Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[Xann]

3 hours ago, peterms said:

There are very good reasons not to take Russia's word...

Forget heat signatures, this homes in on the brain and causes confusion.

Formulated by evil scientists, cruelly mutating software developed for the already cruelly mutated advertising industry.

Propaganda refined to new levels of toxicity.

Most effective when deployed in a delicately balanced situation.

The book of this misadventure should be called 'How To Make A Man Strangle Himself'.

 

• 

Here he is again! Mr Glamour Puss!

Saw a German fellow on FB refer to him as Lucrezia Borgia. I was thinking Livia Drusilla.

 

 

Faux Outrage by Red Top more like.

Another excremental eruption from Rectal Rupert's gargantuan shit volcano.

 

Let's remind ourselves of Corbyn's actual stance again...

 

On 3/15/2018 at 19:04, blandy said:

Even Corbyn's (sort of) joining in now  - this is much better.

Who is actually dancing to Putin's pipes here, eh?

 

World's gone mad, Guvnor.

[bickster]

9 minutes ago, Xann said:

Who is actually dancing to Putin's pipes here, eh?

 

Sadly May and Corbyn and everyone else who is arguing about it and discussing it

The aim is to sow discord, its working

Which is exactly why Corbyn should have been given access to the Top Secret info, so May is however making it worse

[chrisp65]

1 hour ago, blandy said:

Are they?

Is it like Iraq?

I get the scepticism, I share it. What I don't get is the equivalence argument.

As I've read it, there was an undisputed attack on two people, a British (Russian) Spy, in the UK, using a Chemical Weapon. A spy who Putin had implied would "Kick the bucket" for treachery.

Porton Down have analysed the chemical weapon and identified the type as being of a type developed by Russia.

Those are all, I think, undisputed facts.

There's people in the media and on Blogs, some more expert than others in various fields, saying either it's definitely traceable directly to Russia, or essentially, it's Russian... but might have been half-inched by some un-named bad guys and then used on the British Russian Spy and his daughter.

There are various crazies saying it was the Jews or it was Porton Down, or the Americans, but mostly people acknowledge links to Russia.

I don't see the parallel to politicians making up claims about CWs for which there was no evidence. Like millions of others I was completely against the Iraq war and didn't believe the grounds for it. Even in the build up to it, you could see it was a "fix". This is different. Sure publicly we don't have the same info as the Security services, for entirely valid reasons. The OPCW have been called in - neutral verification if you like.

The Russians have been trolling us in their media, their embassy twitter feeds and so on - not just denying, or responding with [whatever] but actual trolling.

It's very different to me.

 

For what it's worth. The only point I was making with the iraqi thing is that I have a deep deep mistrust of any government telling me anything that is a selected redacted version of something that has to be 'secret'. I'd obviously give the Russians or the Iraqi's or the USA even less of a hearing, they're worse. But there is a long track record of governments being liars.

All governments are liars and murderers.

Ours lies and murders less than some others. I am not saying the russians didn't do it. But, the fact that we have an ex russian spy (or whatever he was) here in the first place, shows we are in the game. As such, I would presume we are not going to be told everything AND come out of this whiter than white.

I don't believe it was a zionist capitalist lizard conspiracy. I also don't believe T May is acting purely in the best open and honest interest of the whole public. She always has an agenda and an audience.

Personally, I couldn't care less if the russians are trolling people on twitter. That wouldn't be sufficient provocation for me to start taking decisions with unknown consequences.

But my worry remains the same, I'm being asked to just trust someone I have absolutely no faith in due to their terrible track record on everything they've ever done or stood for to date.

[Risso]

2 hours ago, blandy said:

I agree there is an institutional bias in the BBC - whoever is Gov't gets a more favourable, slightly, coverage than the opposition. I think its been this way for a good while.

Corbyn chose to wear that ridiculous hat of his own free will.  He seems to go out of his way to dress like an undergraduate from Walthamstow Poly, so he can hardly complain when people use pictures of him dressed like a pillock.

[blandy]

1 hour ago, chrisp65 said:

All governments are liars and murderers....

You said that deliberately, didn’t you. Now I’ve got an SFA ear worm. But, yeah Putin - the man don’t give a ****, to stray on topic

[mjmooney]

26 minutes ago, Risso said:

Corbyn chose to wear that ridiculous hat of his own free will.  He seems to go out of his way to dress like an undergraduate from Walthamstow Poly. 

What's wrong with that? 

[chrisp65]

11 minutes ago, blandy said:

You said that deliberately, didn’t you. Now I’ve got an SFA ear worm. But, yeah Putin - the man don’t give a ****, to stray on topic

I did! I really did!

[snowychap]

[peterms]

[blandy]

1 hour ago, peterms said:

Together with that Corbyn pic, that proves the bbc is pro Tory anti labour, right, comrades?

[chrisp65]

[villakram]

On 3/17/2018 at 15:53, bickster said:

You do realise that its the Kremlin that accuses Ukraine of being Fascist?

You might want to look up what fascism really is.

You might want to read up on what factually occurred there.

[Brumerican]

2 minutes ago, villakram said:

You might want to read up on what factually occurred there.

Somebody ate a raw spud whilst embracing nihilism ?

[bickster]

4 hours ago, villakram said:

You might want to read up on what factually occurred there.

I already know but there’s a world of difference between some fascists in a democracy and a fascist state. Russia is actually much closer to the latter than Ukraine. @Awol was talking about the state of Ukraine which you then said was fascist. It isn’t. 

[Risso]

8 hours ago, chrisp65 said:

Can’t see much to disagree with there.

[tonyh29]

11 hours ago, peterms said:

Twitter is in overdrive that his tie isn’t the right size and has been shopped so I’m calling fake 

[Awol]

New German Foreign Minister Heiko Maas briefing that Russia is a “difficult partner” but that the Skripal poisoning is a “bilateral issue” between the UK and Russia.

So they’ve accepted Russia did it but don’t care. Great to see Germany showing the same level of solidarity as it did over Litvinenko - when we were still firmly EU and NATO members.

[blandy]

Who'd have guessed

Quote

Almost as soon as the polls had closed, Andrei Kondrashov, spokesman for Mr Putin’s election campaign, drew a direct line between the victory and the poisoning of former spy Sergei Skripal in Salisbury....“The West did not take our mentality into account,” Mr Kondrashov said. “The Skripal scandal has mobilised the nation, increased turnout, and has consolidated citizens around Vladimir Putin.” 

 

[Chindie]

All the rigging probably helped as well.

And the overtly hostile environment for opposition to Putin. Right down to open mockery on TV.

[Dante_Lockhart]