Dean Smith

[Guest av1]

2 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Because it makes more sense based on our squads, most of them aren't good on the ball.

 

So the players are crap? And yet you think:

i) Smith has failed if he doesn't finish top 6.

ii) Instead of replacing crap players, we should instead appoint a crap manager to work with them?

Isn't that what put in this position in the first place?

[tomav84]

1 minute ago, villalad21 said:

Because it makes more sense based on our squads, most of them aren't good on the ball.

It would be less of a rebuilding job as it will be with DS as a headcoach. We probably have to ship ou 7-8 players and get replacements in to suit his style, and that's easier said than done.

With Allardyce or Pulis we could keep doing what we were doing, we made it do the play off final last season. The plan was good before and it is good again imo.

No it wasn't! we lost the playoff final because we set up too defensively (akin to pulis or big sam's style) and we're beaten by an attacking minded team.

this club was and is in need of a rebuild

[villalad21]

3 minutes ago, av1 said:

So the players are crap?

No they aren't crap they just aren't suited to this style of football.

[tomav84]

10 minutes ago, av1 said:

I think the vast majority of fans expected that under Smith it would be a case of 1 step back in order to potentially take 2/3 steps forward. I just hope the fanbase has the patience for it, the atmosphere in the Holte when we went behind on Saturday concerned me a little. 

the problem is it's very easy to say 'yeah we just need time, i'm happy to take a step back etc etc' but when saturday comes and you're all excited and hopeful for 3 points, it's difficult to think like that when you find yourselves 2-0 at home to hull....i wasnt there btw but i can imagine what it was like

[Guest av1]

Just now, villalad21 said:

No they aren't crap they just aren't suited to this style of football.

So football players that aren't comfortable with a football at their feet aren't crap?

[villalad21]

4 minutes ago, av1 said:

So football players that aren't comfortable with a football at their feet aren't crap?

There's alot of ways to play and win a football game.

Calling players that reached a play off final as recent as last season crap is a bit harsh

Edited January 22, 2019 by villalad21

[Guest av1]

11 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

 

It would be less of a rebuilding job as it will be with DS as a headcoach. We probably have to ship ou 7-8 players and get replacements in to suit his style, and that's easier said than done.

 

You're missing the point.

There are 6/7 players out of contract in the summer and 2/3 loan players will be returning to their parent clubs, so a huge rebuild is happening in the summer irrelevant of who the manager is. So we have 2 options. 

i) Build another squad full of overpaid has beens under a dinnosuar like Pulis (which is why we are in this position) 

Or

ii) Take a different approach to one that has a track record of failure. 

[AvfcRigo82]

This thread...

[Dave-R]

7 hours ago, villalad21 said:

And yet we managed to get into a play off final as recent as last season, sorry but i don't buy it.

Bruce left us in a defensive mess this season, that should be sorted in the summer. Next season top 6 should be a minimum requirement, i'm not joining this lowering expectation train some fans on here have bought a ticket for. 

I dont think the blame lies all on bruce, sure he didn't being in sufficient cover for our defence. He didn't make our players go out week in week out and lose games, that I'm afraid is on our miserable squad which is a joke.

Bruce has blame for not signing defenders, not for defenders not doing there job.

[Dave-R]

41 minutes ago, av1 said:

You're missing the point.

There are 6/7 players out of contract in the summer and 2/3 loan players will be returning to their parent clubs, so a huge rebuild is happening in the summer irrelevant of who the manager is. So we have 2 options. 

i) Build another squad full of overpaid has beens under a dinnosuar like Pulis (which is why we are in this position) 

Or

ii) Take a different approach to one that has a track record of failure. 

It does sound like there is a light in the sky doesn't it, shame we have to wait till the summer for it to happen.

[sheepyvillian]

15 hours ago, Fowlersrs said:

I've heard rumours of a certain few not sharing Smiths ideologies...

Bolasie being the first name, Kodija, Whelan and Hutton also not playing ball...

Looks like we could see quite a different squad next year...

Viva la Smith revolution 

Why keep picking them then ? If that is their attitude they should be nowhere near the squad. 

[TRO]

13 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said:

Why keep picking them then ? If that is their attitude they should be nowhere near the squad. 

because he hasn't got anyone else.

This is what happens with some players....when you ask them to work and criticise them when they don't.

[sheepyvillian]

12 minutes ago, TRO said:

because he hasn't got anyone else.

This is what happens with some players....when you ask them to work and criticise them when they don't.

Well that answers the question to whose to blame for recent results. The players. 

[TRO]

10 hours ago, Dave-R said:

Love what you said, it is time to be patient for as long as it takes.

We cant rush this no more it's not getting us anywhere and in the end we will be the own architects of our demise if we're not careful.

We're not an attractive club anymore either, sure we have the name, the history, but it all doesn't mean anything to anyone outside this club and it's fans. We have to find a way of becoming relevant again and as much as i hate to say it but we are not the main Midland club anymore. People will say wolves have only been it for 5 mins, I would say yes but the fact is they are it now and we are not and that has to change. Only way to see Aston Villa back on top of the Midlands clubs is to do it how the rest of this championship does it and that's adapt slowly and take a smart approach to football.

Fast plans equal bad results for club, players and fans, the slow, thinking, tactical and chess like moves is what we need now, we need to become a thinking club. FFP has made sure that no one can do a man city anymore, it was all ok making irrational moves back then and bringing in who we want. Even then we were just a feeder club to the club's above us selling talent when we needed them as our players.

All our personal has changed except our players, I would put a bet that next season we will rely on our Youth and new signings and we will only keep those who are young and ha e put in good performances.

I heard someone say Mcginn should be captain, I completely agree with that, John has been a whirlwind around here and he should be placed on a pedestal and used as an example. That I think is what our youngsters need a young player like Grealish or Mcginn who are used as a perfect example of what we need our Youth to be, but in there own way. Jack and John don't half set the bar high for our Young lads and I feel that our Youth could have a great impact for us next season if given the chance.

Not only that but if we use our Youth rather than go out and sign players we should by all accounts bring down our wage bill by a massive amount, we should try and get a season rite and do it the rite way.

I dont think there is a world apart scenario between senior and u23s as what some make out. I think it's a step up yes, but only if played in first team and given the opportunity can we truly know if our younglins are ready for first team football or if they are even good enough for our club.

Next season they either all need to be used or get them out on loan for them to become the players we need them to be, they are sitting around wasting away and that is not good enough for us anymore.

Edit/ wow sorry I didn't realise I'd wrote so much for anyone who reads, thankyou for taking that time to read, hope it wasn't a bore.

No it wasn't a bore Dave all good stuff, much what many are saying.

I think the main issue we have with the youth, is they don't have a strong defence to chaperone them, if that's the right word.....They need a platform to learn the physical side and blend in to a team pattern.

The problem is at the moment their lightweight stature gets highlighted due to the team being lightweight....I watched the Albion last night, nothing special, but they just do the ugly stuff better than us.

Until the team is properly balanced, I don't see our lads having a proper chance to showcase their skills.

I think we have focused too much on talent and not enough on Character....we need a shift in culture.....not saying dump talent....in reality we need both.

We do have character in the team , just not enough.

[bannedfromHandV]

1 hour ago, av1 said:

Have to agree to disagree then mate, I can't think of a collection of players less suited to Tony Pulls. 

I think the vast majority of fans expected that under Smith it would be a case of 1 step back in order to potentially take 2/3 steps forward. I just hope the fanbase has the patience for it, the atmosphere in the Holte when we went behind on Saturday concerned me a little. 

I was in the Holte on Saturday and can confirm it was utter frustration, not toxic as it has been under other Managers (toward the end of their tenures particularly) but just absolute frustration at watching a bunch of good footballers underperforming, again.

For the first time in my life (35 years old) I didn't even celebrate the first goal we scored, I remained seated and barely flinched, such was the level of my own anger and frustration at that point.

I made up for it though in celebrating the equaliser

[LakotaDakota]

15 hours ago, Reivax_Villa said:

I think it is a time to be patient.

I am happy that we are going for this young and hungry approach now.

If we look at the under 23's they play some very good football. I think one of the few factors is because they are coachable, eager to learn and hungry.

We lack that in our squad, our better players are the younger ones.

Who remembers that away victory at Anfield in 2012?

This was the team that took all three points.

 

Imagine going to anfield withthat team now.It would be 10-0 before half time

[TRO]

1 hour ago, sheepyvillian said:

Well that answers the question to whose to blame for recent results. The players. 

Its a tricky one.

I don't think its Dean Smith, put it that way.....If you listen to all the top managers, they all come back to the same conclusion, what ever they do.....they need to have the players to be able to do it.

Top managers only go to other top clubs for one reason, yes money, but to work with the elite.....I can't remember the last Top manager going to a lowly club to test himself..they go to the places where their philosophies are executed.

Managers have to basically get 2 things right.

• Player recruitment/ talent spotting
• Coaching

as the saying goes you can't make a silk purse our of a sows ear.

Dean has inherited another managers players, I will purposely avoid the word mess, because the summer was a car crash and losing Johnstone, Snoddy and Terry was a massive blow to the character of the team and the substance that we built on....the CLUB was then in no position to replace them.

I am not defending Steve Bruce unconditionally,  because I did not like the style of football we played and to be honest, some of his traits are still there, many of our players still stood off and failed to impose themselves, didn't close down often enough.

so yes, I do think its a player problem, in balance and attitude, not all but some and that some may be too many....any team can get away with a couple of iffy players, we have too many to cover...but i also thought that with Steve Bruce in charge, except he bought them.

Tammy, McGinn and Jack when he is playing are the only players you can hang your hat on....for any team with promotion ambitions that's simply not enough.

Mark has mooted in an earlier post, with the names we have in our squad, we should be storming it.....I think he is right, but we are getting out fought, out battled and overrun by players of a lesser quality in terms of talent, but a superior quality in terms of application and will to win.

The signs were there against the Blues....we haven't won at home since.

You can only take the horse to the water, you can't make him drink.

I think Dean needs his own type of player......as a reference : Neil Warnock was lucky when he went in to Cardiff in as much he had the right characters there already ,not great on talent, but effective in this league.... so he could make the difference with his traditional approach, it was a match made in heaven for him.

Dean is not so lucky, he has names, but very short on substance.....He has to build it himself, I hope he gets it right.

 

Edited January 22, 2019 by TRO

[Dave-R]

12 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

I was in the Holte on Saturday and can confirm it was utter frustration, not toxic as it has been under other Managers (toward the end of their tenures particularly) but just absolute frustration at watching a bunch of good footballers underperforming, again.

For the first time in my life (35 years old) I didn't even celebrate the first goal we scored, I remained seated and barely flinched, such was the level of my own anger and frustration at that point.

I made up for it though in celebrating the equaliser

Imagine if only we had of done and scored a third what you would of been like, you would of streaked lol.

[TRO]

39 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

I was in the Holte on Saturday and can confirm it was utter frustration, not toxic as it has been under other Managers (toward the end of their tenures particularly) but just absolute frustration at watching a bunch of good footballers underperforming, again.

For the first time in my life (35 years old) I didn't even celebrate the first goal we scored, I remained seated and barely flinched, such was the level of my own anger and frustration at that point.

I made up for it though in celebrating the equaliser

Ha Ha....I'm 67 and I did the same, such was my disgust at how easily we allow the opposition to score and impose themselves.

However, I fail to see....if a player has all the talent in the world, but fails to apply it....He isn't a good footballer.

All the good footballers at the top clubs APPLY IT....watch Man City and Liverpool, they work like Trojans, never stop probing and grafting

No I think its a myth that has us all jumping from one theory to another....we don't apply the basics anywhere near enough....so for me on that basis they are not as good as we think they are....if they are.....SHOW me.

Workrate, Tenacity, Desire, Application are all ingredients essential to being a GOOD Footballer.

We have rakes of teams above us who have players not as gifted in talent as ours...what an indictment......We pay top wages for what we think they can do and then realise we have been duped.

We need a change of approach.

 

Edited January 22, 2019 by TRO

[Vive_La_Villa]

3 hours ago, villalad21 said:

It's not attacking wise that is a problem this season, because we are top 2 in that department. It's defense that is our issue.

And as i said, last season we didn't fall apart when Terry was out injured, the back 4 remained defensive solid. The likes of Elmo, Chester and Hutton played much better defensively last season. And why? I think it's down to coaching.

Johnstone is a HUGE miss, that's undeniable. Nyland been a disaster and Kalinic haven't impressed. The keeper situation is just dire at the moment, Steer has actually looked better than both of them and we should consider Steer as a 1st option if Kalinic doesn't improve.

Can individuals errors be down to coaching? We can get everyone behind the ball like Bruce did and attempt to scrap our way to promotion but odds on we’d come unstuck against a more attacking team in the final like we did against Fulham.

Lets see if Boro get promoted playing the way you’d like to see us return too.