Steven Gerrard

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

If I made any offensive or overly dramatic posts yesterday - Please note that it was Stella with multiple assists, and Jose Cuervo at the backpost.

Edited April 24, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[VillaParkAvenue]

32 minutes ago, TRO said:

Are you having a laugh....Frank has transformed Brentford, from a smallest side in stature, with inconsistent tendencies to a physically equipped team, who are hard to beat....They now have a reputation, of not wanting to play them....that is in contrast to Deans hit and miss easy on the eye version.

Look hard and long at the make-up, the stature and the transformation of the job Thomas Frank has done.....He has a different outlook to Dean Smith, to brand them the same, is folly.....Thomas has a tough/durable team now....Dean did not.

Back to us....

I think the owners see clearly what the issues are, but allow managers the freedom to manage.....SG was brought in to change a team that was finding it easy to lose and 2021 as a calendar year is evidence of that.

So far, he hasn't done that much to change it, but I disagree with you.....it is not essentially his team......The make up of this team is still Deans.......sure what SG does with them, is down to him, but its harsh to completely judge him with the tools he has.

I also disagree with this notion of building a team that is impervious to the style of manager, fliting in and out......you usually change managers, for a reason, and those reasons are usually, not winning enough games, so do you restrict the new man an opportunity to effect his methods to change that....or compel him to stick to the exit managers ways......That's ludicrous to me.

Was Klopp the same as Rodgers?......Was Nuno/Conte  the same as Mourinho?......Man U have tried umpteen styles of manager to not much affect.

You can go through all the Premier league teams, and incoming managers wants to change players to their liking.....sure some have bigger jobs than others, some have easier tweaks than others, some need overhauls....it depends on the balance of the team inherited.

Equally, I can't be certain SG will make it with us.....I think he will and despite me still seeing similar team traits as under Smith....I think if he gets the right players in to make the right changes, he can transform us.

Clear outs or mere tweaks, largely depend on how you bought in the first place.....sure other elements come in like coaching, tactics, game plans etc......but if you have bought the wrong players in the first place, tactics, gameplans, become oh so more difficult to get right.

Lets see what he does in the summer and what types he brings in.....then we will have a better picture, of what we have as a manager.......ME, I still favour him to get it right.

I happen to think Recruitment, is one of the biggest elements to get right, in transforming a football team.....so far he has brought in one permanent first team player.

I agree Frank has made Brentford a better team, he is probably a better manager than Smith.

But the transformation of Brentford we now see came with the addition of the non-physical Eriksen. Before him they looked set for relegation with an average 0.89 points per game. With him starting, they have 2.29 ppg. They started winning right away.

Gerrard was surely hoping Coutinho would have the same effect on Villa, lifting the mood of everyone, which hasn’t really happened (although I think Coutinho has been largely brilliant).

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

18 minutes ago, Tom13 said:

So this week he's said he was frustrated at Rangers' transfer ambitions, it's not all about transfers Stevie, you have to work with what you've got.

He also takes credit for Gio's success, who I believe has already surpassed him in Europe?

 

He's said absolutely nothing wrong, he also said " Ultimately it's on me " . He even explained his thinking in the very same interview if you watched it, he said he wasn't content with just winning something and then resting on laurels, he said he always wants to " push on even further ".

You guys make it seem as if wanting to get players in for a manager, is Alien or outlandish. Doesn't every manager prefer to get their targets in as early as possible?

He never said that was a serious gripe or anything, he was having an open and candid conversation . Jeez

Didn't MON piss off for similar, but much worse?!

The likes of Conte and other managers continually moan about players as well.

With regards to " taking credit for Gios succes " huh? He was intimating that they built a foundation which Gio would appreciate ( Which he did - Proof is in the pudding ). Similarly to how he reiterated that Deano had done some good work before him.

However I have to reiterate, watching the actual video, it's not the way people would want to spin it.

Piss off Tom! Lol

Edited April 24, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Phil Silvers]

15 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

Yeah I have no issues with the timing of Dean leaving, as gutting as it was to lose him and Jack in such a short amount of time.  My issue is with the recruitment process when replacing him.  People on here knew it would be Gerrard the day before Dean was sacked, for example.  There weren't any real rumours of us scouring the whole of Europe looking for the best coach possible to fit the system we have been trying to introduce since NSWE took over.  It just seemed a week of getting closer to the inevitability of Gerrard taking over.  I just don't see why he was such an overwhelming favourite. 

The best thing about him so far has been his name getting the likes of Coutinho and Digne into the club but even that has a limit before footballers actually realise he is just a mid-table manager of a mid-table team at the end of the day, for all his achievements as a player.  I'm worried we won't get the Coutinho deal over the line now.  I have hope that we can still get it done though and if Gerrard and the club can sign him permanently then I'd be a hell of a lot more positive for next season.  If we can't then I struggle to see what kind of calibre player we can get in to replace the players Gerrard has made it clear he doesn't want and who he may end up still having to use.

Gerrard will see that we get Coutihno over the line, he's an outstanding player and will thrive with a better balanced 11 with ALL of them working as one. I do worry though about adaptability and ingame general management, I think Gerrard is after a good lineup with a set gameplan and this just isn't enough. We must be flexible.

[Zatman]

Just now, Phil Silvers said:

Gerrard will see that we get Coutihno over the line, he's an outstanding player and will thrive with a better balanced 11 with ALL of them working as one. I do worry though about adaptability and ingame general management, I think Gerrard is after a good lineup with a set gameplan and this just isn't enough. We must be flexible.

But will he thrive though. Our pressing has collapsed since Gerrard came in and yesterday the opposition owmed the ball. Ollie is one of the best pressers in the league but seems he has been told not to engage

[PaulC]

10 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

I agree Frank has made Brentford a better team, he is probably a better manager than Smith.

But the transformation of Brentford we now see came with the addition of the non-physical Eriksen. Before him they looked set for relegation with an average 0.89 points per game. With him starting, they have 2.29 ppg. They started winning right away.

Gerrard was surely hoping Coutinho would have the same effect on Villa, lifting the mood of everyone, which hasn’t really happened (although I think Coutinho has been largely brilliant).

Yes they were in freefall and then they sign Erikson and they are transformed. For a while it looked like Coutinho was going to do that for Villa but the iceing is no good without the cake. 

[Phil Silvers]

9 minutes ago, Zatman said:

But will he thrive though. Our pressing has collapsed since Gerrard came in and yesterday the opposition owmed the ball. Ollie is one of the best pressers in the league but seems he has been told not to engage

I don't think Ollie has been the same since he became a dad. For whatever reason it just isn't working all round is it, I've no allegiance to Gerrard bit I will give him the summer and hope he really is the real deal. Based upon the squad we have though and seeing what that numbshade shade is getting from a worse squad at Newcastle I have reservations. I can dig it, I didn't want him but he surprised me initially and so he gets the benefit of the doubt from me. If it doesn't turn he will get serious pelters from us lot though and he will never manage plop if he doesn't swing it here.

[WallisFrizz]

1 hour ago, Zatman said:

But will he thrive though. Our pressing has collapsed since Gerrard came in and yesterday the opposition owmed the ball. Ollie is one of the best pressers in the league but seems he has been told not to engage

This says different, at least re Ollie…

 

[sne]

Probably more accurate to say it's collapsed since Coutinho came in?

[TRO]

1 hour ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

I agree Frank has made Brentford a better team, he is probably a better manager than Smith.

But the transformation of Brentford we now see came with the addition of the non-physical Eriksen. Before him they looked set for relegation with an average 0.89 points per game. With him starting, they have 2.29 ppg. They started winning right away.

Gerrard was surely hoping Coutinho would have the same effect on Villa, lifting the mood of everyone, which hasn’t really happened (although I think Coutinho has been largely brilliant).

but with respect....I think you are missing the point.....Eriksen came in to a team, with a resillience,with physicality what they was lacking was guile, granted, its about blend.....On the other hand our team has lacked resillience, being easy to play against....the platform for Coutinho was different and harder to sustain his talent.

I am equally not saying every player in a team has to be a brute, but you have to have a balance.

I am not saying he is a better manager than Smith either....but I am saying he identified weaknesses, and dealt with them, where Dean seemingly did not.

I think Coutinho when he first came in did lift the mood and played some scintillating stuff, but serial defeats drag you down, individual errors drain confidence, losing duels/ challenges saps initiative.

 

 

 

[The Fun Factory]

This season seems to have dragged on interminably, and yet its nearly the end of April and we have played a total of 35 competitive games. Its been so stop start with all of the usual international breaks, the change of head coach, postponed games and free cup weekends. In the championship we would have played about 10 more games by now. We do need to give Gerrard a proper pre season and hopefully that will see some improvements for next year.

[Zatman]

17 minutes ago, WallisFrizz said:

This says different, at least re Ollie…

 

Thats impressive but before yesterday he hasn't seemed to engage as much as he used to 

[mykeyb]

For those who think he is doing a good job. We could well finish behind Brentford. How many of their players would make our starting eleven.

[TRO]

10 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

I think the degree to how poorly you think Gerrard is doing, as I don't think anyone would claim is he is doing well, is how you rated the squad he inherited and how much impact in terms of improvement you think the signings should have made since then and how much Gerrard should have improved what he inherited.

Personally I think he inherited a decent squad. A squad capable of finishing around 10th-13th. One that when he took over was under achieving. Had it not been Smith would not have got the push and a fair chunk of the fan base would not have been clamouring for that to happen.

He has now been here 6 months, had 20 odd games and signed one of the world's most expensive players and currently one the Prem leagues best left backs. In terms of results and performances we are still pretty much where he found us.

I know there are some amongst us who don't particularly rate our squad. For me I think it is a squad with plenty of ability but lacking leadership and enough players with a winning mentality. I think a lot of squads outside the top 7 or 8 lack those real top level players with a winners mentality who can really influence others though. I think ability wise we match up well, and are arguably better on paper, than most sides outside the top 8 or 9. 

Before the Tottenham game I was stood looking at our team sheet and thought crikey we have a real decent side here. Nine full internations starting including a couple for Brazil, three for England, a French international and Argentinian. A bench with three players on that over the last couple of years cost us in excess of 80 million. Arguably the strongest first 11/squad since the days of MON.

I think all things considered, what Gerrard inherited, what he has added, the time he has now had, then I don't think it is unreasonable to have expected him to have done better. Possibly much better.

He has a pretty favourable run of fixtures now to end the season and hopefully we can secure another 3 or 4 wins and finish at the lower end of my expectations when he arrived in around 12th.  It is then a huge summer for him personally and more importantly our club as a whole. He'll no doubt get a small fortune to spend in fees and wages, and I think given he/the owners will now want quick progress I expect much of it to go on more experienced players with little sell on value. If he gets it wrong and we don't start next season well he will find himself under pressure and potentially out of a job and his career path looking very different to when he arrived and we'll almost certainly have a wage bill that doesn't reflect our league position. Let's hope for his sake and ours he gets it right. 

Mark, I think it depends on how you look at the squad....we have some good players, but if too many are the same or similar in terms of attributes, it can be as bad as having bad players.

Its balance, that is whats wrong with our squad and he can't fix that without surgery.

I think Dean was deemed partly responsible for that, and hence is was a consideration along with other things why he went.

No one has a monpoly on whether SG is right or not.....but he deserves a chance to bring in players, who he thinks can re-balance the team.....Dean had over 3 years, SG needs more than a fragmented season.

Our team doesn't look bad on paper, but games are not played on paper, Man Utd Realise that to their fate.

I am not saying SG is blameless, but I am saying the imbalance is making the task all the more tricky to fix.

McGinn ad Luiz, don't work in their roles......yet we are still persevering with them,there,  why.........not much other choice.

Ps I would still like to see the reaction from all quarters, if the board agreed and sacked him, like Watford seem to do.

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by TRO

[tinker]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

Mark, I think it depends on how you look at the squad....we have some good players, but if too many are the same or similar in terms of attributes, it can be as bad as having bad players.

Its balance, that is wrong with our squad and he can't fix that without surgery.

I think Dean was deemed partly responsible for that, and hence is was a consideration along with other things why he went.

No one has a monpoly on whether SG is right or not.....but he deserves a chance to bring in players, who he thinks can re-balance the team.....Dean had over 3 years, SG needs more than a fragmented season.

Our team doesn't look bad on paper, but games are not played on paper, Man Utd Realise that to their fate.

I am not saying SG is blameless, but I am saying the imbalance is making the task all the more tricky to fix.

McGinn ad Luiz, don't work in their roles......yet we are still persevering with them,there,  why.........not much other choice.

 

 

It's all very well blaming Smith for this season's performances.......Smith finished higher with more or less the same squad, bearing in mind we lost Jack but gained Ings , Coutinho , Beundia , Bailey and  Digne. 

There's no argument in my mind , Gerrard has underachieved with this squad. 

Your point on steel in the squad is valid , but we had Tim on yesterday and he should be starting if Gerrard wants that steel, same with Sansom and Nakamba. Coutinho offers no steel , Beundia does. He has options and he's not using them . 

 I hope he can improve on it next season but if it quacks like a duck l.........then it's a duck

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

30 minutes ago, mykeyb said:

For those who think he is doing a good job. We could well finish behind Brentford. How many of their players would make our starting eleven.

We could also finish above Wolves, since we are just throwing non contextual hypotheticals out there...

Edited April 24, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[Zatman]

3 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

We could also finish above Wolves, whilst we are just throwing hypotheticals out there...

What is more likely? 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

Just now, Zatman said:

What is more likely? 

Us leapfrogging Brentford when we play our 2 games in hand. lol

[jacketspuds]

1 minute ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

Us leapfrogging Brentford when we play our 2 games in hand. lol

You do know that we are going to lose our remaining games and probably get relegated to League One?

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

5 minutes ago, jacketspuds said:

You do know that we are going to lose our remaining games and probably get relegated to League One?

Just did a quick check as well.

Our current " poor " ppg of 1.29 since Gerrard has come in X an equal games played of 34 ( Equal to the latest teams used as excuses for meltdown ammunition ) , would have us on 43 points, in 9th, on goal difference.

Inconvenient truths.

The good thing about hypotheticals, is that you can use the same hypotheticals to counter other hypotheticals. lol

Edited April 24, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN