Houllier or Mcleish

[Zatman]

Whilst I agree the Club is in safer hands now, that's a bit unfair considering he pulled off the best transfer in our recent history with Darren Bent

Some people on here considered him a Paul Faulkner signing at the time

[macandally]

Unfortunately, you are symptomatic of modern culture where everything has to NOW, NOW, NOW. The fact you cannot see where Houlliers approach could have taken us does not surprise me.

Actually I've got no problems with allowing a manager time to build something. The thing is just giving a manager time doesn't guarantee success. Giving the wrong manager time will lead to nothing but trouble and there is no doubt in my mind that houllier was the wrong manager.

His style of football was not effective, it didn't work. You can bang on all you want that it would have in the long term but there's nothing to prove that. Just you and the football manager crew repeating your delusional ideas.

As I say he showed a complete lack of tactical skill, complete lack of man management skills, terrible pr skills and through his own arrogance and incompetence lost the fans early on.

Still excuses get made for what was an awlful performance from an awlful manager.

Nothing to suggest long term, apart from his previous record of course which eclipses McGish and his two team league success. But yep, it didnt work, your right and we are going round in circles because your blinkered.

Ergo, trying to explain something to someone who refuses to listen is pointless, and for that reason, I am out.

Enjoy McLeish and his tactical nous whilst us delusional people think of what might have been.

[Big_John_10]

Nothing to suggest long term, apart from his previous record of course which eclipses McGish and his two team league success. But yep, it didnt work, your right and we are going round in circles because your blinkered.

That's the thing. You ignore the facts infront of you, ignore last season and base it all on the past. That doesn't mean it's guaranteed to work. There are managers who have done well years ago that wouldn't produce the same results now. It's ridiculous to keep claiming that because he did it in the past he'd be great for us.

Ergo, trying to explain something to someone who refuses to listen is pointless, and for that reason, I am out.

As is trying to point out facts and evidence to someone who ignore it all.

Enjoy McLeish and his tactical nous whilst us delusional people think of what might have been.

Will do, enjoy the daydreaming while playing football manager.

[CI]

People talk about Houllier like he was some sort of managerial demi god down B6

FFS, the guy was a joke, a walking, talking embarrassment to the club, and the football was dire - tippy tappy shite on the halfway line and woeful defending

Thank god he only signed Pires and Bradley on loan and that the Fofana and Cummings deals collapsed. Makoun from day 1 looked woefully ill equipped for PL football and his stinking contempt for the fans belongs to a bygone era.

What a Les Miserables spell of shite his tenure was

[RunRickyRun]

Quick question for the people that voted Houlier

If you swapped Randy and Carson last January...

Which one of us would have survived?

I doubt we would have survived without Bent. I think Blose would have survived with Pav and Nzogbia

[ChrisNichollsToe]

People talk about Houllier like he was some sort of managerial demi god down B6

FFS, the guy was a joke, a walking, talking embarrassment to the club, and the football was dire - tippy tappy shite on the halfway line and woeful defending

Thank god he only signed Pires and Bradley on loan and that the Fofana and Cummings deals collapsed. Makoun from day 1 looked woefully ill equipped for PL football and his stinking contempt for the fans belongs to a bygone era.

What a Les Miserables spell of shite his tenure was

Somebody told me Houllier did Jigsaw Puzzles in his spare time at Bodymoor......

Ranted and raved about how one took him three months to complete, when on the box, it said 3-4 years

[HackneyVillain]

People talk about Houllier like he was some sort of managerial demi god down B6

FFS, the guy was a joke, a walking, talking embarrassment to the club, and the football was dire - tippy tappy shite on the halfway line and woeful defending

Thank god he only signed Pires and Bradley on loan and that the Fofana and Cummings deals collapsed. Makoun from day 1 looked woefully ill equipped for PL football and his stinking contempt for the fans belongs to a bygone era.

What a Les Miserables spell of shite his tenure was

I don't agree, especially the bit in bold. Not getting Fofana will come back to haunt us I fear.

GH was far from perfect but he was also far from the joke he has been made out to be.

[CI]

My fear is Fofana would have been filed in the same category as Jean II Makoun

[holtelower]

And after a transfer window, still not going to vote.

The fact is, I could see exactly what they were both attempting to do, they went about it in totally different ways, but they both had a plan.

Only time will tell which one was the better option.

I'd have liked to see Houllier's all football philosophy come to frution - but maybe it would never have

It won't be as lovely as watching Barcalona style football under McLeish, but the fact is, if we play boring football in the FA Cup final and win it 1-0 - I think I'll take it.

[steaknchips]

My fear is Fofana would have been filed in the same category as Jean II Makoun

We will see...But for a French under 20 captain, the 1.5m Lyon have just paid for him looks good business.

[macandally]

Nothing to suggest long term, apart from his previous record of course which eclipses McGish and his two team league success. But yep, it didnt work, your right and we are going round in circles because your blinkered.

That's the thing. You ignore the facts infront of you, ignore last season and base it all on the past. That doesn't mean it's guaranteed to work. There are managers who have done well years ago that wouldn't produce the same results now. It's ridiculous to keep claiming that because he did it in the past he'd be great for us.

Ergo, trying to explain something to someone who refuses to listen is pointless, and for that reason, I am out.

As is trying to point out facts and evidence to someone who ignore it all.

Enjoy McLeish and his tactical nous whilst us delusional people think of what might have been.

Will do, enjoy the daydreaming while playing football manager.

Jon, I am 40 years old. The only reason I even know about football manager is because people with little imagination throw it around on here.

Last season began what was needed, an overhaul of overpaid, underworked players. Unfortunately, the job didnt get finished and we get to spend this season complaining about Warnock, Dunne, Collins, Petrov...............

A manager get selected on previous experience and successes, how would you propose we pick them in the future. Lucky Dip???

[VamosMiAstonVilla]

Popular opinion seems to be that Ash and Gabby both had their poorest seasons for us last year under the French genius.

You've hit the nail on the head there. Popular opinion in football is more often than not wrong. The majority of fans at all clubs are so short-sighted, they have no patience, they don't understand the game. Nobody is going to tell me Ashley didn't become a better player last season. As for Gabby, did you not see his goal vs Blackburn?

CI - like it or not landing Houllier was a coup for us, as was landing Makoun - a Champions League player who has unsurprisingly has now gone to a Champions League club. And make no mistake, Olympiakos would hammer us.

Playing hoofball in a half empty stadium would only wet the appetite of the bitter or the uneducated.

[CI]

My fear is Fofana would have been filed in the same category as Jean II Makoun

We will see...But for a French under 20 captain, the 1.5m Lyon have just paid for him looks good business.

Wasn't GED'y about to snap him up for about £5m ?

[holtelower]

Sorry Vami whatever it is - that is a load of tripe.

gabby against Blackburn - er, that was last week not last season. Forgive me if I am wrong, but last season , the only thing Gabby did was text his missus from the dugout - coz he was substitute more often than not whilst we played Emile Heskey up there.

As for Makoun - just coz he came from France, does not mean he was ever going to make it here. They were talking today about the bloke Everton have loaned from Argentina. They said, last year, Wigan bought the top scorer in the whole of South America - someone called Boselli - ever heard of him???

Styles are different in different countries - they are not bad players, but they will just not make it - Christian Poulson is a perfect examply. Makoun may be a good player in France, he may be in Greece, but he wasnt in England- and thats why the manager who bought him, dropped him !.

Houllier may well have improved us long term, but dont tell me last year was a success and he improved the players. Was you standing on the terraces of Eastlands on a cold Wednesday thinking "oooh, I am glad I have just spent £100 thinking we could get to Wembley, only to play our youth side because we could never win it anyway"

Did he improve Dunne, Warnock, Collins, Gabby etc...etc.....

Did he improve our kids, or maybe destroy their confidence by playing them too much too soon.

I wont go on

Behave yourself !

[CI]

Last season was a debacle, it picked up and we survived A. Because GED went and we reverted to the old style of play with Petrov recalled etc and B. because there were 7 or 8 woeful teams in the division (as there are again this year).

Lets not forget last year we LOST to SHA, Wolves (at home) and Olbyion, we were an embarassment. GED installed no fight, belief or confidence, he ridiculed players in public and lost the dressing room very early

What an awful man manager

[VamosMiAstonVilla]

Ashley Young, Downing , Bent had no problem with him. The majority of players who have played under him sing his praises. The one's that don't are unsurprisingly the likes of Ireland, Dunne, Collins - terminal losers.

Nobody is saying last season was a success, it was far from that but Houllier plan/priority was to change us into a winning club. For this to happen lots of changes needed to be made. That was his priority not going on a cup run or finishing as high as possible in the league. As I said, short-term pain for long-term gain.

[holtelower]

Ashley Young, Downing , Bent had no problem with him. The majority of players who have played under him sing his praises. The one's that don't are unsurprisingly the likes of Ireland, Dunne, Collins - terminal losers.

Nobody is saying last season was a success, it was far from that but Houllier plan/priority was to change us into a winning club. For this to happen lots of changes needed to be made. That was his priority not going on a cup run or finishing as high as possible in the league. As I said, short-term pain for long-term gain.

What on earth are you talking about ??

He wanted to change us to a winning club ?

WE WERE A WINNING CLUB !!! - the four months previous I'd been to Wembley twice in two months- it was twice in 20 yrs before that !!!!!!

[CI]

He sacrificed the FA Cup in a shameful manner and we STILL LOST the next league game anyway

[steaknchips]

My fear is Fofana would have been filed in the same category as Jean II Makoun

We will see...But for a French under 20 captain, the 1.5m Lyon have just paid for him looks good business.

Wasn't GED'y about to snap him up for about £5m ?

"Midfielder Fofana, 19, was in Birmingham hoping to seal a move from Le Havre worth about £800,000."

[markavfc40]

It doesn't really matter now does it as one is now manager of Aston Villa and the other is doing what he should have started doing 12 months ago - sitting on his arse somewhere in France watching a Jimmy Tarbuck dvd, Cilla Black on cd playing in the background with a Liverpool scarf wrapped round his neck.

We may as well start a thread saying McLeish or Ron Saunders as its about as relevant.

The simple facts are that Houllier was well past his sell by date when he came to us, totally out of touch with Premiership football and boy did it show. McLeish has many faults but with what he has to work with, both in terms of players he inherited and the budget he has to work with in, he will do a better job than Houllier was and would have been capable of doing.

Houllier and **** all to spend, in fact having to bring in twice as much in sales as what he would have been allowed to spend just wouldn't have worked out and we'd have been in deep, deep trouble had he not have been releived of his duties.

The only pity with Houllier is that he didn't have the decency to walk away and thus accept what was plain to everyone else - that he was incapable of managing at any level never mind the Premier League. Instead he walked off with a 5 mill pay off for doing sweet FA. Says it all about the man.