Neil Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 (edited) I still maintain that there's little point in changing up the manager until we get a new owner, just not attractive enough to anyone who would have being successful with the villa at heart. I also don't think he'll be going anywhere until the ownership changes. Why would they need to have Villa "at heart". Sounds like at sentimental clap trap to me. We need somebody to come in and win us some games, light a fire under them. Simple as. Love how you completely changed my post, "success with the villa at heart" is very different to having "villa at heart"... What difference would it make to the meaning? I want someone who understands the financial constraints and situation at the villa, happy to accept them and genuially believes they can do well with the Villa. Not some waste of time journey manager out of work looking for a quick pay day. I feel the former doesn't really exist, someone who genuinally wants to be successful would require our situation to have improved which can only happen under a new owner. Whether they are any kind of Villa fan, or have villa at heart is of little or no consequence...as long as when they're accepting the job they truly feel they can be more successful with us. And by situation, I mean a club who isn't wanted by the owner and has been clearly put up for sale... Edited November 9, 2014 by Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 All the excuses are becoming a little desperate now 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post markavfc40 Posted November 9, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted November 9, 2014 (edited) I do think he will do better, once the spectacularly bad luck with injures changes and allows him to play a team something like the one he's tried to build. A new manager will have the same budget limits, so I think the budget is pretty relevant. Overall I think even most of his critics agree that his signings have been decent value for the pennies paid, so in that department I think he's a very good manager for us to have. So my plan, if I were Randy Lerner (and my mum was still telling me not to spend money on my football team), would be to see how things go until January at least. If the situation was desperate, it might be worth bringing in a new manager mainly for the short-term boost. But really I'm interested in seeing what Aston Villa could be like if, for once, they managed to hold their nerve and give a not untalented manager a chance to build a team according to his vision over more than just a couple of seasons. If you zoom out and look at our season so far we've done better-than-expected in five or six of the games, as expected in four of them, and worse-than-expected in two of them. All this more or less without our best player and only real goalscorer. I agree that he has purchased some decent players and now think he has assembled a decent squad where has in his previous two seasons we had a decent first 11 and next to nothing to back it up. What I don't have a clue about is what he is trying to do with these players. We have no defined style of play. In possession of the ball 90% of the time we look clueless apart from the odd occasion when we spring a counter attack which has become way too predictable. More often than not we put a handful of passes together before one of the midfielders then realizes that there is no movement ahead of him passes it back to a centre back who then either lumps it forward or gives it to Guzan to lump forward and we give away possession. We aren't talking about a manager that has been here five minutes. We are talking about a guy who has been here two and a half years which really should have been long enough to have put in place something in terms of how he wants us to play. It is not just our style of play that is the issue though. It is the character and lack of belief in the team that is alarming. We go a goal down and 99% of the time we fold and lose due to a lack belief that we can come back. Why hasn't the manager at least instilled some backbone into these players he has assembled? The likes of Guzan, Vlaar, Hutton, Baker, Delph, Weimann, Senderos all seem like strong characters but as a team we are weak minded. You look at the results overall this season in isolation then you could argue we have not done much worse than expected. However that ignores the fact that we had a very good start to the season which should have given us the springboard, forward momentum and confidence to have meant that a seven game run of 6 defeats, 1 draw and one goal should have been unthinkable. It was the managers job to ensure we fed off that good start but the opposite has happened. You also of course cannot look at this season in isolation. This latest poor run of 7 games is on the back end of a run of 4 points from 27 at the end of last season which was accompanied by some of the most gutless football I imagine any of us have witnessed. Many excuses have been used for our poor results and dire performances under Lambert and the latest one now doing the rounds again seems to be injuries and suspensions. Unfortunately though every team will get these and they don't excuse the fact that even with a full strength side, or near to it, we have still served up directionless dross. Lambert has been afforded far more grace than his predecessor who also worked under financial restrictions, he actually had a transfer pot of minus 20 mill, who also had injuries to key players in Dunne, Bent and Petrov, and I think we are now past the stage of making excuses for Lambert. Two and half years down the line, a big turnover in players and changes to back room staff and yet zero improvement in results and performances is unfortunately enough evidence to show that Lambert now needs to go. Edited November 9, 2014 by markavfc40 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 (edited) Mark you have summed up my views perfectly thanks. Not a rant, but a clear dissection of the reality. Amongst people I know this view is shared identically by all. Completely agree with every word and for me this balanced view says all there is to say. I really don't understand how anybody can disagree. Edited November 9, 2014 by terrytini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 The players are still playing for the manager and are giving it their all, we needed a result today and we got it and for once we had a few lucky breaks. We have played good in our last 3 games despite all the pressure and the bad run and have been unlucky to of not picked up more than 1 point, anybody think different?. Yes, we didn't play well today or against QPR. To claim they are both good performances is a bit much. Today we defended well and got a bit lucky that they were off form upfront and against QPR we kept the ball better and did absolutely nothing with it. We did play well today, we deserved the point and had some decent chances, with better attacking options we would of caused alot more danger for West Ham. We did play well vs QPR, we were all over them in the first half and they just got the the breaks in that game and came away with a nearly 100% goals to chances conversion rate. You probably spent more time in the match thread moaning than actually watching and analysing the game. What decent chances did we have today? And were they better than the chances sakho, downing, carrol and jenkinson had? If your analysis of the last 3 games is that we were good in all of them then yes i probably am doing something different. If Bunnski's analysis is that we 'played well' in any of the last 3 games, he's smoking something powerful. We were poor in all of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 All the excuses are becoming a little desperate now Crackpot has very low expectations for our manager and in the main our team. It seems normal to him we should be losing against bottom of the league after beating a good Liverpool side, scoring 1 goal in 7 games, but thats his opinion and his entitiled to it, but here's mine. 95% of us have a little more expectation of a team which has quality enough to beat Man City, Liverpool, Chelsea last season, I just can't see we are building on these wins, I see no consistancy in this team with Lambert in charge none at all and thats nothing to do with budgets or injuries. No one can seem to answer a question have asked many times before, which is, how we beat the likes of Man City and then come no where against an off form side. This is a measure of Lambert's tenure here, no progress. Im not sure what 'Crackpot' you are waiting for, but we haven't had any change in the last 2 seasons, fighting for relegation, so im not sure its gonna change this season under Lambert either. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanky Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Losing against top sides is to be expected, but it is the manner of the defeat. Look at QPR against Man City and Chelsea and then compare our games against the same teams. To be honest it is worrying the amount of momentum that the teams below us are gathering. Burnley away could well become a massive game if it wasn't already. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 The excuse merchants have very low standards and seem content with this club being at the arse end of the table. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 I do think he will do better, once the spectacularly bad luck with injures changes and allows him to play a team something like the one he's tried to build. A new manager will have the same budget limits, so I think the budget is pretty relevant. Overall I think even most of his critics agree that his signings have been decent value for the pennies paid, so in that department I think he's a very good manager for us to have. So my plan, if I were Randy Lerner (and my mum was still telling me not to spend money on my football team), would be to see how things go until January at least. If the situation was desperate, it might be worth bringing in a new manager mainly for the short-term boost. But really I'm interested in seeing what Aston Villa could be like if, for once, they managed to hold their nerve and give a not untalented manager a chance to build a team according to his vision over more than just a couple of seasons. If you zoom out and look at our season so far we've done better-than-expected in five or six of the games, as expected in four of them, and worse-than-expected in two of them. All this more or less without our best player and only real goalscorer. I agree that he has purchased some decent players and now think he has assembled a decent squad where has in his previous two seasons we had a decent first 11 and next to nothing to back it up. What I don't have a clue about is what he is trying to do with these players. We have no defined style of play. In possession of the ball 90% of the time we look clueless apart from the odd occasion when we spring a counter attack which has become way too predictable. More often than not we put a handful of passes together before one of the midfielders then realizes that there is no movement ahead of him passes it back to a centre back who then either lumps it forward or gives it to Guzan to lump forward and we give away possession. We aren't talking about a manager that has been here five minutes. We are talking about a guy who has been here two and a half years which really should have been long enough to have put in place something in terms of how he wants us to play. It is not just our style of play that is the issue though. It is the character and lack of belief in the team that is alarming. We go a goal down and 99% of the time we fold and lose due to a lack belief that we can come back. Why hasn't the manager at least instilled some backbone into these players he has assembled? The likes of Guzan, Vlaar, Hutton, Baker, Delph, Weimann, Senderos all seem like strong characters but as a team we are weak minded. You look at the results overall this season in isolation then you could argue we have not done much worse than expected. However that ignores the fact that we had a very good start to the season which should have given us the springboard, forward momentum and confidence to have meant that a seven game run of 6 defeats, 1 draw and one goal should have been unthinkable. It was the managers job to ensure we fed off that good start but the opposite has happened. You also of course cannot look at this season in isolation. This latest poor run of 7 games is on the back end of a run of 4 points from 27 at the end of last season which was accompanied by some of the most gutless football I imagine any of us have witnessed. Many excuses have been used for our poor results and dire performances under Lambert and the latest one now doing the rounds again seems to be injuries and suspensions. Unfortunately though every team will get these and they don't excuse the fact that even with a full strength side, or near to it, we have still served up directionless dross. Lambert has been afforded far more grace than his predecessor who also worked under financial restrictions, he actually had a transfer pot of minus 20 mill, who also had injuries to key players in Dunne, Bent and Petrov, and I think we are now past the stage of making excuses for Lambert. Two and half years down the line, a big turnover in players and changes to back room staff and yet zero improvement in results and performances is unfortunately enough evidence to show that Lambert now needs to go. 100% reason to sack Lambert. Please pass this on the Lerner!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 1 point from 7 games 1 goal in 7 games Poor standard of football We are an atrocious football team. Almost anti football. Lambert has to go. I refuse to believe that there isn't a manager out there who can do a better job with the same resources. The thing is, I don't think our squad is that bad, which makes the dross served up even more disappointing. Lambert has purchased some reasonable players but he seems to have no idea on how to use them or produce a team that can play anything other than dismal football. That is why, more than anything, we need a change. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Losing against top sides is to be expected, but it is the manner of the defeat. Look at QPR against Man City and Chelsea and then compare our games against the same teams. To be honest it is worrying the amount of momentum that the teams below us are gathering. Burnley away could well become a massive game if it wasn't already. But it shouldn't be expected. Do you think a off form Liverpool went into a unbeaten Chelsea team expecting to be beaten. Do you think Liverpool went to Real Madrid an expected a loss. Yes they realise its going to be difficult, but you should never expect to lose and I think this is a problem under Lambert. He goes into games now expecting the loss, its obvious because the way he sets the team up and this rubs off on players, it really does.........................! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onmeedson Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Captain of the Titanic for me along with his quintet playing why why why delusion da da dara da Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanky Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Losing against top sides is to be expected, but it is the manner of the defeat. Look at QPR against Man City and Chelsea and then compare our games against the same teams. To be honest it is worrying the amount of momentum that the teams below us are gathering. Burnley away could well become a massive game if it wasn't already.But it shouldn't be expected. Do you think a off form Liverpool went into a unbeaten Chelsea team expecting to be beaten. Do you think Liverpool went to Real Madrid an expected a loss. Yes they realise its going to be difficult, but you should never expect to lose and I think this is a problem under Lambert. He goes into games now expecting the loss, its obvious because the way he sets the team up and this rubs off on players, it really does.........................! I mean as fans. Due to the nature of money in the game now. Players is a different story, and I agree here. Although I'm not sure the way he sets the team up is any different any week which is part of our problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimzk5 Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 I really want to ask him why he persists in playing a formation that doesn't suit us & definitely doesn't use the strengths of the players we have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob182 Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 The excuse merchants have very low standards and seem content with this club being at the arse end of the table.Excuse merchants? That's a new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 I really want to ask him why he persists in playing a formation that doesn't suit us & definitely doesn't use the strengths of the players we have. Tell the Lambert supporters please. This is the defining reason a change would be positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 I think on the whole, Lambert has purchased quite well with the money he has been given. Great! Hire him as a scout! But is he getting the best out of the players that we have fit and available? Is he able to motivate them? Are they playing to their best ability? Does his team play an effective style of football. If not, is it at least good to watch? For me, the answers to these questions are no. Is there a manager out there, who would come to us in our current situation and do a better job with the players we already have? I **** hope so. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 The excuse merchants have very low standards and seem content with this club being at the arse end of the table. What a load of rubbish. Nobody is content with where we are. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshVilla Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 (edited) I really want to ask him why he persists in playing a formation that doesn't suit us & definitely doesn't use the strengths of the players we have. Because he's limited tactically and it's one of the main reasons why he's such a woeful football manager It is clear to all and sundry that what were doing simply isn't working but instead of making changes he refuses to and "we go again" every weekend with the same old underperforming players I doubt other teams even bother scouting us Edited November 9, 2014 by AshVilla 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 The same arguments (tactics, movement, progression, give him time) were all being said last December: http://www.villatalk.com/index.php/topic/10485-why-paul-lambert-should-get-the-sack/page-40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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