The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[Daweii]

Fergie started managing Man United at 45 and that wasn't even his first managing job either, at an even younger age he took Aberdeen to European glory. There is nothing to state that someone in their 30's is any less qualified to do a good job. If anything the adage of "old habits die hard" goes very well with rather old managers like McLeish, they get into a groove that they can't break out from..

[bickster]

If anything the adage of "old habits die hard" goes very well with rather old managers like McLeish, they get into a groove that they can't break out from..

Alex McLeish isn't even close to being old, he's 53

And you appear to have missed my point, I wasn't saying the manager had to be old, I was saying that ruling someone out because they were over 50 was ridiculous

Clearly Steve Clarke will be shit in the next two years and Steve Stone only has another ten years in him before he should be pensioned off (I'd argue after his performances for us, he should have been shot like a horse instead being allowed to train other footballers but hey... ;-) )

[Mantis]

It depends on the manager whether they're willing to adapt or not. McLeish isn't stuck in his negative ways because he's "old", he's stuck in those ways because that's who he is.

[bickster]

It depends on the manager whether they're willing to adapt. McLeish isn't stuck in his negative ways because he's "old", he's stuck in those ways because that's who he is.

Exactly, that's all I'm saying. Using his age against him is a non-argument

[Morpheus]

If Houllier was still our manager he probably would have got rid of Dunne, Collins, Warnock and Petrov by now as well as not signing Hutton so in that respect the choice between both Houllier and AM is a no brainer for me.

[TrentVilla]

It depends on the manager whether they're willing to adapt. McLeish isn't stuck in his negative ways because he's "old", he's stuck in those ways because that's who he is.

Exactly, that's all I'm saying. Using his age against him is a non-argument

I agree and I'm more of his biggest critics.

[markavfc40]

Can't believe we are arguing over who is worse, Houllier or Mcleish.

Well there's no contest there. McLeish wins by a mile. Worst Villa manager in the Premier League by a long distance.

Not much in it. Houllier was well past his use by date and a known cheque book manager who plays negative tippy tapppy football and had us playing some of the most gutless crap I have had the misfortune to witness.

McLeish and Houllier also have identical records - Houllier managed us for 28 games and achieved 33 points and McLeish has matched that. The only major difference is that in 28 games under McLeish we have conceded 10 goals less than we did in Houlliers 28 games. That and the fact that we had a much better squad under Houllier and that Houllier had the best part of 30 mill to spunk on players.

In all fairness though it is likely that McLeish will go down alongside Houllier as one of the biggest managerial **** ups we have seen in many a year. It is also the reason why most wouldn't trust Lerner and Faulkner to get the next managerial appointment right.

[TrentVilla]

Can't believe we are arguing over who is worse, Houllier or Mcleish.

Well there's no contest there. McLeish wins by a mile. Worst Villa manager in the Premier League by a long distance.

Not much in it. Houllier was well past his use by date and a known cheque book manager who plays negative tippy tapppy football and had us playing some of the most gutless crap I have had the misfortune to witness.

McLeish and Houllier also have identical records - Houllier managed us for 28 games and achieved 33 points and McLeish has matched that. The only major difference is that in 28 games under McLeish we have conceded 10 goals less than we did in Houlliers 28 games. That and the fact that we had a much better squad under Houllier and that Houllier had the best part of 30 mill to spunk on players.

In all fairness though it is likely that McLeish will go down alongside Houllier as one of the biggest managerial **** ups we have seen in many a year. It is also the reason why most wouldn't trust Lerner and Faulkner to get the next managerial appointment right.

Bang on the money for me that.

[macandally]

It depends on the manager whether they're willing to adapt. McLeish isn't stuck in his negative ways because he's "old", he's stuck in those ways because that's who he is.

Exactly, that's all I'm saying. Using his age against him is a non-argument

I am sure I said in my original post perhaps I am just being ageist! :?

I wasnt using McLeishes age to rule him out, but I stand by the point that younger coaches are more innovative in their training methods, in using fluid formations and in playing a more posession based, progressive game.

[Mantis]

Can't believe we are arguing over who is worse, Houllier or Mcleish.

Well there's no contest there. McLeish wins by a mile. Worst Villa manager in the Premier League by a long distance.

Not much in it. Houllier was well past his use by date and a known cheque book manager who plays negative tippy tapppy football and had us playing some of the most gutless crap I have had the misfortune to witness.

McLeish and Houllier also have identical records - Houllier managed us for 28 games and achieved 33 points and McLeish has matched that. The only major difference is that in 28 games under McLeish we have conceded 10 goals less than we did in Houlliers 28 games. That and the fact that we had a much better squad under Houllier and that Houllier had the best part of 30 mill to spunk on players.

In all fairness though it is likely that McLeish will go down alongside Houllier as one of the biggest managerial **** ups we have seen in many a year. It is also the reason why most wouldn't trust Lerner and Faulkner to get the next managerial appointment right.

You point out that Houllier had a better squad and more money to spend but you neglected to mention the huge injury crisis Houllier had and the fact that he only took over in September after an incredibly hectic summer. There were some shit games last season as you said but to me it's been twice as bad this season under McLeish. As far gutlessness goes McLeish is second to none.

Houllier didn't do a great job with us, but towards the end of his stint there were signs of improvement. We finished 9th in the end. Although there are still a few games of the season left, I can't see us finishing anywhere near 9th under McLeish.

[CI]

I don't think age is of any relevance whatsoever

Just look at SAF and Arry

[markavfc40]

[

Houllier didn't do a great job with us, but towards the end of his stint there were signs of improvement. We finished 9th in the end. Although there are still a few games of the season left, I can't see us finishing anywhere near 9th under McLeish.

Your right we did finish 9th. He didn't manage us for the last 5 games though when we had one of our best runs of the season taking 8 points from 5 games. He also didn't manage us for the first 5 games when we took 7 points from 5 games. Facts are that Houllier managed us for 28 games and achieved 33 points. It is also no coincidence I guess that Liverpool achieved their highest league placing during his tenure at a time when he was absent for a long period due to illness.

The guy was useless in his time with us. The fact that McLeish hasn't been any improvement doesn't make Houlliers time here look any sweeter. In fact given McLeish of all people has matched what he achieved makes Houlliers time look even worse.

[Stevo985]

I'd give my left bollock to still have Houllier in charge.

I wish he'd come back, rip out McLeish's heart and put it into his own chest to replace his dodgy one. Then he'd be raring to go.

[CI]

We finished 9th thanks to Ash, DJ and Bent plus the likes of Petrov pulling a finger out

Absolutely nothing to do with the out of touch GED

[macandally]

I don't think age is of any relevance whatsoever

Just look at SAF and Arry

Fashionably late, surely we discussed this a few pages ago!

[Mantis]

[

Houllier didn't do a great job with us, but towards the end of his stint there were signs of improvement. We finished 9th in the end. Although there are still a few games of the season left, I can't see us finishing anywhere near 9th under McLeish.

Your right we did finish 9th. He didn't manage us for the last 5 games though when we had one of our best runs of the season taking 8 points from 5 games. He also didn't manage us for the first 5 games when we took 7 points from 5 games. Facts are that Houllier managed us for 28 games and achieved 33 points. It is also no coincidence I guess that Liverpool achieved their highest league placing during his tenure at a time when he was absent for a long period due to illness.

The guy was useless in his time with us. The fact that McLeish hasn't been any improvement doesn't make Houlliers time here look any sweeter. In fact given McLeish of all people has matched what he achieved makes Houlliers time look even worse.

I don't think it's fair to act as if GMac's short stint as caretaker manager was a completely different era altogether. I can guarantee that if we'd done terribly under GMac people would be blaming Houllier for it. Also, I think it's incredibly unfair to imply that Liverpool finished 2nd in 2002

No, McLeish's disasterous spell at Villa doesn't make Houllier any better, although it certainly makes me miss him.

How can you say McLeish has matched what Houllier achieved? Season's not over yet. If we finish 9th then you can say that.because Houllier wasn't in charge at the time.

[markavfc40]

[

How can you say McLeish has matched what Houllier achieved?

Thats **** easy. Houllier managed Aston Villa for 28 league games and achieved the not so grand total of 33 points. McLeish has managed Aston Villa for 28 games so far and has so far achieved the not so grand total of 33 points.

What is this bollocks that you keep spouting about us finishing 9th under Houllier? he wasn't manager for 10 games of the season when we got 15 points at 1.5 points a game. He was manager for 28 games where we got 33 points at 1.17 points a game. Over a 38 game season that would be 44 points. Will McLeish continue to match Houlliers 1.17 points a game and get us to 44 points. Who knows but even if he does it is still, as it was under Houllier, not good enough.

[Mantis]

Houllier was manager when we finished 9th. GMac may have been caretaker manager for the last 5 games but he was still manager. Who picked GMac in the first place? Who signed Bent (who scored won us 4 points in those last 5 games)? I'm not trying to argue that finishing 9th was somehow amazing, all I'm doing is pointing out that we finished 9th under Houllier.

[DelboyVilla]

Blimey, let's face it Houllier wasn't good enough, we got rid, thank McGrath (I know that wasn't the reason but we had a lucky escape)! McLeish is no better, so let's get rid! Problem is Lerner and Faulkner can't be trusted to pick thier own noses never mind a decent manager, there in lies the problem.

[CI]

I don't think age is of any relevance whatsoever

Just look at SAF and Arry

Fashionably late, surely we discussed this a few pages ago!

Well we've got 624 pages of repetition, didn't want to buck the trend ;-)