PompeyVillan Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 19 minutes ago, darrenm said: Yeah. I think that the manifesto was a bit of a big swing. It was obviously what Corbyn and McDonnell have been dreaming about for years. But Corbyn's shown he's not stubborn enough to not take better advice on board shown by his evolution in various ways over the campaign. The manifesto was to get a bit of news, a bit of people talking. Next time round I think everyone will see a bit more of a centrist manifesto with a few left leanings. I don't think they will at all.Corbyn has said more than once that he intends to move the middle ground. I think he's already managed that personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post snowychap Posted June 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2017 (edited) 8 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said: Hard to believe they're supposed to work for us isn't it? Edited June 11, 2017 by snowychap Just to be clear, I nicked that from someone's tweet in the thread of replies. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazzap24 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 3 hours ago, Demitri_C said: I actually dont mind osbourne i think he would make a good leader. But i think he is really enjoying his media role I don't mind Osbourne either, in a Piers Morganesque "I'm a massive word removed and I just don't care" kind of way, but I wouldn't let him lead the conga at the Tory Xmas party, let alone the country. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 What Corbyn achieved vs what almost everyone else expected (except Darren who realised the scale of the shift - kudos for that) was remarkable. That said, against the worst Tory PM ever, pushing the worst manifesto ever, Labour still didn't get within 50 seats of the Conservatives - even when offering the moon on a stick to everyone in sight. May is friendless, advisor less and clueless. She will not last and her party will not repeat the mistakes made under her brief leadership. In other words it's quite likely that this is the high water mark for a Corbyn led Labour Party, but I think they could go further still under someone else. Its also worth noting that over 80% of those who voted supported a party that committed to leaving the single market in their manifestos. The commentariat crowing that 'hard Brexit is dead' are pushing their own agendas, not one informed by the actual vote. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 35 minutes ago, wazzap24 said: I don't mind Osbourne either, in a Piers Morganesque "I'm a massive word removed and I just don't care" kind of way, but I wouldn't let him lead the conga at the Tory Xmas party, let alone the country. But if he was also in charge of the distribution of recreational drugs at their party, and then led the conga. What then? Hmmm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wazzap24 Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 17 minutes ago, peterms said: But if he was also in charge of the distribution of recreational drugs at their party, and then led the conga. What then? Hmmm? Well now in that case, count me in for second in line! Choo choo chooooo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted June 11, 2017 Moderator Share Posted June 11, 2017 14 minutes ago, wazzap24 said: Well now in that case, count me in for second in line! Choo choo chooooo I'm losing track of what's a pun and what isn't at this stage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post markavfc40 Posted June 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2017 42 minutes ago, Awol said: What Corbyn achieved vs what almost everyone else expected (except Darren who realised the scale of the shift - kudos for that) was remarkable. That said, against the worst Tory PM ever, pushing the worst manifesto ever, Labour still didn't get within 50 seats of the Conservatives - even when offering the moon on a stick to everyone in sight. May is friendless, advisor less and clueless. She will not last and her party will not repeat the mistakes made under her brief leadership. In other words it's quite likely that this is the high water mark for a Corbyn led Labour Party, but I think they could go further still under someone else. I am not so sure. Whilst everything you have said about May and the Tory manifesto is true going into the election Corbyn had probably the lowest approval rating of any opposition leader ever and the Labour party were 20 odd points behind in the polls. I think the reason for much of that was that people had formed their opinions based on the constant slating he got from the right wing media. I think once people got to hear what he had to say, or took the time to listen, then they liked what they heard, liked the way he came across. I think there are more gains for Labour under Corbyn. To achieve them he doesn't actually need to do very much other than continue with the positive message he has been preaching. To offer an alternative to the downbeat policies of the Tories. He has really engaged people just by being himself and preaching what he believes in and I think he has really connected with a lot of people and as someone who really doubted him a couple of months ago I include myself in that. To achieve what he/Labour did over the last 7 weeks was quite remarkable given the low base they started from. I think it was even more remarkable as the two terrorist attacks during the campaign should arguably have put him on the back foot. As it turned out his response in relation to those was excellent. For the first time in years Labour have some forward momentum and I think the election result is just the start of their resurgence. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Stevo985 Posted June 11, 2017 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2017 I think there's a huge culture amongst the population of "I'm not going to vote for him/them because he/they won't win" I honestly believe a lot of people vote or voted conservative because they were going to win. As messed up as that is, I'm almost sure that happens. I wouldn't be surprised if merely the fact that Labour made people sit up and say "oh, they are actually capable of upsetting things" caused them to gain a hell of a lot more votes next time around, if next time around is soon. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 11 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: I think there's a huge culture amongst the population of "I'm not going to vote for him/them because he/they won't win" I honestly believe a lot of people vote or voted conservative because they were going to win. As messed up as that is, I'm almost sure that happens. I wouldn't be surprised if merely the fact that Labour made people sit up and say "oh, they are actually capable of upsetting things" caused them to gain a hell of a lot more votes next time around, if next time around is soon. Agreed. And don't underestimate Momentum. They're a seriously slick operation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 18 minutes ago, Awol said: That said, against the worst Tory PM ever, pushing the worst manifesto ever, Labour still didn't get within 50 seats of the Conservatives - even when offering the moon on a stick to everyone in sight. Agree with this. The Tories hold the territory, but both sides must muster again. Look at the Tory reserves stepping forward. They have to get them out the hole she continues to dig. Choosing a winner at this point is shooting from the hip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted June 11, 2017 Share Posted June 11, 2017 3 hours ago, peterms said: But if he was also in charge of the distribution of recreational drugs at their party, and then led the conga. What then? Hmmm? I was going to say and the provision of ladies of dubious morality. But then it's a much more honest profession than being an MP, so didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Is it totally Impossible that Sin Fein will take their seats in parliament? They could really upset the apple cart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 12, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 12, 2017 (edited) It's not impossible but it would require a change of heart to the extent they effectively abandoned a guiding, defining principle of their party. So it is exceedingly unlikely. Edited June 12, 2017 by Chindie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 A small insight into the DUP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderPower_14 Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 10 hours ago, Stevo985 said: I think there's a huge culture amongst the population of "I'm not going to vote for him/them because he/they won't win" I honestly believe a lot of people vote or voted conservative because they were going to win. As messed up as that is, I'm almost sure that happens. I wouldn't be surprised if merely the fact that Labour made people sit up and say "oh, they are actually capable of upsetting things" caused them to gain a hell of a lot more votes next time around, if next time around is soon. Yep. I reckon you'd find if you held the election again a week later Labour would do even better. This is absolutely a real thing that happens. Lots of the "i'll vote informal/won't vote because my vote wont count" types would actually vote properly if they realised how much their vote might actually matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Graham Brady (he of the 1922 Committee) has said that he doesn't see much appetite 'out there' for another general election any time soon. I don't think I saw a great deal of appetite 'out there' for one two months ago, Graham. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Davkaus Posted June 12, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted June 12, 2017 Got to make you laugh, hasn't it. There's only the appetite for it when they think they'll win. Still, what was it, £150,000,000? They can't afford another one of them, there's no magic money tree, @snowychap 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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