Star Wars: Disney Era

[villa4europe]

16 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

I watched Rogue 1, and the first two of the new trilogy. Rogue One was enjoyable enough, the other two were terrible.

The whole thing (Disney in general) it's abundantly clear is to pump out as much "content" as they can, with new cheaper actors and they just use the old legacy characters for bait and switch. Quality doesn't matter in the slightest. It's the Netflix model, churn out lots and lots of content and surely one or two of the things you've pumped out with be a hit. 

They're all copying the model, HBO now making GoT into a franchise with a million shows. It's all to justify monthly streaming subscriptions. This whole business model will collapse once the next recession hits because the easiest thing in the world to do when you need to cut your expenditure is bin off Disney+ and Netflix. 

Don't disagree but Netflix et Al even marvel have shown that they'll take more risks, Netflix is scattergun cover all bases, star wars is play it as safe as possible home comforts 

[Brumerican]

Just now, CVByrne said:

they just use the old legacy characters for bait and switch.

Or to save a show . Mark Hamill owed those arseholes nothing after his public humiliation yet he still came out looking like a boss.

This entire house of cards is built on those legacy characters and they have all been abused to hell.

[rjw63]

7 hours ago, Brumerican said:

 

This entire house of cards is built on those legacy characters and they have all been abused to hell.

[Brumerican]

Just now, rjw63 said:

Would be great casting.

Kev In Space eh !

[Xela]

20 minutes ago, Brumerican said:

Would be great casting.

Kev In Space eh !

Is it even a crime if it happens in space?

[Brumerican]

Just now, Xela said:

Is it even a crime if it happens in space?

Pretty much Yoda's mantra for over 900 years of kidnapping younglings 

It's just a shame that this show has hardly any interest in exploring space.

Any actors out there named Kevin Sandy ?

[Lichfield Dean]

On 22/06/2022 at 23:54, Brumerican said:

It was easily the best of bad bunch but still needless in the grand scheme of things .  The Mandalorian ain't perfect but at least it's good fun and never had so many stinkers in a row like Fett and Obi Wan.   This is unforgivable  from a such a wealthy company  . WhenI was growing up Disney was a gold standard in the industry and now they're pumping out  so much garbage it's mind boggling.

Rey Palpatine still ends up undoing the entire Skywalker family arc though so there is always the lingering feeling that no matter how pretty that fight was it still  leads to Rian Johnson shitting all over Mark Hamill.   I just can't forget this nonsense  ends with the most optimistic Jedi in the Universe attempting to kill his nephew for no reason. All the Grogu's  in the world won't change that.

 

FWIW the de-ageing tech they used on Hamill to play 10 year old Luke was incredible.

 

 

But Luke was always struggling with the dark side and was always reckless, that was his character? That was the whole point of ROTJ. The idea that he came close to giving in and killing his evil nephew but at the last moment couldn't do it is totally in keeping with his character surely?

[Brumerican]

2 hours ago, Lichfield Dean said:

But Luke was always struggling with the dark side and was always reckless, that was his character? That was the whole point of ROTJ. The idea that he came close to giving in and killing his evil nephew but at the last moment couldn't do it is totally in keeping with his character surely?

He refused to kill a father he never knew but was about to kill his teenage nephew who he'd been in school with every day ?

It's the exact opposite of his character . He barely struggled with the dark side at all in the OT.

Aside from that if you don't trust me you can watch hours of footage of Hamill being trudged around the globe on the verge of tears sat next to Rian Johnson.

[Brumerican]

[A'Villan]

[A'Villan]

[Lichfield Dean]

On 24/06/2022 at 12:09, Brumerican said:

He refused to kill a father he never knew but was about to kill his teenage nephew who he'd been in school with every day ?

It's the exact opposite of his character . He barely struggled with the dark side at all in the OT.

Aside from that if you don't trust me you can watch hours of footage of Hamill being trudged around the globe on the verge of tears sat next to Rian Johnson.

I guess you are probably right. I'm not the biggest Star Wars fan, I liked the original trilogy as a kid, but never really loved the franchise that much.

Maybe I've always misread Luke's character but to me he will always be that mixed-up kid that Yoda called reckless and that attacked Vader with a viciousness I've rarely seen equalled in any film whilst the Emperor goaded him onwards. I don't think TLJ scene where he was close to killing his nephew was well filmed and was somewhat hamfisted but as a character concept it didn't seem a problem to me.

I had more of a problem with the deflating wishy washy ending and stupid end scene with the little kids. Most of the rest of the film I thought was fairly enjoyable compared to the miserable experience of the prequels and the appallingly bad greatest hits show that was The Force Awakens.

[CVByrne]

So essentially job done for Disney with Kenobi, they introduced a new diverse female character, played by a new actress who will cost much less than any actors of established characters would and now she can have her own set of content on Disney+ 

Next up for Disney is getting a new female Thor, then they can have cross overs with the female Loki they've got. Meanwhile Disney stock price is down 50% in the last 7 months. 

[CVByrne]

On 26/06/2022 at 12:06, Lichfield Dean said:

I guess you are probably right. I'm not the biggest Star Wars fan, I liked the original trilogy as a kid, but never really loved the franchise that much.

Maybe I've always misread Luke's character but to me he will always be that mixed-up kid that Yoda called reckless and that attacked Vader with a viciousness I've rarely seen equalled in any film whilst the Emperor goaded him onwards. I don't think TLJ scene where he was close to killing his nephew was well filmed and was somewhat hamfisted but as a character concept it didn't seem a problem to me.

I had more of a problem with the deflating wishy washy ending and stupid end scene with the little kids. Most of the rest of the film I thought was fairly enjoyable compared to the miserable experience of the prequels and the appallingly bad greatest hits show that was The Force Awakens.

It was a calculated character assassination of Luke to make him weak and no longer the hero so as to elevate the new Mary Sue, Rey as it fits in with the Social Justice agenda of the people who made it. There is no story with the new trilogy it is just a medium for modern political agendas.

[Rolta]

3 hours ago, CVByrne said:

So essentially job done for Disney with Kenobi, they introduced a new diverse female character, played by a new actress who will cost much less than any actors of established characters would and now she can have her own set of content on Disney+ 

Next up for Disney is getting a new female Thor, then they can have cross overs with the female Loki they've got. Meanwhile Disney stock price is down 50% in the last 7 months. 

So you're upset they have a black female character? Your words. 

For me the first problem with Disney star wars is the awful writing. You can probably lay all the blame on Kathleen Kennedy really as she failed with Star Wars where Feige succeeded with Marvel. And also Abrams. They did push some unnecessary ideas incongruous with the world (veggie Chewie in TLJ). Rey is an awful character. As with most people in that trilogy nothing was developed properly. But I think you're willfully connecting dots if you think they weakened Luke to make her seem even more 'great'. That was just Rhian Johnson being a clearing in the woods. The underdevelopment is the fault of all the shitty team of chancers who put those lame films together.

I hate to point out but the original Star Wars has a very overt anti fascist/imperialist agenda. 

They were well written on the most part though!

Edited June 28, 2022 by Rolta

[villa4europe]

34 minutes ago, Rolta said:

So you're upset they have a black female character? Your words. 

For me the first problem with Disney star wars is the awful writing. You can probably lay all the blame on Kathleen Kennedy really as she failed with Star Wars where Feige succeeded with Marvel. And also Abrams. They did push some unnecessary ideas incongruous with the world (veggie Chewie in TLJ).

I hate to point out but the original Star Wars has a very overt anti fascist/imperialist agenda. 

They were well written on the most part though!

Yeah reva in particular funnily enough for me was a terrible character and that's nothing to do with her sex or skin colour it's all in the writing, surely she won't get her own spin off, there was nothing about her character to justify it

The female thor comes from the comics not Disney same with Miles morales as spiderman and the Indian girl as Ms Marvel 

Its business as much as anything else, the diversity opens up new markets when their product goes stale 

If you wanted to have a pop at disney surely you'd pick out Lola? That a merch plug george would be proud of

[CVByrne]

48 minutes ago, Rolta said:

So you're upset they have a black female character? Your words. 

For me the first problem with Disney star wars is the awful writing. You can probably lay all the blame on Kathleen Kennedy really as she failed with Star Wars where Feige succeeded with Marvel. And also Abrams. They did push some unnecessary ideas incongruous with the world (veggie Chewie in TLJ).

I hate to point out but the original Star Wars has a very overt anti fascist/imperialist agenda. 

They were well written on the most part though!

I love how you made up words and then assigned them to me. Did I say I was upset, how could I be upset? I haven't watched the show, nor do I watch any of the junk Disney churn out.

I'm simply commenting that it's no surprise they did a bait and switch and used the show to create a new character who can have their own set of content and who fits nicely into their social justice political agenda which essentially defines Disney these days. 

 

If you want to know WHY the writing is awful you need to understand the company as primarily pushing their social / political agenda. Why they need to have Mary Sue's as the protagonists in all of these, and why that leads to terrible writing and thus terrible movies and tv shows. Here's a video from 3 years ago that explains it remarkably well

 

[CVByrne]

19 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

Yeah reva in particular funnily enough for me was a terrible character and that's nothing to do with her sex or skin colour it's all in the writing, surely she won't get her own spin off, there was nothing about her character to justify it

The female thor comes from the comics not Disney same with Miles morales as spiderman and the Indian girl as Ms Marvel 

Its business as much as anything else, the diversity opens up new markets when their product goes stale 

If you wanted to have a pop at disney surely you'd pick out Lola? That a merch plug george would be proud of

The entire purpose of Obi wan was to create the character, specifically to have their own spin off and content. 

Nothing in the Star Wars world was different before and after Obi Wan, everything is back where they started, but they've now introduced the new character. This actor is cheap and will have signed on to do multiple seasons for the cheap rate. This means they can churn out content for Disney+

[CVByrne]

24 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

Yeah reva in particular funnily enough for me was a terrible character and that's nothing to do with her sex or skin colour it's all in the writing, surely she won't get her own spin off, there was nothing about her character to justify it

The female thor comes from the comics not Disney same with Miles morales as spiderman and the Indian girl as Ms Marvel 

Its business as much as anything else, the diversity opens up new markets when their product goes stale 

If you wanted to have a pop at disney surely you'd pick out Lola? That a merch plug george would be proud of

Yes, all AFTER Disney bought the company in 2009. The Comics are no different to anything else that is put out by Disney. 

I have no issue with any diversity in anything. I have issue with bad writing being the reason for so many bad TV shows and the social justice / political agenda that is pushed is to create Mary Sue's as this is how the agenda is best pushed.

Writing a good show is not the goal. To make a show or movie you need a character arc and thus the protagonist has to have flaws or weaknesses. This is not allowed in the rules of the political agenda because anything being called a "weakness" is essentially going to be offensive to some group somewhere. Thus the protagonists are required to be perfect and thus no character arc. Then things are made worse in many of the scripts / shows as they need to then portray white men as essentially the evil. When the core tenet of the whole project is to push a social / political agenda it's essentially impossible to have a good story and engaging script. 

[Rolta]

41 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

I love how you made up words and then assigned them to me. Did I say I was upset, how could I be upset? I haven't watched the show, nor do I watch any of the junk Disney churn out.

I'm simply commenting that it's no surprise they did a bait and switch and used the show to create a new character who can have their own set of content and who fits nicely into their social justice political agenda which essentially defines Disney these days. 

 

If you want to know WHY the writing is awful you need to understand the company as primarily pushing their social / political agenda. Why they need to have Mary Sue's as the protagonists in all of these, and why that leads to terrible writing and thus terrible movies and tv shows. Here's a video from 3 years ago that explains it remarkably well

 

The only word I assigned to you was 'upset' and you seem upset tbh. You've written at length about a character you've not even seen. You seem to be going off on one about a character in Obi Wan you haven't seen. And you seem to have a problem specifically because she's a black woman.

It's weird because if you watched the show you'd realise there's nothing actually wrong with her character with regards to her race or gender—it's fine that she's a black woman in the context of the story, just as there was nothing wrong with Finn being black or Rey being a woman. The problem with Rey and Finn was that they were shitly written characters with no development whatsoever created by a moron in JJ Abrams. A better writer could have done them well.

You seem upset (sorry, but the word seems accurate) that there are other characters than Obi Wan in the Obi Wan show. You seem upset that nothing really changed for Obi Wan or Leia or Darth Vader. I watched Obi Wan (really not a very good show) and have to say that it's not very compelling watching these mid-story stories where we already know half the cast survive. The only thing the writers can do in these situations is to add other characters. There were other characters in the same situation in the clone wars. Reva is actually an interesting setup for a character, but she along with the rest of the show was half-baked. She's also not the only new character in the show. But she's a black woman, so it's totally suspect that she's the one you're writing about! Do you realise that she's nowhere near the 'main' character? She's a secondary character completely. She does have an actual (badly written) arc though. Maybe you don't like it when black women have character arcs? Obi Wan has one too btw. And Darth Vader in a way.

You seem compelled down the getting 'upset' at SJWs rabbit hole—I thought the terminology had moved on a bit? Shouldn't you be upset at woke people?—I admit, I've moaned myself how in Boba Fett every single village on Tatooine has a perfect blend of inclusive races. It was so distracting because it was obviously Disney. The realism suffered for sure in those moments for me. Honestly, I **** hate Disney Star Wars, but I'm not surprised that Disney, a mega company with a global audience leans towards inclusivity. What do you expect? Why are you so upset? Do you think people should be excluded?

From a creative standpoint, for many different reasons Star Wars died when Disney bought it—but it isn't because the show cast a black character. Star Wars should be able to have more than one black character without people getting upset—but unfortunately the abysmal writing has left the door wide open for YouTube videos to seemingly confirm a few more biases and push some buttons even more (not saying that happened to you).

Tbh, I'm sure Kathleen Kennedy and Rhian Johnson and JJ Abrams are lame people and I am sure they pushed Star Wars in the Disney-obvious direction. They're also three idiots who were in way over their heads. And just like there are idiots who are 'woke' there are idiots who get upset at 'woke' things too. Ultimately the Disney Star Wars sequel trilogy didn't even try to tell a story because the creative people were over-promoted dicks. There is so much to complain about without obsessing over a global company being inclusive.

The thing that surprises me about your posts though is how Reva is actually a legitimate character in the show. She's miles away from Rey. She's not a bad idea at all.

But as I say, the show is badly written on the most part so it doesn't matter. And having seen the show there is 0% she is getting a spin off.