villa89 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 10 hours ago, rodders0223 said: Was he ever that good? Yes, he was phenomenal for a number of years. Truly brilliant. The death of the old school goalie did it for him and I think his confidence crumbled when City said he was no more. I must have been watching a different player to you. Couldn't dive to his left and let in howler after howler. Got away with murder when he was "England's number one" as there was such a dearth of goalkeeping talent. First thing Pep did was bin him off which says a lot. If he was ever actually any good his career wouldn't have plummeted like a stone. The tin pot league he plays in now is about his level. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 From his Birmingham loan to about 2015 a good 5 or 6 years he was absolutely top. People trying to rewrite history I remember a lot of games especially in the CL where he was an absolute brick wall. The drop at 28/29 was staggering though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 @rodders0223 is right - he was an unbelievably good goalkeeper from the Blues loan up until Guardiola joined Man City. Pretty sure he holds the Premier League record for golden gloves (fewest goals conceded in a season). Terrible goalkeepers don’t do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) 11 hours ago, rodders0223 said: Was he ever that good? Yes, he was phenomenal for a number of years. Truly brilliant. The death of the old school goalie did it for him and I think his confidence crumbled when City said he was no more. See I'm not sure he ever was. No I know there's little room for nuance on the internet, it's generally a case of being either the best thing ever or the worst thing ever but if we walk this back to the original comment by @KAZZAM who was questioning if any player had had such a big drop off that wasn't related to injury (see that nuance thing rearing it's head again?) then I question whether Joe Hart ever really hit those heights. Sure, he left Manchester City to do a tour of mid table football in Italy and England but he didn't leave Manchester City the European powerhouse, he left a club who were winning silverware domestically but seen as dark horses at best in Europe. The Man City going Super Saiyan thing happened when Guardiola turned up and the first thing he did was decide the goalkeeper needed upgrading, so it's here where I say maybe Joe Hart was just a very good keeper who had a bloody good run. He's got the England caps and winners medals to back it up but he was never a star player, never a galactico and never in the conversation for best goalkeeper in the world. He was a guy who was at Manchester City before they got the money and was talented enough to hang for a while, but they wouldn't have gone out and bought him if he'd been playing at another club. This stuff happens a lot with good players who happen to be in great teams. The nose dive claim is a bit much too. After Manchester City Joe Hart still found time to have a year in Serie A which is probably a cool experience, and he won a domestic treble with Celtic just last season. The guy has had a great career. He's played 750 senior games, been to the World Cup, the Euros and can tell himself that pretty much every time he's been moved on (certainly at Manchester City and England) it's been down to a managerial change but I just don't think he was ever in that absolute top tier for quality which is what Guardiola was looking for and what Manchester City needed when it came to moving up to the level they are at right now. Edited February 23 by The_Rev 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) 22 minutes ago, bobzy said: @rodders0223 is right - he was an unbelievably good goalkeeper from the Blues loan up until Guardiola joined Man City. Pretty sure he holds the Premier League record for golden gloves (fewest goals conceded in a season). Terrible goalkeepers don’t do that. If he was so good how did his career nosedive so badly? He should have been at his peak when he was 30 not a washed up has been. As for the golden glove, that's simply down to playing for the best team that has the best defence and keeps possession the most. He wasn't terrible but nowhere near a top level goalkeeper. At his best he was comparable to Pickford. Edited February 23 by villa89 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 6 minutes ago, bobzy said: @rodders0223 is right - he was an unbelievably good goalkeeper from the Blues loan up until Guardiola joined Man City. Pretty sure he holds the Premier League record for golden gloves (fewest goals conceded in a season). Terrible goalkeepers don’t do that. He has the joint wins with Cech but none of his wins actually put him in the top 20 ever seasons which is strange 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 11 minutes ago, villa89 said: If he was so good how did his career nosedive so badly? He should have been at his peak when he was 30 not a washed up has been. As for the golden glove, that's simply down to playing for the best team that has the best defence and keeps possession the most. He wasn't terrible but nowhere near a top level goalkeeper. At his best he was comparable to Pickford. I haven’t paid massive attention to Hart really, but his confidence seemed to get knocked around the England setup. The Golden Glove point just isn’t true. Man City came 3rd in his first season winning it, then 1st, then 2nd and then 2nd again. Obviously you’ll keep more clean sheets in a better side, but he was a big part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted February 23 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23 1 hour ago, villa89 said: If he was so good how did his career nosedive so badly? He should have been at his peak when he was 30 not a washed up has been. As for the golden glove, that's simply down to playing for the best team that has the best defence and keeps possession the most. He wasn't terrible but nowhere near a top level goalkeeper. At his best he was comparable to Pickford. De Gea also lost form around 30 and he was a very good keeper. Maybe keeper's just don't have the shelf life they used too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Rds1983 said: De Gea also lost form around 30 and he was a very good keeper. Maybe keeper's just don't have the shelf life they used too. Was he? Good shot stopper but terrible dealing with crosses, penalties and useless with his feet. Also had plenty of howlers throughout the years. Again if he was really any good he wouldn't on job seekers now. Edited February 23 by villa89 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilS Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 I seem to remember his career started to go downhill not long after the Head & Shoulders advert. Up to that point he was quite highly rated, then his stock kind of plummeted not long afterwards. Could shampoo in the eye responsible for his howlers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 20 minutes ago, Rds1983 said: De Gea also lost form around 30 and he was a very good keeper. Maybe keeper's just don't have the shelf life they used too. Neuer, Courtois, Ter Stegen, Sommer are still playing at top clubs. Alisson and Ederson hitting 30 now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted February 23 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23 Between them Hart and De Gea have: 4 team of the year awards 6 golden glove awards 4 League Cup wins 3 FA Cup wins 3 Premier League titles 2 European u21 titles 1 European u17 title 2 Europa League wins. Title winning teams are not known for having bad goalkeeper's, and especially don't keep them as number 1 for years. Trying to suggest they were not good keepers is complete revisionism and verging on idiocy. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 53 minutes ago, Zatman said: Neuer, Courtois, Ter Stegen, Sommer are still playing at top clubs. Alisson and Ederson hitting 30 now Martinez 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 5 hours ago, Mic09 said: When he sits down at the age of 80 I am sure he will consider his career a massive success. Some retirement! Poor bastard doesn't even get to sit down for another 44 years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 23 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23 19 hours ago, The_Rev said: Was he ever that good? Joined Manchester City before they won the lottery, stayed in the team for a few years and eventually got upgraded on. Still went on to win half a dozen trophies after Pep binned him. Correct. He also managed a chronic back problem throughout his career which is kept quiet which probably a explained a dip in his ability Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom13 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: Correct. He also managed a chronic back problem throughout his career which is kept quiet which probably a explained a dip in his ability Carrying that neck around probably caused that 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 How much more of a word removed do you have to be than to play for Man City AND the Blues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 23 VT Supporter Share Posted February 23 1 hour ago, DJ_Villain said: How much more of a word removed do you have to be than to play for Man City AND the Blues? You’re obsessed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 He's got some neck announcing his retirement like he's Messi or something! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don_Simon Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 (edited) 23 hours ago, Leeroy said: Yes that’s the West Midlands mate Shropshire really though. Edited February 23 by Don_Simon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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