The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[Houlston]

It really pisses me off that McLeish keeps saying we gave the ball away too easily but that only down to the team he picks. There was only really one player in our 11 that you could class as a good passer and thats Petrov.

The whole Hutton thing on the right wing was horrendous and to be fair I cant blame Hutton for having a bit of a mare because he hardly ever plays there.

Nzog was getting better and there was a marked improvement in his last two games and its not like the guy doesnt track back either so I dont know why he couldnt have started or at least come on.

Heskey does win us headers and he does defend well but its kind of pointless because he negates all of that by giving the ball away and making the wrong decisions. I still cant believe he nodded the ball back across goal in the opening minute rather than head it at goal.

Collins must be dropped, I can handle Warnock, willing to give Hutton longer and for me I quite like Dunne but Collins is a joke.

The actual tactics were nothing more than confusing and I dont really think there was any. I had texts from mates who arent Villa fans asking whats with the Villa or wheres Nzogbia or how come Albrighton never plays etc etc.

The only positive was that the we did only concede two goals and they were through Collins being shit.

I just hope this serves as a wake up call and that we can and should play the likes of Bannan, Zog, Clark and Albrighton.

With what I'd seen from McLeish I was happy to give him the benefit of the doubt and to see what happens but last night was inexcusable on so many levels it was almost like it was his first game in charge as a footbal manager.

[Richard]

We were set up like a 2-0 defeat was a decent result for us

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

We were set up like a 2-0 defeat was a decent result for us

I had money on us losing 0-3 or 0-4. If you take the team and tactics into account then losing 0-2 is a amazing result for us.

[Stevo985]

If a McLeish team can't defend, then what's the point of McLeish?

I got the impression last night that McLeish thought his bizarre starting lineup was some sort of master stroke, and that we were going to contain Spurs all game.

It never looked like that. What he produced was one of the most inept performances I've ever witnessed.

Houllier had his game against liverpool, K Mac had his game against newcastle, MON had his game against Chelsea, and this was Mcleish's version.

The only positive about last night was that Spurs were happy to coast to a 2-0 victory. If they'd turned the screw we'd have lost 4 or 5 nil last night. Maybe more.

The team is just too disjointed.

Defence, fine. Didn't play well, but it's a back 4. 4 defenders.

Midfield is the place that mcLeish clearly struggles with. He must be too used to just hoofing from defence to attack because the midfield made no sense.

We had 3 naturally defensive players in that midfield. Petrov and Herd would be a good pairing in CM IF they had an attacking CM playing with them. But without, like last night, it just means we have nothing going forward. There is no-one linking defence with attack. We have a defensive set up, but without anyone there to pick up the ball and start an attack, that defensiveness becomes a liability because the ball will constantly be coming back at us.

usually if we play this, like against Norwich, we have pace on the wings to provide some sort of attack. Against Norwich it was N'Zogbia and Gabby when he drifted wide.

Yesterday we had hutton who tried to get forward but isn't good enough, and Heskey who, whilst an attacker by trade, can't play left wing and these days looks more defensive when he's out there than attacking, and just provides a much too tempting target for the inevitable hoofs from the back.

Gabby and Bent both play on the shoulder, or at least they did last night, which again means there was no-one dropping deep to link Petrov and Herd with attack. Normally with a striker who plays on the shoulder you want a midfielder, or deep lying striker, to fill the space between the oppositions midfield and defence. This means either the opposition defence pushes up to close the space in that hole, therefore giving your "on the shoulder" striker space to run in behind, or they stay deep and let the player in the hole have more space, but negate the "on the shoulder" striker from having space in behind.

But last night we had neither. We just had 2 "on the shoulder" strikers. It meant that Spurs could drop their defence deep to stop gabby or Bent getting in behind and not fear anyone roaming in the space they leave in front of them. Anytime our "wingers" got the ball, their only option was a hoof up front or pass it back to the defence. There was no-one running into those spaces in midfield to provide a pass.

And what really annoyed me was the lack of change. It was obvious from Spurs' first goal that this wasn't working. Yet nothign changed. no change in personnel, no obvious change in tactics, setup, mindset, anything.

Nothing at half time. And when a change did come after about 65 minutes, already too late, it was a straight swap, sticking another non-winger on the wing and not changing the system.

It was as if we'd given up.

I gave McLeish a chance. i really did. I wiped the slate clean and I actually liked what he was saying at the start of the season, and i thought maybe, just maybe, he'd do alright.

He's not alright. he's dire. Last night showed me that he does not know how to effectively set up a team's attack. He's clearly good at setting up a defence, but even that hasn't been right recently.

If he'd set us up well last night and we'd lost 2-0 you could say "well he doesn't have the right player yet, but it was a decent performance, i can see what he was doing".

I can't see what he was doing. He has the players. 2 out and out wingers last night would have been so much more effective.

I know they needed to be defensive. But play Gabby there. he's been defensive before. he has the pace to catch Bale if he got passed Cuellar. We had wingers who were next to useless once they got overlapped. No pace to get back at them, and no attacking prowess to cause any threat going forward.

Last night was dire, and unless something changes drastically, we're heading for a month of very, very few points.

[GarethRDR]

Done with him. Get rid and move on.

[sonic_bouma]

his post match comments are a **** joke and an insult to the fans.....

we lost the game because of 2 defensive mistakes? **** off...

you put Vidic and Kompany in our back four with our style of play and they would look shit coz of the amount of times the ball keeps coming at them

you simply cannot put six defenders on the pitch and then blame defensive mistakes....

as soon as our players heard the line up they knew what there role was...defend defend defend...

and he has the cheek to say we didnt retain the ball and sat off them too much!!

how about you put some **** players on the pitch who can force the play then....

what did you expect neat little triangles between hutton heskey and herd?

get him out

[Pilchard]

Has he really said we had enough chances to get something from the game like James Nursey says on Twitter?

The poor deluded inept prick.

[AshVilla]

This manager is clueless

McNegative, 6 Defensive players treating spurs like they were Barcelona at the Nou Camp and trying to park the bus then has the audacity to say that "We had a right go at them" the stats back up your theory ginger mourinho 3 shots 1 on target 2 off target in 90 minutes of football 30% possession playing a wet behind the ears kid in centre midfield against the likes of Parker and Modric what planet is he on.

Tool

[wiggyrichard]

Ive been a defender of McLeish from the start, i wasnt happy with his appointment but i was prepared to give him my support and wished him all the best. But im sorry, last night was a complete joke! As soon as Gary Neville put the starting line up on Sky, i was always going to be a case of 'how many will we lose by?'.

Fair enough, i think that 99% of expected us to return to Villa Park with **** all to show for our efforts, as Spurs were always going to be the better team, 2nd best team on form in the league and a number of players we could only dream of having. But for **** sake! If your going to lose at least go down having a go! We were beat before the whistle blew to start the game, i mean if you going to be negative and play a game of damage limitation, for me you may as well have a pop at them and lose 4 or 5! Show some **** bottle and a bit of character and at least we walk away with our heads held high saying 'fair play, we tried but were soundly beaten by the far superior team'.

Last night was a disgrace.

[Risso]

If you're going to pick a dog's arse of a team that gives your side no chance before a ball is kicked, do NOT try and give the impression that we gave it a good go in your post match interview. The fans aren't stupid, and watching the game with neutrals last night, even they could see how utterly witless we were.

[Didiersix]

We were set up like a 2-0 defeat was a decent result for us

Yes it was. Before the game I predicted a 2-0 defeat if we played Heskey and 3-1 if we didn't.

However, once I saw the team sheet/suicide note, I thought it could be a whole lot worse. And it should have been.

Bannan should have been on at half time. At least he managed to knit a couple of passes together late on. The Hutton in midfield thing was a total joke, he was utterly useless.

[honest_bertie]

Ive been a defender of McLeish from the start, i wasnt happy with his appointment but i was prepared to give him my support and wished him all the best. But im sorry, last night was a complete joke! As soon as Gary Neville put the starting line up on Sky, i was always going to be a case of 'how many will we lose by?'.

Fair enough, i think that 99% of expected us to return to Villa Park with **** all to show for our efforts, as Spurs were always going to be the better team, 2nd best team on form in the league and a number of players we could only dream of having. But for **** sake! If your going to lose at least go down having a go! We were beat before the whistle blew to start the game, i mean if you going to be negative and play a game of damage limitation, for me you may as well have a pop at them and lose 4 or 5! Show some **** bottle and a bit of character and at least we walk away with our heads held high saying 'fair play, we tried but were soundly beaten by the far superior team'.

Last night was a disgrace.

Agreed, will you still defend AM or is that it now? Personally I can understand fans who gave him a chance but last nights team setup and his comments on the OS today where he pretty much takes no responsibility for the loss and mainly blames the players saying they "owe him" should make everyone realise he is the wrong man for Villa. Shit manager with shit record, shit tactics. Proud history, very murky future if this continues. javascript:emoticon(':cry:')

[honest_bertie]

If you're going to pick a dog's arse of a team that gives your side no chance before a ball is kicked, do NOT try and give the impression that we gave it a good go in your post match interview. The fans aren't stupid, and watching the game with neutrals last night, even they could see how utterly witless we were.

Spot on.

[wiggyrichard]

Ive been a defender of McLeish from the start, i wasnt happy with his appointment but i was prepared to give him my support and wished him all the best. But im sorry, last night was a complete joke! As soon as Gary Neville put the starting line up on Sky, i was always going to be a case of 'how many will we lose by?'.

Fair enough, i think that 99% of expected us to return to Villa Park with **** all to show for our efforts, as Spurs were always going to be the better team, 2nd best team on form in the league and a number of players we could only dream of having. But for **** sake! If your going to lose at least go down having a go! We were beat before the whistle blew to start the game, i mean if you going to be negative and play a game of damage limitation, for me you may as well have a pop at them and lose 4 or 5! Show some **** bottle and a bit of character and at least we walk away with our heads held high saying 'fair play, we tried but were soundly beaten by the far superior team'.

Last night was a disgrace.

Agreed, will you still defend AM or is that it now? Personally I can understand fans who gave him a chance but last nights team setup and his comments on the OS today where he pretty much takes no responsibility for the loss and mainly blames the players saying they "owe him" should make everyone realise he is the wrong man for Villa. Shit manager with shit record, shit tactics. Proud history, very murky future if this continues. javascript:emoticon(':cry:')

For me mate, that game was the straw that broke the camels back. Im done with him.

He has decent players, who can excite people and cause 90% of the teams in the league problems, but he continues to be negative and defensive and slowly but surely he is stripping the team of any creative spark we had. He doesnt realise that he has the players who can hurt teams and he doesnt need to be so restricted in his tactics and set-up.

He is dragging this club down to his level. Game over.

[Stevo985]

it's the basic stuff that's getting to me. As I said on the last page, and i think AVFC POB touched on it too, not having a link between attack and midfield is Sunday league stuff.

If a team set up against me on a Sunday like Villa did last night, I'd know exactly what to tell my players. Sit deep, don't let them in behind, they've got nothign to play with in front of the defence.

I, and I'm sure hundreds of others, spotted that within about 10 minutes last night. yet we all sat there for the next 80 without it being changed.

[AshVilla]

it's the basic stuff that's getting to me. As I said on the last page, and i think AVFC POB touched on it too, not having a link between attack and midfield is Sunday league stuff.

If a team set up against me on a Sunday like Villa did last night, I'd know exactly what to tell my players. Sit deep, don't let them in behind, they've got nothign to play with in front of the defence.

I, and I'm sure hundreds of others, spotted that within about 10 minutes last night. yet we all sat there for the next 80 without it being changed.

Not me i switched over after 60 and watched Im A Celebrity massive improvement in terms of entertainment value

[macandally]

Dour, unimaginative manager providing dour, unimaginative football. Have said it since the man was appointed and I dont know how anyone has any reason to argue against it.

The sooner he goes the better, but I think he is here for the season and I just pray that we do not give him any money to waste in January.

[houllierout]

I've made my comparison table into a easier to reuse link

http://tinyurl.com/avfcpremcomparison

I think by the end of December he'll be worse than GT...

[Dodgyknees]

If a McLeish team can't defend, then what's the point of McLeish?

I got the impression last night that McLeish thought his bizarre starting lineup was some sort of master stroke, and that we were going to contain Spurs all game.

It never looked like that. What he produced was one of the most inept performances I've ever witnessed.

Houllier had his game against liverpool, K Mac had his game against newcastle, MON had his game against Chelsea, and this was Mcleish's version.

The only positive about last night was that Spurs were happy to coast to a 2-0 victory. If they'd turned the screw we'd have lost 4 or 5 nil last night. Maybe more.

The team is just too disjointed.

Defence, fine. Didn't play well, but it's a back 4. 4 defenders.

Midfield is the place that mcLeish clearly struggles with. He must be too used to just hoofing from defence to attack because the midfield made no sense.

We had 3 naturally defensive players in that midfield. Petrov and Herd would be a good pairing in CM IF they had an attacking CM playing with them. But without, like last night, it just means we have nothing going forward. There is no-one linking defence with attack. We have a defensive set up, but without anyone there to pick up the ball and start an attack, that defensiveness becomes a liability because the ball will constantly be coming back at us.

usually if we play this, like against Norwich, we have pace on the wings to provide some sort of attack. Against Norwich it was N'Zogbia and Gabby when he drifted wide.

Yesterday we had hutton who tried to get forward but isn't good enough, and Heskey who, whilst an attacker by trade, can't play left wing and these days looks more defensive when he's out there than attacking, and just provides a much too tempting target for the inevitable hoofs from the back.

Gabby and Bent both play on the shoulder, or at least they did last night, which again means there was no-one dropping deep to link Petrov and Herd with attack. Normally with a striker who plays on the shoulder you want a midfielder, or deep lying striker, to fill the space between the oppositions midfield and defence. This means either the opposition defence pushes up to close the space in that hole, therefore giving your "on the shoulder" striker space to run in behind, or they stay deep and let the player in the hole have more space, but negate the "on the shoulder" striker from having space in behind.

But last night we had neither. We just had 2 "on the shoulder" strikers. It meant that Spurs could drop their defence deep to stop gabby or Bent getting in behind and not fear anyone roaming in the space they leave in front of them. Anytime our "wingers" got the ball, their only option was a hoof up front or pass it back to the defence. There was no-one running into those spaces in midfield to provide a pass.

And what really annoyed me was the lack of change. It was obvious from Spurs' first goal that this wasn't working. Yet nothign changed. no change in personnel, no obvious change in tactics, setup, mindset, anything.

Nothing at half time. And when a change did come after about 65 minutes, already too late, it was a straight swap, sticking another non-winger on the wing and not changing the system.

It was as if we'd given up.

I gave McLeish a chance. i really did. I wiped the slate clean and I actually liked what he was saying at the start of the season, and i thought maybe, just maybe, he'd do alright.

He's not alright. he's dire. Last night showed me that he does not know how to effectively set up a team's attack. He's clearly good at setting up a defence, but even that hasn't been right recently.

If he'd set us up well last night and we'd lost 2-0 you could say "well he doesn't have the right player yet, but it was a decent performance, i can see what he was doing".

I can't see what he was doing. He has the players. 2 out and out wingers last night would have been so much more effective.

I know they needed to be defensive. But play Gabby there. he's been defensive before. he has the pace to catch Bale if he got passed Cuellar. We had wingers who were next to useless once they got overlapped. No pace to get back at them, and no attacking prowess to cause any threat going forward.

Last night was dire, and unless something changes drastically, we're heading for a month of very, very few points.

Brilliant, best post I have seen for a while.

[barry'sboots]

The only surprise to me is that it has taken so many so long to realise just how inept the Ginger Tw*t is.

I just feel completely frustrated as a Villa fan at the minute. How do we convince RL - who clearly knows FA about football - that this guy needs to go asap if we are to stand any chance of sorting this mess out and getting the fans back on board. The pathetic words in his interview - including that bizarre reference to Ferguson's letter - just make me even more frustrated and highlights how out of touch RL is.