Manchester United

[Genie]

11 minutes ago, Xela said:

Can't believe Martial is still there. Haven't they been trying to get rid of him for years?

They send him out on loan and they send him back. Definitely an attitude problem there.

[Mark Albrighton]

Martial is currently on 199 league appearances for Man Utd. 

In all competitions, Martial has played over 300 times for them. I barely have an opinion on Martial. 

For comparison purposes Cantona played 185 games for them in all competitions. 

Martial is also ahead of Andy Cole, Ashley Young, Ruud van Nistelrooy, the list goes on. 

In fairness, I think my perception of him (or lack of) probably says more about my deliberately limited consumption of non Villa related stuff and Man Utd not being the force they were than it says about Martial.

[Tomaszk]

1 hour ago, chrisvilla4 said:

Why is that funny? If your son/ daughter was getting abuse, would you not stand up for them? 

He's not receiving any abuse that isn't related to his performances.

He's playing for England when he shouldn't be (not his fault).

He turned down a move to a team he'd undoubtedly have shone in (is his fault).

He mom getting involved! What?! He's 30 not 15.

It's absolutely hilarious.

[duke313]

United have made more club statements (5) than they have away wins (3) in 2023 

[Zhan_Zhuang]

2 hours ago, chrisvilla4 said:

Why is that funny? If your son/ daughter was getting abuse, would you not stand up for them? 

I agree, it's awful the abuse he gets and of course from many people.

But then we have to remember that many football fans aren't particularly bright or intelligent human beings who think it is okay to abuse other people.

[BOF]

2 hours ago, chrisvilla4 said:

Why is that funny? If your son/ daughter was getting abuse, would you not stand up for them? 

He's a 30 year old getting slaggings for being a bit shit at football even though he objectively isn't. He's wantonly in this situation by refusing a summer move. And his mother goes and does that. Yes it's very funny. Probably the funniest thing to happen in this whole sorry saga

[Zatman]

1 hour ago, Genie said:

They send him out on loan and they send him back. Definitely an attitude problem there.

I think its similar to us with Bailey, I dont think its an attitude problem but just comes across that way 

For me was too much hype too soon. I think him and Shaw being the 2 longest serving players shows how bad the club is run. Two hot prospects who never reached the level but United keep thinking something will click

[chrisvilla4]

23 minutes ago, BOF said:

He's a 30 year old getting slaggings for being a bit shit at football even though he objectively isn't. He's wantonly in this situation by refusing a summer move. And his mother goes and does that. Yes it's very funny. Probably the funniest thing to happen in this whole sorry saga

He's getting constantly slated which isn't helping his confidence I'm sure. Perhaps she's one of the only people on his side so is sticking up for him. 

 

I'm not privy to why he didn't move- only from what I've read, which admittedly is very little, and who knows what the truth is.

 

I'm not a fan of Maguires but as a human I don't agree with the constant crap He's getting. And I imagine there's a hell of a lot more on social media. Can't imagine the impact that could have on someone's mental health. 

[bobzy]

16 minutes ago, chrisvilla4 said:

He's getting constantly slated which isn't helping his confidence I'm sure. Perhaps she's one of the only people on his side so is sticking up for him. 

 

I'm not privy to why he didn't move- only from what I've read, which admittedly is very little, and who knows what the truth is.

 

I'm not a fan of Maguires but as a human I don't agree with the constant crap He's getting. And I imagine there's a hell of a lot more on social media. Can't imagine the impact that could have on someone's mental health. 

Somewhat conversely, both the best and worst thing about football is the fans.

[jimmygreaves]

I remember the good old days when players from both sides were respectfully applauded on and off the pitch. A missed pass was met with a rueful sigh and a gentle shrug. Never were they shouted at disparagingly or hurtful songs projected down from the stands....

Oh, yeah right, this has happened forever.

Grow up all concerned.

[Xela]

9 hours ago, Genie said:

They send him out on loan and they send him back. Definitely an attitude problem there.

He cost £36m, with add-ons to take it to a potential £57.6m. That was in 2015! 

They've been shit at transfers for years. Always massively overpay. 

[VillaJ100]

12 minutes ago, Xela said:

He cost £36m, with add-ons to take it to a potential £57.6m. That was in 2015! 

They've been shit at transfers for years. Always massively overpay. 

Due to their official tractor spark plug partners though they've never had a comuppance from it

[Keyblade]

A discussion can be had on football fans and how they treat opposition players, but the notion that Maguire is being singled out is a funny one. What makes him different to any other players? What, because he cost £80m, he should be immune to criticism? I honestly don't get it. Seems very entitled from his mom and Southgate. Everyone must lay off him because...?

[Genie]

Mason Mount was getting similar criticism for being in the England squad whilst being in poor club form, difference is he didn’t make so many comical errors.

Kalvin Philips another one, clearly not good enough but getting picked.

Maybe the real problem is the person picking them. 

[fruitvilla]

6 hours ago, jimmygreaves said:

I remember the good old days when players from both sides were respectfully applauded on and off the pitch. A missed pass was met with a rueful sigh and a gentle shrug. Never were they shouted at disparagingly or hurtful songs projected down from the stands....

Oh, yeah right, this has happened forever.

Grow up all concerned.

I sort of agree with you. Today top football players are paid "millions" and perhaps people have lost sympathy for the wayward pass etc. It's not an excuse but it is a factor. 

As for Maguire ... I would not want my Mum coming to my defence publicly.

[bobzy]

2 hours ago, Keyblade said:

A discussion can be had on football fans and how they treat opposition players, but the notion that Maguire is being singled out is a funny one. What makes him different to any other players? What, because he cost £80m, he should be immune to criticism? I honestly don't get it. Seems very entitled from his mom and Southgate. Everyone must lay off him because...?

It's weird how people sort of flick between extremes.  I don't think Maguire's mum or Southgate think he should be "immune to criticism" - I mean, that's frankly utterly ridiculous.

But you ask the question yourself here... what makes him different to any other player?  Is it his mistakes in play or that he cost £80m or that he plays for Man Utd or a mix of all this?  I didn't particularly watch the England game or know if he did/didn't get abuse (he probably did), but I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest he's very much a singled out player.

[Keyblade]

10 minutes ago, bobzy said:

It's weird how people sort of flick between extremes.  I don't think Maguire's mum or Southgate think he should be "immune to criticism" - I mean, that's frankly utterly ridiculous.

But you ask the question yourself here... what makes him different to any other player?  Is it his mistakes in play or that he cost £80m or that he plays for Man Utd or a mix of all this?  I didn't particularly watch the England game or know if he did/didn't get abuse (he probably did), but I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest he's very much a singled out player.

He's been really poor, which in itself shouldn't be a reason for being singled out, but he's been put in the spotlight by Southgate by first picking him for the England squad when he's barely played football for 6 months, then also bringing him onto the pitch unnecessarily.

Like you said, there's also the fact that he plays for Manchester United (and seems to be insisting on playing for Manchester United, rejecting West Ham recently) and also costing 80m which definitely factors into it and further puts him in the spotlight.

Like if he actually did play for West Ham, this probably wouldn't be a thing because he's actually more than good enough to play decently for them. If he was was then also being picked (or not picked) on his club form for the national team I doubt he'd be getting as much criticism. You can't be terrible for Manchester United and England, still be in both teams and not expect to get criticised. It's not because he's Harry Maguire. There just aren't many other players with his unique blend of circumstances.

Like Kalvin Phillips gets the piss taken out of him a bit these days but it doesn't get to Maguire's level because although he doesn't play for his club and still gets picked for England, on the rare occasion he plays for club or country he's usually pretty competent and isn't making a high profile error seemingly every time he plays.

I think Southgate shoulders a lot of the blame on this. He's in a position where he can take him out of the firing line, let him slowly build up his confidence at club level if he can. Instead he seems to want to make it a point to show that he's still his lynchpin even though his performances say otherwise and it's just increasing the scrutiny.

 

[Mark Albrighton]

I think if Henderson had missed a penalty or if Phillips had been sent off, they’d have been getting similar pelters. Those two and Maguire are kinda emblematic of the issues some have with Southgate (and some, but obviously not all of the criticism is more about Southgate, I think). Just so happens that on this occasion it was Maguire who messed up. 

It feels like the Maguire thing has the added over spill from Man Utd supporters who are a bit fed up of him. I’m not sure who else in the England set up that could be said of.

Also, and it’s kinda intangible this, but I think Maguire is inherently more joke meme friendly than other players. Phil Jones-esque.
 

Edited September 15, 2023 by Mark Albrighton

[Zatman]

3 hours ago, Keyblade said:

A discussion can be had on football fans and how they treat opposition players, but the notion that Maguire is being singled out is a funny one. What makes him different to any other players? What, because he cost £80m, he should be immune to criticism? I honestly don't get it. Seems very entitled from his mom and Southgate. Everyone must lay off him because...?

Online the Maguire criticism is 95 percent jokes about his ability. Lets ban them blooper reels. Maybe Ronny Rosenthal should recall 30 years of trauma

Titus Bramble/David James etc must feel like they were hard done by  never mind players who got racially abused

[Keyblade]

57 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Online the Maguire criticism is 95 percent jokes about his ability. Lets ban them blooper reels. Maybe Ronny Rosenthal should recall 30 years of trauma

Titus Bramble/David James etc must feel like they were hard done by  never mind players who got racially abused

Titus Bramble still gets brought up in discussions, usually when taking the piss out of current defenders (ironically such as Maguire). The guy doesn't even play anymore. If you're bad, fans will no doubt make you know about it. Whether that's good or right is one thing, but Maguire isn't unique in this way.