The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[sharkyvilla]

Everton are a clear example of not being up with us in terms of wherewithal, but due to the appointment of a decent manager is able to compete with us.

If we had a manager over the years of moyes capability, we would be light years in front of Everton as it stands we are bed partners.

I would actually put O'Neill up in the same bracket as Moyes. The only difference is that Moyes is prepared to put up with the rough as well as the smooth, which MON clearly wasn't. Shame really, and I wonder whether MON is regretting the day he left as he obviously hasn't found a similar project to the Villa one since he left. He did lift the club and players whilst he was here and although he was by no means perfect, managers with that kind of ability don't come round very often.

[holtelower]

But the point was - if thats what we wanted, there was a perfect candidate, who was about 15 yrs younger than Martin O'Neill, had a similar kind of style to him, had a hell of a lot of ambition, and left a job thinking he would come here.

We chose to ignore him - why ? - to this day, it is unfathomable.

[pete165]

I think that you will find that N'Zogbia was worth considerably less than we paid for him at the time that we bought him. Buying a £3m player for £9.5m is the only thing that McLeish hasn't yet been picked up on yet..

In what sense was he a "£3m player"?

His club were asking £10m and were reluctant to sell.

£9.5m was the price we had to pay if we wanted to get him.

Nzogbia has never done anything in his career to suggest that he is any more than a very average £3m player

didn't he play well enough to get in the france international squad?

[steaknchips]

Everton are a clear example of not being up with us in terms of wherewithal, but due to the appointment of a decent manager is able to compete with us.

If we had a manager over the years of moyes capability, we would be light years in front of Everton as it stands we are bed partners.

I would actually put O'Neill up in the same bracket as Moyes. The only difference is that Moyes is prepared to put up with the rough as well as the smooth, which MON clearly wasn't. Shame really, and I wonder whether MON is regretting the day he left as he obviously hasn't found a similar project to the Villa one since he left. He did lift the club and players whilst he was here and although he was by no means perfect, managers with that kind of ability don't come round very often.

Both are just average managers on the grand scale of things..I mean how many years has Moyes been at Everton? Plenty enough time to instill a winning system if he was a top drawer coach.

We need a coach that can come in and change things, not just get by, allowing the big clubs to continue to dominate the league..We need a guy similar to what Poyet can do in the Championship..And thats come into the club a build a winning structure and side with a whole new playing style. Did he care that teams like Leceister, West Ham and co' were bigger and had bigger names? No he didnt, he believes in his team building and style and is in the competition to win it, not just get by.

[TRO]

Everton are a clear example of not being up with us in terms of wherewithal, but due to the appointment of a decent manager is able to compete with us.

If we had a manager over the years of moyes capability, we would be light years in front of Everton as it stands we are bed partners.

I would actually put O'Neill up in the same bracket as Moyes. The only difference is that Moyes is prepared to put up with the rough as well as the smooth, which MON clearly wasn't. Shame really, and I wonder whether MON is regretting the day he left as he obviously hasn't found a similar project to the Villa one since he left. He did lift the club and players whilst he was here and although he was by no means perfect, managers with that kind of ability don't come round very often.

There is an aweful lot you say i agree with, but there were some serious flaws too.

Moyes plays more of an expansive game than O'neill, you can clearly see Method in Moyes team....O'Neill was smash and grab and no clear indication of any kind of control of the game being employed.

Aston Villa is a big job for any football manager and unless you are likely to secure a top four job, they don't come any bigger.

The expectation at Villa Park is a myth.....It is much more subdued by the fans than the media admit too.

The expectation at villa park should be massive, because with the right factors in place they are capable of it.

It is Randy's Job.....no one elses to make sure these factors are in place.

Randy ....its time for delegation to be over......its down to you mate.....stand up and be counted.

[TRO]

One thing that sets the all time greats like Fergie and co out from plodders is an obvious thing that seems to have been missed.

Yes - Fergie has signed some duffers - but what makes him great is he isn't afraid to admit he has made the mistake and gets shot of that "duffer" pretty quickly. JJx2 , Bartez, Bosnich, Veron , Cruyff etc....

Crap buys, but how long did they stay ?

What the also ran managers like MON (and I regret to say McLeish) do is buy duffers,but then wont admit the mistake and continue to employ them at the club.

Back on question, there is no way in this world that McLeish will leave the Villa, either by sacking or walking.

He wont be sacked, he would demand a hefty fee to go, and who on earth will take the job now. I mean, Benitez and Martinez wouldn't take it when we thought we could compete - what chance now. We'd be lucky to attract Steve Staunton and Graham Taylor !.

As for walking, McLeish just wont do it, for pride and for money

Whether we finish top 4 or bottom 3 - it will be McLeish who does it - unfortunately (to think, I honestly thought we would end up with Ancelotti and Wilkins.) - thats not McLeish's fault obviously, but it is so deflating

The good managers deal with their mistakes..... no other way to put it.

spot on.

[TRO]

I would not put O'Neill in the Moyes Bracket.

I would say Moyes has far more about himself in terms of Honourability, loyalty, Nous and the most of all Humility.

In my personal opinion, Randy Lerner was great to Martin O'Neill. Within reasonable terms Randy gave him all the money he wanted and the freedom to work with it.

Martin made mistakes and rather than own the mistakes he then threw his teddy out of the Pram.

Gerard Houllier made a monumental mistake at Anfield disrespecting the Villa fans by lauding the Liverpool fans....an error of judgement you would not expect from a seasoned campaigner.

However

Martin O'Neill ,addresses a dinner in the Holte made possible by the club to negate the dissappointment in Moscow by the travelling fans and makes his point of saying "I will apologise, but i won't do it again" or words to that effect....Sincerity in its most diluted form possible.

I am seriously not sure which is the biggest snub, because if I had of been in the Holte that day my dinner would still be there.Had i been at Liverpool perhaps I would have understood more ( but he was only with us a few weeks) sorry for being so understanding.

we have simply had too many managers not in tune with what we all want to achieve.

SUCCESS.

[bose]

Just saw this comment from McLeish.

'It's not going to be the Aston Villa of 1982 or the giddy heights of a couple of years ago.'

The "giddy heights" of two years ago? That may be the most depressing thing I've read regarding Villa in the last few months (and that's not easy!).

[TRO]

Just saw this comment from McLeish.

'It's not going to be the Aston Villa of 1982 or the giddy heights of a couple of years ago.'

The "giddy heights" of two years ago? That may be the most depressing thing I've read regarding Villa in the last few months (and that's not easy!).

That has just sent me giddy.

god knows what he would say of Rotterdam and the era.

[steaknchips]

I would not put O'Neill in the Moyes Bracket.

I would say Moyes has far more about himself in terms of Honourability, loyalty, Nous and the most of all Humility.

In my personal opinion, Randy Lerner was great to Martin O'Neill. Within reasonable terms Randy gave him all the money he wanted and the freedom to work with it.

Martin made mistakes and rather than own the mistakes he then threw his teddy out of the Pram.

Gerard Houllier made a monumental mistake at Anfield disrespecting the Villa fans by lauding the Liverpool fans....an error of judgement you would not expect from a seasoned campaigner.

However

Martin O'Neill ,addresses a dinner in the Holte made possible by the club to negate the dissappointment in Moscow by the travelling fans and makes his point of saying "I will apologise, but i won't do it again" or words to that effect....Sincerity in its most diluted form possible.

I am seriously not sure which is the biggest snub, because if I had of been in the Holte that day my dinner would still be there.Had i been at Liverpool perhaps I would have understood more ( but he was only with us a few weeks) sorry for being so understanding.

we have simply had too many managers not in tune with what we all want to achieve.

SUCCESS.

For us to achieve greatness again, we need huge changes..Houllier was doing this.

If you want Champions league football at Aston Villa, then Houllier was our best bet..He is the only manager(out of MON,McLeish,K'mac) that knew players like Dunne, Collins, Gabby, Warnock etc were not good enough..It was this man that was in the process of doing something about it. If you want change, you have to back it and believe it. Dont be scared of a few bumps whilst the changes are being implimented..

As it is we got scared as a majority and we have kept the mediocrity label ever since..And the mediocrity players to go with it...And with additions like Hutton and Jenas, its all same, same, same..

[TRO]

I would not put O'Neill in the Moyes Bracket.

I would say Moyes has far more about himself in terms of Honourability, loyalty, Nous and the most of all Humility.

In my personal opinion, Randy Lerner was great to Martin O'Neill. Within reasonable terms Randy gave him all the money he wanted and the freedom to work with it.

Martin made mistakes and rather than own the mistakes he then threw his teddy out of the Pram.

Gerard Houllier made a monumental mistake at Anfield disrespecting the Villa fans by lauding the Liverpool fans....an error of judgement you would not expect from a seasoned campaigner.

However

Martin O'Neill ,addresses a dinner in the Holte made possible by the club to negate the dissappointment in Moscow by the travelling fans and makes his point of saying "I will apologise, but i won't do it again" or words to that effect....Sincerity in its most diluted form possible.

I am seriously not sure which is the biggest snub, because if I had of been in the Holte that day my dinner would still be there.Had i been at Liverpool perhaps I would have understood more ( but he was only with us a few weeks) sorry for being so understanding.

we have simply had too many managers not in tune with what we all want to achieve.

SUCCESS.

For us to achieve greatness again, we need huge changes..Houllier was doing this.

If you want Champions league football at Aston Villa, then Houllier was our best bet..He is the only manager(out of MON,McLeish,K'mac) that knew players like Dunne, Collins, Gabby, Warnock etc were not good enough..It was this man that was in the process of doing something about it. If you want change, you have to back it and believe it. Dont be scared of a few bumps whilst the changes are being implimented..

As it is we got scared as a majority and we have kept the mediocrity label ever since..And the mediocrity players to go with it...And with additions like Hutton and Jenas, its all same, same, same..

S&N I'm not sure if Houllier was the man....he might have been.... but I think your overall philosophy is right.

[steaknchips]

I would not put O'Neill in the Moyes Bracket.

I would say Moyes has far more about himself in terms of Honourability, loyalty, Nous and the most of all Humility.

In my personal opinion, Randy Lerner was great to Martin O'Neill. Within reasonable terms Randy gave him all the money he wanted and the freedom to work with it.

Martin made mistakes and rather than own the mistakes he then threw his teddy out of the Pram.

Gerard Houllier made a monumental mistake at Anfield disrespecting the Villa fans by lauding the Liverpool fans....an error of judgement you would not expect from a seasoned campaigner.

However

Martin O'Neill ,addresses a dinner in the Holte made possible by the club to negate the dissappointment in Moscow by the travelling fans and makes his point of saying "I will apologise, but i won't do it again" or words to that effect....Sincerity in its most diluted form possible.

I am seriously not sure which is the biggest snub, because if I had of been in the Holte that day my dinner would still be there.Had i been at Liverpool perhaps I would have understood more ( but he was only with us a few weeks) sorry for being so understanding.

we have simply had too many managers not in tune with what we all want to achieve.

SUCCESS.

For us to achieve greatness again, we need huge changes..Houllier was doing this.

If you want Champions league football at Aston Villa, then Houllier was our best bet..He is the only manager(out of MON,McLeish,K'mac) that knew players like Dunne, Collins, Gabby, Warnock etc were not good enough..It was this man that was in the process of doing something about it. If you want change, you have to back it and believe it. Dont be scared of a few bumps whilst the changes are being implimented..

As it is we got scared as a majority and we have kept the mediocrity label ever since..And the mediocrity players to go with it...And with additions like Hutton and Jenas, its all same, same, same..

S&N I'm not sure if Houllier was the man....he might have been.... but I think your overall philosophy is right.

Just answer me these questions;

Group A;Dunne, Gabby, Warnock, Beye, Sidwell, Carew, Collins,

Group B;Bent, Makoun, Downing, Young, Clark, Albrighton, Bannan, Delph

Out of those 2 groups which are most likely to play in the Champions League?

Out of those 2 groups who looked better under the last regime?

Out of those 2 groups who would you keep and build your team around for next season?

Now answer this; Out of those 2 groups, which looks best under McLeish??

Houllier and Duverne = top of the tree in modern day techniques, training, coaching, playing styles, player development, connections on the European stage etc.

[sellbydate]

Duverne was part of the France staff that got sacked for failing spectacularly. He was well known for causing trouble. He pissed off the most professional and best left-back in the world in Patrice Evra.

give it a rest.

[macandally]

I am with S&C on this and always have been. We live in a culture where we want everything yesterday, fast food, coffee shops, chip and pin, nobody wants to wait for anything anymore. I think the only thing Houllier was guilty of was trying to change things too fast, but if anyone thinks that changes arent needed to move the club forward then I am not sure of their thought process.

McLeish is a horrific appointment and the fact he reportedly said that he was "the only man brave enough to take the job" winds me up. Hughes would have come, Sanches Florez would have come and both would have been better appointments.

I will be surprised if McLeish is here at the end of the season. Pacifying a changing room of overpaid and underworked supposed pro's is not enough to maintain a job, he needs to deliver and the quotes from today are two fingers up at the Villa faithful to me. A bad workmen always blames his tools and McLeish is doing that already. Someone like Moyes would eak out peformances from this team.

I hope that Gus Poyet is given a chance to manage a club of our stature. He is young enough to identify with the younger players, played at the highest levels and appears to have a modern and progressive coaching philosophy. It would be a medium to long term project (5 year plan, remember that!) but it might just give us a chance of achieving something in the future over and above mid table mediocrity.

Before the money mongers start interfering, how much have Arsenal spent in maintaining a constant champions league push over the last 10 years?

[steaknchips]

Duverne was part of the France staff that got sacked for failing spectacularly. He was well known for causing trouble. He pissed off the most professional and best left-back in the world in Patrice Evra.

give it a rest.

Duverne is a winner and was telling the "on strike" French team to train..I think if you ask any French player thats worked with Duverne, all you will hear is great praise...Lyon won "all" of their recent success with him as trainer.

[steaknchips]

macandally,

Poyet is the man...We should get him now before its too late. Because before too long he will snapped up by a big team.

[VamosMiAstonVilla]

Just watched that press conference on AVTV. So uninspiring and depressing. Can't believe he's using the 'it's not 1982' card already. Valencia got rid of Villa, Mata and Silva yet I watched them boss Barca the other night. Plenty of examples of teams who have sold but are still strong through shrewd transfer dealings and non-defeatist managers.

The fact he is still searching for an attacking system that works says it all. Did he not have an idea on how he wanted to play before the season stated?

[DeepDish]

I think I will see in end of May if I have an opinion on McLeish then. Think it is quite early and short sighted to have an opinion now.

[Zatman]

I saw Steve Stride on Saturday, he didn't look very well, hope he's ok

Then I saw Faulkner, busy texting instead of watching the game !! Nero fiddles while Rome burns

Wait a minute, you saw Faulkner texting during a game? Well that's just one step too far. I can't believe he hasn't been disciplined what must Randy be thinking. This text could be the reason for our relegation and if not its surely responsible for Nzogbias poor form. I just hope he doesn't do it against QPR or we will surely lose.

maybe he was texting McLeish as according to some people here in january he personally signed Bent so maybe was giving Eck some advice

[Zatman]

Just watched that press conference on AVTV. So uninspiring and depressing. Can't believe he's using the 'IT's NOT 1982' card already. Valencia got rid of Villa, Mata and Silva yet I watched them boss Barca the other night. Plenty of examples of teams who have sold but are still strong through shrewd transfer dealings and non-defeatist managers.

Should be sacked for being realistic and knowing what year it actually

haha yeah they really bossed Barcelona when Barcelona could have had 2 penalties and Guaita made some good saves.