Mantis Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.So basically, you're accusing him of not being decent based on the fact that he didn't resign just because you didn't want him there? So if me and a few other people on here grow unhappy with McLeish as manager, it would be indecent of him to not resign just because I wasn't happy with him as manager? Ridiculous. You're entitled to your opinion on him as we all are but I don't think it's fair at all to label somebody as indecent just because you weren't happy with them and they didn't resign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VamosMiAstonVilla Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Ashley Young, Downing , Bent had no problem with him. The majority of players who have played under him sing his praises. The one's that don't are unsurprisingly the likes of Ireland, Dunne, Collins - terminal losers. Nobody is saying last season was a success, it was far from that but Houllier plan/priority was to change us into a winning club. For this to happen lots of changes needed to be made. That was his priority not going on a cup run or finishing as high as possible in the league. As I said, short-term pain for long-term gain. What on earth are you talking about ?? He wanted to change us to a winning club ? WE WERE A WINNING CLUB !!! - the four months previous I'd been to Wembley twice in two months- it was twice in 20 yrs before that !!!!!! A winning club finishing 6th three times in a row? LOL Houllier plans were a lot bigger than that. He doesn't subscribe to the British mentality of accepting mediocrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted September 1, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 1, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.So basically, you're accusing him of not being decent based on the fact that he didn't resign just because you didn't want him there? So if me and a few other people on here grow unhappy with McLeish as manager, it would be indecent of him to not resign just because I wasn't happy with him as manager? Ridiculous. You're entitled to your opinion on him as we all are but I don't think it's fair at all to label somebody as indecent just because you weren't happy with them and they didn't resign. That is quite clearly not what he is saying, it is rather obvious he is talking about his health and his attempts to stay in the job rather than quit. I'm sure you probably already knew exactly what he meant though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted September 1, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 1, 2011 Ashley Young, Downing , Bent had no problem with him. The majority of players who have played under him sing his praises. The one's that don't are unsurprisingly the likes of Ireland, Dunne, Collins - terminal losers. Nobody is saying last season was a success, it was far from that but Houllier plan/priority was to change us into a winning club. For this to happen lots of changes needed to be made. That was his priority not going on a cup run or finishing as high as possible in the league. As I said, short-term pain for long-term gain. What on earth are you talking about ?? He wanted to change us to a winning club ? WE WERE A WINNING CLUB !!! - the four months previous I'd been to Wembley twice in two months- it was twice in 20 yrs before that !!!!!! A winning club finishing 6th three times in a row? LOL Houllier plans were a lot bigger than that. He doesn't subscribe to the British mentality of accepting mediocrity. Only nobody including you know what his plans were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Thanks Trent. Saved me the trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Ashley Young, Downing , Bent had no problem with him. The majority of players who have played under him sing his praises. The one's that don't are unsurprisingly the likes of Ireland, Dunne, Collins - terminal losers. Nobody is saying last season was a success, it was far from that but Houllier plan/priority was to change us into a winning club. For this to happen lots of changes needed to be made. That was his priority not going on a cup run or finishing as high as possible in the league. As I said, short-term pain for long-term gain. What on earth are you talking about ?? He wanted to change us to a winning club ? WE WERE A WINNING CLUB !!! - the four months previous I'd been to Wembley twice in two months- it was twice in 20 yrs before that !!!!!! A winning club finishing 6th three times in a row? LOL Houllier plans were a lot bigger than that. He doesn't subscribe to the British mentality of accepting mediocrity. Only nobody including you know what his plans were. As a connoisseur of all things French, I could actually see what his plans were.. :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.So basically, you're accusing him of not being decent based on the fact that he didn't resign just because you didn't want him there? So if me and a few other people on here grow unhappy with McLeish as manager, it would be indecent of him to not resign just because I wasn't happy with him as manager? Ridiculous. You're entitled to your opinion on him as we all are but I don't think it's fair at all to label somebody as indecent just because you weren't happy with them and they didn't resign. That is quite clearly not what he is saying, it is rather obvious he is talking about his health and his attempts to stay in the job rather than quit. I'm sure you probably already knew exactly what he meant though.Actually, it isn't clear at all. Now that you've pointed that out it does indeed make more sense. However, I interpreted it to mean that he was incapable as in not good enough. I apologise to Mark if he meant incapable as in physically incapable. However, even then I don't think it's fair to label him as indecent. What if Houllier himself felt he was capable (which was was probably the case)? All in all I feel Mark's being overly harsh on him. Bad manager? In his opinion, so fair enough. Physically incapable of doing the job after the heart scare? Most likely. But indecent for not resigning after that? No, I really didn't know exactly what he meant. Why would I deliberately misinterpret him? :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted September 1, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 1, 2011 Only nobody including you know what his plans were. As a connoisseur of all things French, I could actually see what his plans were.. :winkold: I don't doubt you could If not I'm sure you had him on speed dial to check. :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Did he really get a 5million pay off? any links or was just rumoured speculation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Thought it was about £3m for doing sweet FA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloBarnesi Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 As a connoisseur of all things French, I could actually see what his plans were.. :winkold: to make us as successful as the French are at winning the Tour :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Houllier - what a disaster that was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man. Totally agree with that statement! Sometimes in life you need to show a bit of pride in the job you do and realise that sometimes you are not in the right job! Hanging around waiting for a big pay out smacks of desparation!!! Thought it was about £3m for doing sweet FA The 5 probably included the wages he had already picked for doing jigsaws of the 1979/1980 Plop side! Whatever the pay out was it was too much! Though to be fair everyone in football seems to think they deserve some kind of pay out whether or not they were shit at their job, so he's not alone on that one! I always remember what a boring team the Plop was under Houllier though others seem to think that they th Barca of their time??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VamosMiAstonVilla Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Why shouldn't he be paid compo? He wanted to stay remember the health problems were not his fault. If you want to be outraged at compensation payments maybe your anger would be better aimed at us paying compensation to BC for tapping up Mcleish :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelboyVilla Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Why shouldn't he be paid compo? He wanted to stay remember the health problems were not his fault. If you want to be outraged at compensation payments maybe your anger would be better aimed at us paying compensation to BC for tapping up Mcleish :shock: And MON from the tribunal??? All the compo paid out by our board over the past 12 months smacks of incompetance in the highest order!!! Would have paid for a half decent player?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 FFS, you just rubbished Jenas on loan and put Joke Cole and Hitz as better options. I can no longer take your opinion seriously. That's ok, I never took your opinion seriously in the first place But to set the record straight, what I actually said was a fit and motivated Joe Cole was 10 times the player that Jenas is. I also acknowledge that Joe Cole does not seem to be fit and motivated lately. I never said he was a better option. As for Hitz... 50+ caps for Germany and some excellent performances for West Ham when he came back for injury. Or Jenas, who's been predominantly warming the bench for Spurs for the last couple of years. I'll stand by that opinion I think. I'm just controversial like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macandally Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.So basically, you're accusing him of not being decent based on the fact that he didn't resign just because you didn't want him there? So if me and a few other people on here grow unhappy with McLeish as manager, it would be indecent of him to not resign just because I wasn't happy with him as manager? Ridiculous. You're entitled to your opinion on him as we all are but I don't think it's fair at all to label somebody as indecent just because you weren't happy with them and they didn't resign. This, when did you become the voice of the masses?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDuck Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.So basically, you're accusing him of not being decent based on the fact that he didn't resign just because you didn't want him there? So if me and a few other people on here grow unhappy with McLeish as manager, it would be indecent of him to not resign just because I wasn't happy with him as manager? Ridiculous. You're entitled to your opinion on him as we all are but I don't think it's fair at all to label somebody as indecent just because you weren't happy with them and they didn't resign. This, when did you become the voice of the masses?? Can't blame GH for accepting a pay off... blame the idiot who gave a man with previous heart problems a job in the pressure-cooker intensity of the Premier league! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 As painful as it may be lets just imagine for a minute that Houllier would have stayed beyond last season. Nothing about his career, especially in England, suggests he would have been able to cope with little money to spend. Quite the opposite. In fact having to spend less than half what we have brought in. He simply wouldn't have coped. We struggled for the vast majority of last season and that was with Downing and Young our two best players. Houllier and no money would have been painful viewing. We were very fortunate last season that he was given the best part of 30 mill to spend in January. Without it there is a very real possibility we would have been relegated. In fact even having spent that amount, and having spent far more on one player, potentially twice as much,as any other manager, we were still in the mix for the drop with a couple of games to go. Given the fact he failed to take any responsibility for our woes last season prefering to blame any Tom, Dick, Warnock, Dunne,Ireland, O'Neill...... for the shit we were in you can just imagine he'd have been armed and ready with the excuse of having little money to spend. Given the players we have and our finances McLeish ,whilst in no way my first or my ideal choice, is a much better fit than Houllier. He'll take responsbility, accept that having taken the job it is down to him to get the best out of the players he has inherited and won't make excuses or pass the buck if things don't go well. In fact taking responsibility and showing leadership is the least you'd expect a manager to do. Sadly Houllier failed to do that and we almost paid the ultimate price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steaknchips Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 As painful as it may be lets just imagine for a minute that Houllier would have stayed beyond last season. Nothing about his career, especially in England, suggests he would have been able to cope with little money to spend. Quite the opposite. In fact having to spend less than half what we have brought in. He simply wouldn't have coped. We struggled for the vast majority of last season and that was with Downing and Young our two best players. Houllier and no money would have been painful viewing. We were very fortunate last season that he was given the best part of 30 mill to spend in January. Without it there is a very real possibility we would have been relegated. In fact even having spent that amount, and having spent far more on one player, potentially twice as much,as any other manager, we were still in the mix for the drop with a couple of games to go. Given the fact he failed to take any responsibility for our woes last season prefering to blame any Tom, Dick, Warnock, Dunne,Ireland, O'Neill...... for the shit we were in you can just imagine he'd have been armed and ready with the excuse of having little money to spend. Given the players we have and our finances McLeish ,whilst in no way my first or my ideal choice, is a much better fit than Houllier. He'll take responsbility, accept that having taken the job it is down to him to get the best out of the players he has inherited and won't make excuses or pass the buck if things don't go well. In fact taking responsibility and showing leadership is the least you'd expect a manager to do. Sadly Houllier failed to do that and we almost paid the ultimate price. Its all guess work...Because had Houllier stayed players like Dunne, Warnock, Collins, Heskey and Petrov could very well have departed just like Sidwell, Carew, Davis, etc did in the Jan..Thus freeing up huge spaces on the wages to bring in replacements....Houllier may well have done this summer, what McLeish will be doing "next summer"..Houllier could have been ahead with the progression of Villa. He was also ahead on getting the youth moving through the squad, or out on loan..Nothing was stale or standing still. Plans were in place to bring in the new recruits.. Even if Downing and Young had gone, just like they did with McLeish, there is no guarantee he would have spent 10m on N'Zogbia putting him on 60k a week...He may have bought Shaqiri for 8m and Fofana for 800k instead putting them on 30k/40k a week.. He may have signed Westwood on a free putting him on 45k a week instead of Given on 60k a week..Also freeing up another 20k a week for maybe another young star player from the continent..Its all guess work.. One thing was certain, is that he expected high standards and the players to reach higher levels in training and work rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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