they do nor make enough profit to circumvent FFP. And yes, even if we pull more shady tricks to get around FFP we still probably won't dump that kind of money on one singular player. I think you are correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 My thinking has always been (this is just a hunch and nothing ITK) there was a fall out after the WBA game. Kalinic was first choice, not looking that great but was needed time to settle. He went off at half time v WBA with concussion apparently yet was on the bench 7 days later v Stoke. I thought if you were concussed you had to have at least 10 days off but could be wrong on that. Who knows maybe there was argument at half time and he's been frozen out since? I'd still have him ahead of Nyland in the pecking order. Odd he didn't leave in August anyway. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zab6359 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 13 hours ago, sir_gary_cahill said: I agree that in the main, it is a good strategy to buy young and sell at a profit but you need a mix, we did it with Konsa and Wesley. To buy experience is also needed, we did it in the Summer with Heaton. Long term potential is a prerequisite for this club, how do you know we can’t afford a striker worth £70m? I think we can but we just aren’t in a position to do it currently Firstly not a chance in hell we have that sort of money to spend on any individual player, secondly no £70m striker worth the salt would currently come to us, thirdly if we did have £70M it could be spent far wiser SGC. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_gary_cahill Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 On 12/11/2019 at 09:30, zab6359 said: Firstly not a chance in hell we have that sort of money to spend on any individual player, secondly no £70m striker worth the salt would currently come to us, thirdly if we did have £70M it could be spent far wiser SGC. Not in our current predicament, maybe in a few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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