Steven Gerrard

[TRO]

1 hour ago, AntrimBlack said:

You cannot have consistency in a team if you keep changing the players. 

That is not the players, that is the manager.

but its catch 22.....when you are searching for improvement, sometimes set backs are encountered....its not an exact science......

Its hard to keep playing the same players, when the start has been so poor.....They say "he doesn't know his best team".....who does?, the most discerning amongst us, struggle with the individual inconsistencies.

Many teams change players in the name of rotation, so I don't accept that as a legitimate argument, particualrly as certain players, who do show consistency ARE ever present.

The main area of change, comes from the creativity.....trying to find some creativity......The rest of the team is fairly stable.

I think in cases like this, its a combination of Manager and players.....but that is arguably the case of the lower half of the league.

[TRO]

3 hours ago, nick76 said:

You are taking the Coutinho goal? despite the fact City players had stopped especially Stones and then not even taking into account the fact that goals change games and might have woken City up to come back at least.  Anyway it was a draw and that’s the result, a great result at that but one highlight in a poor period.

Anyway yes a great point against City but the other six games we’ve been poor performance wise despite the few minutes here and there you proclaim as being really positive.  It’s easy being the Grim Reaper when the facts show grim circumstances under SG from 7 points in the last 7 games, 16 points in the last 18 games.

It’s incredibly hard to defend SG who then goes on to blame the players and now says we need to be less attractive and be more pragmatic, yet none of us have seen this attractive side and his pragmatic side was seen in the City game but then not in the Southampton game.  I’m not sure SG has a plan.

I recall SG saying to sky, its on me, you must have selective hearing.

Nick, I am not claiming to be happy, with the start or trying to defend it.....I am merely saying its not as bad as you are making out......and I am willing to give SG more time, to improve things.

I am equally not happy, with the summer recruitment, I think it started well and then faded in to a questionable scenario.....we are now slipping back in to questionable quality, albeit that could prove to be another debate after Jacks money.

I want to make this point clear Nick.......I am not defending SG unconditionally, I hope you understand that.....but whilst he is our manager, I want him to do well, I will accept some of his mistakes as part and parcel of the job, and I am not going to pick up on every day to day mistake he makes......Every manager makes mistakes, even the ones some folk want in.

I keep hearing this "Plan" ....I don't believe any professional football manager, or even parks managers, go in to a game without a plan.....it's a fundamental part of the set up.

I see a plan, whether, I agree with it, is another thing?.....or whether it is executed properly is another thing?

I Interpret more "pragmatic", as being harder to play against, something, I have been advocating for some time......and something I think Ron Saunders would approve of, as his teams was hard to play against, too.

I think fwiw this pursuit of creativity, while very noble, has raised more questions than answers of our offensive players.....I think trying to get this ideal balance between defence and offence has eluded us......whether, thats down to the manager, or not having good enough players to execute his wishes, we will continue to debate.

but I will finish, on one final point.....This league is arduous, always has been , but imv is becoming harder physically, and since the officials in their wisdom, have been more lenient on the soft challenge and interpreting  a shove in the back to disrupt play as legal, it's become more difficult for the good creative players to be creative, and only the elite, seem to survive in it.....In short, its becoming harder to create, under these conditions, we have to find a way, to circumnavigate it.....I thought the game the other night epitomised it, 2 teams intent is stopping the other, and not good enough to negate it...when one moment seperated the teams.....both were poor.

I don't know, if SG ultimately, survives and finds some form for us all to relax in to, but I will say one thing, whilst he is Villa Manager, I will support him and refrain from a barrage of criticism.....being miffed with stuff , is one thing, a constant carping from day one, is an entirely different agenda....( not saying YOU have by the way)

 

UTV

 

 

Edited September 21, 2022 by TRO

[nick76]

21 minutes ago, TRO said:

Nick, I am not claiming to be happy, with the start or trying to defend it.....I am merely saying its not as bad as you are making out....

I won’t respond to all of it because we are at different ends of the spectrum but 7 points from 7 games this season, 16 points from the last 18 games suggests it is as bad as I’m making out.  

It’s not as if we are seeing something on the pitch to grab hold onto.  We play better against the best teams and lose, we play poor against the mid teams and lose and we scrape wins against the poorest teams either through them playing badly or just being a poor team.  

That’s as bad as I’m making it out and there is no dressing up that’s enough for the season ahead not to be worried and SG doesn’t seem to be learning.

[DaveAV1]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

recall SG saying to sky, its on me

Oh come on that’s a classic defence, Mia culpa, when there’s almost nothing else to say. SG is a switched on media savvy guy. He’s been in the limelight for over 20 years. I’m always impressed with his interviews pre and post match. That means he knows what to say, like lots of media savvy pundits do. That doesn’t make them good managers. 
 

Gary Neville always talked a good game but wasn’t a very good manager when he tried it. The classic is Alan Shearer who has made a fortune out of punditry but when he swooped in to St James’s Park, to save his beloved N’castle, he was utterly clueless. 
 

Talk is cheap. 

[Villarocker]

I don't think anybody would have watched the football we served up in that Southampton game and claim that we are entertaining or look like a good side. The football was tedious and the game itself was quite boring. I feel that we are serving up football that is as boring as when McLeish was manager. I see no system or how he will change it up to provide more entertaining football. Under our last manager I felt we were an entertaining team, even when Grealish didn't play. But, under Gerrard, I feel bored. 

[ender4]

8 minutes ago, Villarocker said:

I don't think anybody would have watched the football we served up in that Southampton game and claim that we are entertaining or look like a good side. The football was tedious and the game itself was quite boring. I feel that we are serving up football that is as boring as when McLeish was manager. I see no system or how he will change it up to provide more entertaining football. Under our last manager I felt we were an entertaining team, even when Grealish didn't play. But, under Gerrard, I feel bored. 

Much worse than McLeish because we have better players than he had. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Apologies if posted already:

Steven Gerrard

“From a personal point of view I‘ve maybe been guilty of trying to move it forward too quickly.”

“You have an idea in your head of how you want it to look, how you want to play. Maybe it is a slower process, maybe it’s going to take a little more time”

[Zatman]

1 minute ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Apologies if posted already:

Steven Gerrard

“From a personal point of view I‘ve maybe been guilty of trying to move it forward too quickly.”

“You have an idea in your head of how you want it to look, how you want to play. Maybe it is a slower process, maybe it’s going to take a little more time”

Exactly the sort of comments that should make heads roll. He has bluffed his way into a managers job here and has somehow convinced his buddy Purslow we can get top 8/10 

Then he comes out with comments admitting that he is naive

[DaveAV1]

2 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Exactly the sort of comments that should make heads roll. He has bluffed his way into a managers job here and has somehow convinced his buddy Purslow we can get top 8/10 

Then he comes out with comments admitting that he is naive

It’s ok he’s only learning. 

[IrishVilla10]

15 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Apologies if posted already:

Steven Gerrard

“From a personal point of view I‘ve maybe been guilty of trying to move it forward too quickly.”

“You have an idea in your head of how you want it to look, how you want to play. Maybe it is a slower process, maybe it’s going to take a little more time”

He’s only had two transfer windows and 36 games to be fair to him! Give it 4 more games and we’ll really see Steven Gerrards Aston Villa I’m sure of it 

[IrishVilla10]

18th for big chances created, 19th for XG, and now we’re going to be more pragmatic. 

[Sulberto21]

Gerrard talks about a slow process because his way is shit. It’s a complicated set of tactics that needs superheroes to make it work.

I bet if Pochettino came here we’d see his identity on the team within a month if not quicker.

[DCJonah]

9 minutes ago, IrishVilla10 said:

18th for big chances created, 19th for XG, and now we’re going to be more pragmatic. 

This is the thing. How can anyone defend that statement when the facts show we're awful going forward. 

 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

36 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Exactly the sort of comments that should make heads roll. He has bluffed his way into a managers job here and has somehow convinced his buddy Purslow we can get top 8/10 

Then he comes out with comments admitting that he is naive

I legit don't know what to say or how to feel about anything to be honest

" Human " element wants to get it.

My " Pragmatic " ( buzzword ) side says I'm not even sure what it is we are trying to " move forward " in the first place.

I actually understood what we were trying to do more, in the first few games when he came in, but yeah, we admittedly seem to have regressed.

Human side wants him to succeed as it's easier for everyone but I've also got my fears.

Both about us potentially stagnating plus losing good players, as well as potentially missing out on quality Managers.

We can do nothing but wait I guess.

[Indigo]

Good managers can make teams better than the sum of their parts, we see it all of the time and if nothing else you can see a stamp being put on a team quite quickly in terms of identity etc.

It's mad to me and worrying that he's had this long in the job but is coming out with comments like that.

[IrishVilla10]

10 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

This is the thing. How can anyone defend that statement when the facts show we're awful going forward. 

 

There is zero supporting evidence 

[tomsky_11]

4 hours ago, nick76 said:

It’s not as if we are seeing something on the pitch to grab hold onto.  We play better against the best teams and lose, we play poor against the mid teams and lose and we scrape wins against the poorest teams either through them playing badly or just being a poor team. 

Record split between the 21/22 euro qualifiers, the middle and bottom 6 teams.

Agree with the decent performances against big teams not getting the results they perhaps deserve, and getting even 1ppg on average from these games would make a difference to our season. This was part of my optimism for this season, because felt like if level of performance in these games is maintained then the results should be better just because over a longer period the level of performance and result should get closer.

Playing poorly and losing to mid teams doesn't really stand up over Gerrard's tenure to date. Could argue results in these have dropped off, with 5 points from last 5 of these, though not sure that's a big enough drop off or sample size to read too much into it yet. Palace game this season is the only one it feels like we got outplayed in, and even then it took a dodgy penalty after we'd just hit the bar to swing the game properly their way. I'd argue on balance we probably should have had more points from these games, with Brentford, Leicester and perhaps the Wolves game as well being ones we maybe didn't get what we should have given the performance.

Not sure too many of the wins against the lower teams have been scraped either. Maybe Everton last season? We had to defend well but certainly did this and ultimately deserved the win I think. Southampton just gone? Was a horrible scrappy game, but still we were the only team really creating any chances and win probably the fair result. Rest of the wins seem pretty comfortable to me.

[Tom13]

13 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

We can do nothing but wait I guess.

Indeed. This season though it feels like it's a lifetime between every game!

[Keyblade]

1 hour ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Apologies if posted already:

Steven Gerrard

“From a personal point of view I‘ve maybe been guilty of trying to move it forward too quickly.”

“You have an idea in your head of how you want it to look, how you want to play. Maybe it is a slower process, maybe it’s going to take a little more time”

Maybe take your ass to League One and figure this out and leave us out of it big fella?

[KMitch]

58 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Gerrard talks about a slow process because his way is shit. It’s a complicated set of tactics that needs superheroes to make it work.

I bet if Pochettino came here we’d see his identity on the team within a month if not quicker.

It's almost as if Gerrard is watching Liverpool and creating tactics for that team, then trying to shoehorn our squad into that system.  Thinking that if he can get us playing well, it can be an easy transition back to Liverpool in the future.  We aren't playing to anyone's strengths in this system besides our fullbacks and Martinez.