Carney Chukwuemeka

[hippo]

11 hours ago, AV82 said:

Unfortunately for Carney it seems like the current hierarchy prefer their favourites over giving a chance to other players who play well and throw their hat in the ring. He'd be mad to turn down a move to Dortmund at this point.

Was just about to post the same same thing. With Gerrards stated aim of raising the age of the squad, and the nominal game time given to our youngsters its difficult to see Carney signing on for another 3 years (assuming game time is the issue - not £££) 

I was surprised  TIm Iroegbunam signed an extension to be honest

[OutByEaster?]

7 minutes ago, duke313 said:

Couldn't Chukwuemeka play as a 10 then?

Yes as said before, but the problem for him there is that getting into our side as a number ten is really difficult - our record signing is currently starting games from the bench.

To play as a ten he's got to be better than Buendia and Coutinho.

For me, he should be signing a contract, then getting a loan for a season and coming back more developed and able to compete across a number of positions in the midfield.

[The Fun Factory]

NWSE has sunk millions into the youth set up as shown at Bodymoor, and what they are doing at  the urban academy. I think they are very serious in youth development with Purslow repeatably saying Carney is the best player of his age group in the country. Its up to him if he wants to stay with us.

[Woody1000]

11 minutes ago, hippo said:

Was just about to post the same same thing. With Gerrards stated aim of raising the age of the squad, and the nominal game time given to our youngsters its difficult to see Carney signing on for another 3 years (assuming game time is the issue - not £££) 

I was surprised  TIm Iroegbunam signed an extension to be honest

Where has he said this?

[hippo]

29 minutes ago, Woody1000 said:

Where has he said this?

It was after the Jan window. He said we had the youngest squad the prem. It might have been purslow quoting him.

"Also, when I talked about Steven giving his initial feedback, he said, 'Look, I'd like to take the age profile up a little bit. We were the youngest average-age starting team in the league last season. I'd like to have proven winners'."

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-news-purslow-22947333

Edited March 24, 2022 by hippo

[Woody1000]

34 minutes ago, hippo said:

It was after the Jan window. He said we had the youngest squad the prem. It might have been purslow quoting him.

"Also, when I talked about Steven giving his initial feedback, he said, 'Look, I'd like to take the age profile up a little bit. We were the youngest average-age starting team in the league last season. I'd like to have proven winners'."

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-news-purslow-22947333

I’m very surprised by that. I can understand wanting to bring some winners in but there are obvious dangers to just how high you bring the average age.

[VillaParkAvenue]

35 minutes ago, hippo said:

It was after the Jan window. He said we had the youngest squad the prem. It might have been purslow quoting him.

"Also, when I talked about Steven giving his initial feedback, he said, 'Look, I'd like to take the age profile up a little bit. We were the youngest average-age starting team in the league last season. I'd like to have proven winners'."

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/aston-villa-transfer-news-purslow-22947333

But not anymore. Now the squad age is almost exactly the league average. Same with Man City and Liverpool.

[barry'sboots]

28 minutes ago, Woody1000 said:

I’m very surprised by that. I can understand wanting to bring some winners in but there are obvious dangers to just how high you bring the average age.

January's business suggests that was his aim.

I think experience is a good thing if correctly merged with the right blend and ensuring pathways are not blocked.  Indeed pathways can be clearer if you have some ageing players as there is a natural progression/replacement cycle.

We are the 4th youngest squad according to https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/ranking-the-20-premier-league-clubs-by-average-age-of-their-squads/.

West Ham are up at 18th at 28.6 and it is clearly working for them.

Alternatively, Arsenal is the youngest at 24.9 and it is also working for them at the minute.

There is no right or wrong and it is clearly about the quality, whatever age, of the squad members.

[hippo]

46 minutes ago, VillaParkAvenue said:

But not anymore. Now the squad age is almost exactly the league average. Same with Man City and Liverpool.

Yes - and Arsenal have the youngest !!!

I think we are going for the more 'ready made'  players  - pros and cons I suppose - you can't forever have potential - Equally if Carney starts ripping it up at West Ham  or Leicester were going to look a bit daft.

 

 

[VillaParkAvenue]

27 minutes ago, barry'sboots said:

January's business suggests that was his aim.

I think experience is a good thing if correctly merged with the right blend and ensuring pathways are not blocked.  Indeed pathways can be clearer if you have some ageing players as there is a natural progression/replacement cycle.

We are the 4th youngest squad according to https://www.planetfootball.com/quick-reads/ranking-the-20-premier-league-clubs-by-average-age-of-their-squads/.

West Ham are up at 18th at 28.6 and it is clearly working for them.

Alternatively, Arsenal is the youngest at 24.9 and it is also working for them at the minute.

There is no right or wrong and it is clearly about the quality, whatever age, of the squad members.

After January we are 8th youngest.

 

[TRO]

7 hours ago, The_Steve said:

Wow! I didn’t realise either he had that many sub appearances. 
 

Again, I don’t know where this narrative has come from that Gerrard has an issue with youth. From day one he’s basically said that age isn’t a barrier if you’re good enough. People forget he started his managerial career with the Liverpool academy. Sometimes things take time. 

and there lies the essence of it all.

It's important that 18 year olds don't get an inflated view of themselves....we have to win football matches, whilst they are developing....its not academy football.

first team shirts, shouldn't just get handed out like confetti.....they have to be fought for, maybe they should realise that.

There seems to me to be an impatience in Carney's camp, that doesn't sit well with me.....and I don't think its going to end well.

To be Honest, I like to see the young kids come through, JJ has done great......but I have switched off on CC

[YLN]

6 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

Yes as said before, but the problem for him there is that getting into our side as a number ten is really difficult - our record signing is currently starting games from the bench.

To play as a ten he's got to be better than Buendia and Coutinho.

For me, he should be signing a contract, then getting a loan for a season and coming back more developed and able to compete across a number of positions in the midfield.

The scenario you've presented with him signing a contract and then going on loan and returning to us as the finished product sounds like a great deal for us, but what is in it for Carney? Gets some time in a lower league and then comes back to a Villa team where he has absolutely no more guarantees about play time. Compared to not signing a contract, signing for Dortmund, or some other similar club where he'll be likely to not be competing with a £146 million player for minutes, developing there, maybe getting some Champions League experience, and then all going well, when he's developed sufficiently, gets a big move back to the PL. 

If I'm Carney Chukwukmeka, I'm not choosing the OBE loan to Preston option

[TRO]

6 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

For me, if we're playing two eights and a six in a three - then Chukwuemeka can step straight in as an eight. He was one of two eights for England last night with Iroegbunam behind him. 

The problem he has here at the moment is that we play a ten (or two tens) and three sixes - and in my opinion at least, he's not ready for the workload of those sixes at Premier league level yet.

There's a case for saying those twenty minute slots to replace one of the deeper midfielders should be going to Iroegbanum - but even then, we're starting games with Sanson on the bench.

 

While the 3 x sixes are not good enough, he will struggle to get a look in.

you're right, he couldn't manage the workload....but it seems he thinks he can.

[nick76]

From everything I hear and read, we’ve done everything to get Carney to stay, if he doesn’t want to stay then nothing we can do about it. I’m not saying Carney wants to leave just if he does.

He’s getting some game time, he’s been offered a contract, we invest heavily in youth, we even brought his brother in.  If he doesn’t stay, it’s not because we haven’t tried.  He’s certainly not ready to be a regular starter and I doubt he’s going to get more game time at clubs equivalent to us if he leaves.  I’m not sure how it can be seen any other way.

[TRO]

5 minutes ago, YLN said:

The scenario you've presented with him signing a contract and then going on loan and returning to us as the finished product sounds like a great deal for us, but what is in it for Carney? Gets some time in a lower league and then comes back to a Villa team where he has absolutely no more guarantees about play time. Compared to not signing a contract, signing for Dortmund, or some other similar club where he'll be likely to not be competing with a £146 million player for minutes, developing there, maybe getting some Champions League experience, and then all going well, when he's developed sufficiently, gets a big move back to the PL. 

If I'm Carney Chukwukmeka, I'm not choosing the OBE loan to Preston option

but whats in it for all the other poor souls, who are trying to make it as a pro footballer?.....its a tough old business and only the best make it...they should know that, before they go in to it.

I would hazard a guess, SG has a clear memory of when he was the same age as Carney, trying to break in to the liverpool team, a much more challenging task, i would imagine.

I wouldn't be surprised if SG is less than impressed, but has to remain diplomatic.

 

[Nigel]

Cant help but think some of this is purslows doing in bigging him up as much as he did before he broke through. 

Just can't see why he would put that pressure on him, and the set up.

[TRO]

9 minutes ago, nick76 said:

From everything I hear and read, we’ve done everything to get Carney to stay, if he doesn’t want to stay then nothing we can do about it. I’m not saying Carney wants to leave just if he does.

He’s getting some game time, he’s been offered a contract, we invest heavily in youth, we even brought his brother in.  If he doesn’t stay, it’s not because we haven’t tried.  He’s certainly not ready to be a regular starter and I doubt he’s going to get more game time at clubs equivalent to us if he leaves.  I’m not sure how it can be seen any other way.

I would be spending my time as a coach, with those that want to be here.

I'm sorry, but it eventually comes down to that.

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, Nigel said:

Cant help but think some of this is purslows doing in bigging him up as much as he did before he broke through. 

Just can't see why he would put that pressure on him, and the set up.

I think thats unfair....it was encouragement and blimey, do these boys of today soak up encouragement.

I think Purslow, was expressing how important CC was to the club, but it seems to have fell on deaf ears.

looks like he could be going the same way as Kane Taylor, who decided much younger to move to Man City, despite coming from Sutton Coldfield.

[skarroki]

At some point you have to wonder if he's good enough and/or ready. We've turned JJ into a prem league CM who starts most games, if Carney was as good as him he'd be getting in the line up too. The manager picks players who he thinks will win matches and although I'm sure consistency and experience also come into play, you do have to wonder whether he's ready yet.

If they don't think he's ready but someone else does that's just football sometimes. He could be the next Ravel Morrison as much as the next Grealish 

[OutByEaster?]

20 minutes ago, YLN said:

The scenario you've presented with him signing a contract and then going on loan and returning to us as the finished product sounds like a great deal for us, but what is in it for Carney? Gets some time in a lower league and then comes back to a Villa team where he has absolutely no more guarantees about play time. Compared to not signing a contract, signing for Dortmund, or some other similar club where he'll be likely to not be competing with a £146 million player for minutes, developing there, maybe getting some Champions League experience, and then all going well, when he's developed sufficiently, gets a big move back to the PL. 

If I'm Carney Chukwukmeka, I'm not choosing the OBE loan to Preston option

It's a very good question - albeit with a big assumption - not every career always works out that way - I think what would be in it for him is that it's a safer progression - we care about his talent, we've worked with him to get him to here and he'd know what he's getting. Reece Oxford earns a million a year at Ausburg - it doesn't always work out (although Oxford also had a Championship loan).

Dunno, I'd hope that fora couple of reason we're in with a shout - what we've done so far and, let's face it, the money we'd be able to offer him.