Daniel Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 No, I don't think so Daniel Maybe i was wrong then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchard Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 We very openly acknowledge the frustrations of Villa fans and share in them completely. This does sort of imply that they also think McLeish is a word removed. Depends if you can believe a word these people say. For me, to say they wanted a manager best fit to Aston Villa and it's supporters, and then appoint Alex McLeish, I don't trust a word they say now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 No, I don't think so Daniel Still going defend the man? Because people present facts does not mean that they are 'defending' all aspects of an individual, they are just making people aware facts. Unfortunately too many prefer all of the information to sit with their one-sided, jaundiced views, which is why true facts often get rubbished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchard Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Oh - and those clinging on to the hope that this bullshit PR only mentions three games thinking that he'll be gone after that. No. No he won't. If there's one thing Lerner and Falkner have shown - it's that they are prepared to spin the bullshitometer. I expect that these three games are mentioned to make you think that and snap up those season tickets for next year to see the hotly anticipated game Aston Villa vs Peterborough. Don't fall for the bullshit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WickerMan Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 We are being trolled by our own club! :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villadude Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 **** you Lerner, you bullshitting word removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 25, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2012 No, I don't think so Daniel Still going defend the man? Assuming you mean Randy, not Daniel, then on some things, yes - if I think criticism is unfair or I don't share a view expressed, On other points, no - Same as I've always been, really. I just say what I think - Why? - your post sort of implies you think I believe or say he can do no wrong. Which is not correct. But equally, I feel that he has done many good things, and I'm more than happy to say so, where I believe he's being unfairly criticised. It doesn't matter what I think, or write, anyway. It's just one pint of view among many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-67 Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Blandy, what do you make of the statement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 25, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2012 I think, Steve, that the statement sort of reads (between the lines) like "we feel uncomfortable with the level of abuse heaped at McLeish, it's a bit outside our kind of sphere of experience. We don't think it is helping anyone, we want the fans to chant and support the team till the end of the season. We get that you're seriously miffed, note that we've not said anything about beyond the next 3 games. We're a bit shocked. We didn't realise it was as bad as that with you lot, in terms of how strongly you feel. We want some breathing space for the team and the young kids and manager to try and help them, and we want some thinking space to make our minds up, and we're terrified of going down. It's all a bit of a horror show." I think they felt they had to say something. I think they didn't or don't appreciate the level of hostility that finally became clear at a home game. I think McLeish is toast come the summer. I think they're ill equipped to decide what to do and desperately need good advice. I think their intentions and aims are good but that they're short on know-how, basically. Probably it means something totally different, but that's my view, anyway. Thanks for asking - what do you think it means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted April 25, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted April 25, 2012 I think, Steve, that the statement sort of reads (between the lines) like "we feel uncomfortable with the level of abuse heaped at McLeish, it's a bit outside our kind of sphere of experience. We don't think it is helping anyone, we want the fans to chant and support the team till the end of the season. We get that you're seriously miffed, note that we've not said anything about beyond the next 3 games. We're a bit shocked. We didn't realise it was as bad as that with you lot, in terms of how strongly you feel. We want some breathing space for the team and the young kids and manager to try and help them, and we want some thinking space to make our minds up, and we're terrified of going down. It's all a bit of a horror show." I think they felt they had to say something. I think they didn't or don't appreciate the level of hostility that finally became clear at a home game. I think McLeish is toast come the summer. I think they're ill equipped to decide what to do and desperately need good advice. I think their intentions and aims are good but that they're short on know-how, basically. Probably it means something totally different, but that's my view, anyway. Great post, that's exactly what I made of it too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve-67 Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I think, Steve, that the statement sort of reads (between the lines) like "we feel uncomfortable with the level of abuse heaped at McLeish, it's a bit outside our kind of sphere of experience. We don't think it is helping anyone, we want the fans to chant and support the team till the end of the season. We get that you're seriously miffed, note that we've not said anything about beyond the next 3 games. We're a bit shocked. We didn't realise it was as bad as that with you lot, in terms of how strongly you feel. We want some breathing space for the team and the young kids and manager to try and help them, and we want some thinking space to make our minds up, and we're terrified of going down. It's all a bit of a horror show." I think they felt they had to say something. I think they didn't or don't appreciate the level of hostility that finally became clear at a home game. I think McLeish is toast come the summer. I think they're ill equipped to decide what to do and desperately need good advice. I think their intentions and aims are good but that they're short on know-how, basically. Probably it means something totally different, but that's my view, anyway. Thanks for asking - what do you think it means? I am a senior manager where I work and I think sometimes people in bigger positions make bland statements as a "holding statement". That's what I think this is. I also think you're right about the abuse, they don't like it and don't know how to handle it. Welcome to football! Toast in the summer? I hope so. It's embarrassing for the club. I think Randy has made mistakes but he doesn't want Villa in this position again. I think you read it spot on, thinking time, don't say you are fully behind the Manager for the future but don't hint that you'll sack him either. We might win the next three games and be comfortable, one never knows. Whatever happens in the summer, I think they need to actively recruit a football brain to the board. Graham Taylor, Terry Venables types as advisors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethRDR Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 The salient point to take from that statement - as y'all have said - is the one thing it does not do (and is, as such, quite carefully/selectively worded) is state any 'vote of confidence' or such for McLeish. Some hope perhaps, that this is an indication of things to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 25, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 25, 2012 Abuse? I'd hardly call what he got the other night abuse, he was simply told to "**** off". Now granted it was by the vast majority of the highly dubious 32k attendance but that was the extent of the "abuse" he received. If they are surprised at that, if they are shocked by that after everything that has happened then they are naive, no they are more than that they are fools. What happened last night wasn't a reaction to conceding those two quick goals, it wasn't a reaction to losing that game it was a reaction to everything that has happened in the last 12 months if not the last 24 months. It was the moment the crowd turned but they didn't turn in a moment. I personally don't think they needed to say anything, whatever they said wasn't going to help matters unless they were informing us that McLeish had been removed from the job. There is nothing else they could say today that would have improved the situation, the irony is that we've for months and months wanted them to say more yet they stayed silent and now when they would be better off not saying anything they come out with this crap seemingly clueless to the fact it is going to do no good at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlitobrigante Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 he has still pumped millions of his own cash into the club, money he wont be getting back. and i have no doubt that despite his mistakes he has the best interests of avfc at heart... No he has loaned millions, very big difference and we are now being crippled by those loans as he cuts budgets in order to repay them and the interest (though at a small percentage) and management fees. Nope, he's done both. He's loaned us a fortune and he's given us a fortune out of his own pocket each year too - something like £20m in the last years accounts. Oddly, I've a feeling that this has been a pretty consistent figure throughout his tenure, sadly it used to pay for new exciting players, now it pays for mismanagement on lot of levels. Whatever his intentions he is making a monumental mess of running the club and is in danger of actually taking us backwards from the position he found us in which will be some achievement considering the debts the club has accumulated. Never has so much money been spent, borrowed and given away for so little result. I don't know how Randy's heart feels about the Villa, but I'm sure he'll miss the hundred odd million pounds he'll never see again - and I doubt there are many people who will have a more pressing motivation to start getting it right. His mistakes hurt us and I can thoroughly understand the anger people feel, but they hurt him too, maybe in more ways, maybe in different ways but he's putting in a fortune at the moment and he'll be very much aware he's thrown that money down the drain. He needs to get it right - for Aston Villa and maybe for Randy Lerner too. Good post OBE yep, glad some agree. i cant defend recent decisions, but he is no doubt hurting just as much as us and some of the abuse is over the top. he must know he has **** up big time with his last few major decisions, and i think we will see some effort made this summer to put it right. just amazes me that for such a seemingly quiet, reserved bloke, it seems he loves taking massive gambles with his mangerial appointments. Depending on who you hear he recruited / inherited MON, then gambled it all on a period of wild spending we couldnt sustain, then when that fell apart, he took the gamble of going with Houllier despite his known health concerns. Then to top it all we get Mcleish. Going for Mcleish, after we pulled away from considering McClaren because of fan reaction doesnt make any sense. He seems well meaning but utter inept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mendi Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 putting out that statement will now make the fans more unhappy and there are not listening to the fans who are passion about their club and we been messed around all season. that statement did not say that he will be back to the summer so maybe a lifeline for us the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaAndLoyal Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 Opinion of a Rangers fan on Facebook. It had 46 likes at the time of this post: Rangers fan here again, sorry if my input's boring. You guys are in the same position as we were a good few years ago - Your owner is fed up with you - Villa is like a broken toy to him that he is trying to sell on eBay....he's pulled investment and is selling off assets. An inept manager is a symptom, not the cause. I will never forgive Eck for the mess he left us in, but the bigger picture is Randy Lerner is the latest in a long line of sugar daddy's who eventually grow bored and leave the club to rot - single owner model is flawed and doesn't work. So yes, pressure your inept manager but pressure your disinterested owner even more. Hope to see you guys back on the up soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponky Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 The best thing Randy can do at the end of the season is appoint an independent auditor or reviewer to assess the club from top to bottom - facilities, staff, squad, academy - and lay down a no holds barred assessment of the club with a full set of recommendations for the future. He desperately needs guidance from someone who knows what they are talking about but with no vested interest in the club, its staff or its rivals. No more letters from the likes of Sir Alex. No more people like Faulkner or Fitzgerald bullshitting in his ear. He needs to take some responisbility for the club and arm himself with a plan to strip it all back and start again - hopefully from the bottom of the Premier League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted April 26, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 26, 2012 Opinion of a Rangers fan on Facebook. It had 46 likes at the time of this post: Rangers fan here again, sorry if my input's boring. You guys are in the same position as we were a good few years ago - Your owner is fed up with you - Villa is like a broken toy to him that he is trying to sell on eBay....he's pulled investment and is selling off assets. An inept manager is a symptom, not the cause. I will never forgive Eck for the mess he left us in, but the bigger picture is Randy Lerner is the latest in a long line of sugar daddy's who eventually grow bored and leave the club to rot - single owner model is flawed and doesn't work. So yes, pressure your inept manager but pressure your disinterested owner even more. Hope to see you guys back on the up soon. He hasn't pulled investment. There's nothing to indicate disinterest. There's lots to indicate some very poor decision making, which I think you can judge as naivety, foolishness, recklessness or idiocy based on your preference - but the amount of investment has remained pretty much consistent since the day he arrived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 26, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 26, 2012 He hasn't pulled investment. There's nothing to indicate disinterest. The first simply isn't true and the second is very much a matter of opinion. but the amount of investment has remained pretty much consistent since the day he arrived. It really hasn't though. He invested heavily for the first 3 years and hasn't invested in anywhere near the same way for the last 3 years. Despite the injection of £20m cash which is in return for diluted equity which he will likely look to recoup in a future sale. From memory I believe it is 2 years since we've made a net investment in our squad. The investment has stopped and stopped a lot earlier than many seem to have realised. People usually come back to this and say well he has invested in terms of our wage bill. Only our wage bill isn't and I believe never has been in excess of our income so he isn't funding this. Even if he were the ongoing cuts in wage bill suggest the level of funding would have changed. We are running at a loss, he is drawing down on the loans and charging interest and management fee's upon them. We haven't spent net in transfers in 3 years, the investment is not and has not remained consistent. The level of investment was throw lots of money at it in the first 3 years, panic and scale back. Nothing consistent about it. As for the allegation of the lack of interest, I don't think that can so easily be dismissed. Nobody knows what Randy's level of interest is in the club at this moment in time, positive or negative but I think it is perfectly understandable why some feel he has lost interest. There are certainly some things that indicate this may be the case. In the end on that one it comes down to each fans personal stance and waiting to see what happens in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 26, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 26, 2012 Our net investment in player purchases for the last 6 years according to Soccerbase. 2006/2007 £21m spend 2007/2008 £2m profit 2008/2009 £31m spend 2009/2010 £3m spend 2010/2011 £11 profit 2011/2012 £7m profit That to me doesn't appear to be a consistent level of investment in this aspect of the club. Oh and just to add according to those figures that means we've made a net investment of circa £35m in 6 years, a little under £6m a season. oh and before someone says it, working out the average annual net spend doesn't in anyway mean that the investment has been consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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