KentVillan Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 @T2CSCFCit’s funny reading a fan from another club saying all this. The problem you’ll find is that some Villa fans don’t mind (or notice?) Conor’s obvious shortcomings, because he pops up with enough goals and assists. And to be fair to him, he does score some very nice goals. But I think he’s a pretty limited footballer who’s really hard to accommodate in a team, except in certain situations. The reason managers always play him out of position is that he doesn’t have a natural position. He belongs in a version of football where you can roll on a “specialist” for corners and free kicks, and then bench him as soon as the ball is cleared. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 9 minutes ago, KentVillan said: @T2CSCFCit’s funny reading a fan from another club saying all this. The problem you’ll find is that some Villa fans don’t mind (or notice?) Conor’s obvious shortcomings, because he pops up with enough goals and assists. And to be fair to him, he does score some very nice goals. But I think he’s a pretty limited footballer who’s really hard to accommodate in a team, except in certain situations. The reason managers always play him out of position is that he doesn’t have a natural position. He belongs in a version of football where you can roll on a “specialist” for corners and free kicks, and then bench him as soon as the ball is cleared. @The Fun Factory's moneyball comparison is even more spot on than I initially thought. Unfortunately for Conor if he played baseball or football, he could have been quite good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 15 hours ago, sparrow1988 said: That's Jeff Hendrick. You should see him getting substituted when Ireland are a goal up (doesn't happen often). It takes him a good minute and a half to get off the pitch. One of footballs biggest con artists, people crying on here in the summer that Newcastle made a bargain signing him instead of us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 He got that much stick I deliberately spent a game purposely almost exclusively watching him, and it took a monumental effort as the bloke almost has an invisibility cloak. Whilst he undoubtedly has a quality foot he really is so poor in every other aspect. The amount of times he’d simply stand in a position in a crowd of opposition and make no attempt to show for the ball was unreal, he’d make a good referee with his ability to stand where the play isn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, penguin said: He got that much stick I deliberately spent a game purposely almost exclusively watching him, and it took a monumental effort as the bloke almost has an invisibility cloak. Whilst he undoubtedly has a quality foot he really is so poor in every other aspect. The amount of times he’d simply stand in a position in a crowd of opposition and make no attempt to show for the ball was unreal, he’d make a good referee with his ability to stand where the play isn’t. That quality foot only ever seems to show in the championship though, it certainly didn't show in the premier as he's faces with a much more experienced player and especially keeper.. Conor gave what he could for the club and I never forget the Leeds match where Bamford the cheat put the goal in against us and he went berserk at him, you could see he was so pissed and had heart for the club. I would not have him back here and I'm sure he admitted that Villa has outgrown him because they need much better now. Of course it's always a shame but Conor does deserve to play constant football for a team he can play regular for and the championship is his level. Much like Taylor, Ghazi, Trezegeut, Davis, Elmo and there maybe some other players who are not at the level of the premier who should also be moved on to else where. Edited March 27, 2021 by Dave-R 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 Yep, despite the criticism, I really do like Conor. I see him as an overachiever, who has done well with the gifts he’s been given. Just not athletic or technical enough to play midfield at Premier League level, except against relegation battlers. There will be other clubs who will be willing to accept his lack of contribution in open play for the extra goals and assists. Certainly I think he still has a lot to offer at Championship level, and potentially at lower Prem level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 5 hours ago, Dave-R said: That quality foot only ever seems to show in the championship though, it certainly didn't show in the premier as he's faces with a much more experienced player and especially keeper.. Conor gave what he could for the club and I never forget the Leeds match where Bamford the cheat put the goal in against us and he went berserk at him, you could see he was so pissed and had heart for the club. I would not have him back here and I'm sure he admitted that Villa has outgrown him because they need much better now. Of course it's always a shame but Conor does deserve to play constant football for a team he can play regular for and the championship is his level. Much like Taylor, Ghazi, Trezegeut, Davis, Elmo and there maybe some other players who are not at the level of the premier who should also be moved on to else where. He has 10 goal contributions in 31 Premier League games so it works in the Premier League as well its just his all around game isnt the best 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 17 minutes ago, Zatman said: He has 10 goal contributions in 31 Premier League games so it works in the Premier League as well its just his all around game isnt the best Was those 10 goal contributions last season or this season or was that with another team before he came to us?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 4 minutes ago, Dave-R said: Was those 10 goal contributions last season or this season or was that with another team before he came to us?? 8 last season and 2 this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 11 hours ago, T2CSCFC said: It may not have translated into points yet then if those figures are correct, but I'm guessing you've seen the stat on how many goals we'd conceded with and without him. That's a noticeable increase. And you also have to remember the luck we've had in recent games. 2 last kick penalties and I mean last kick - 95.50 and 93.50 on the clock respectively - both kinda questionable and the one against Boro, in that game we were diabolical. We've lost 4 games in that 13 game run as well We'd lost 4 before Hourihane in 24 games. But I can't believe I'd have to even explain to you guys what he's like, you've seen enough of him. You must know the boy can't run or tackle. That was as clear as day the first game he played in the Cup for us. But then he pinged one in from the touchline against Brentford, another outside-the-area against the league leaders and then, all of a sudden, you think, well maybe we've got to compensate somehow for him... But as the games have passed and as our midfield has become more and more non existent then it's time to call a spade a spade. The boy will always get goals and assists I would guess. There's no sane man on the planet that doesn't marvel at his dead balls and his shooting - that's real quality. But the lack of energy, speed, desire, grit, steel and touch isn't there. And it's only so long you can blag getting the points on the board with the way we've been playing. We haven't been a great watch all season and be very aware of all the plaudits Cooper is getting, he's ruined our football and it's all been about Jose Mourinho pragmatism. The fan base has put up with Cooper because we've been getting results but Cooper is another one that divides opinion. But I just can't quite get my head around how Hourihane does. But one thing I will guarantee you, forget any dreams of him in the Premier League. I'd be betting every team that plays you if you start him again. For what it's worth on Barkley - he ruined us so many times when we were up, he's a quality player and whilst I haven't seen that much of Villa or him recently, in the early part of the season I thought him and Grealish looked like they were enjoying themselves and enjoyed playing together. I thought it was a good move for Barkley. Him, McGinn, Grealish, Watkins made the Villa a good watch on tv. All the best for the remaining part of the season. Thanks for that - basically echoes what I've been saying for a couple of years. I truly have no idea how some of our fans' minds work if they think that he's the answer to any of our problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barry'sboots Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Zatman said: He has 10 goal contributions in 31 Premier League games so it works in the Premier League as well its just his all around game isnt the best He is a goal threat and I think could do a job at "10" - certainly be more impactful than Barkley at the minute - if he had legs around him and a striker to play off. I remember watching him against Norwich at VP a few seasons back when he got a hat trick at "10" playing off KD. He just doesn't have the legs, energy or dynamism to play in a more disciplined role i.e. "6" or "8". That doesn't mean I want him to be at VP next season but I think a championship side or bottom 6 PL side could get value out of him but only if used in a way that suited his skill set. Edited March 27, 2021 by barry'sboots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 14 hours ago, T2CSCFC said: It may not have translated into points yet then if those figures are correct, but I'm guessing you've seen the stat on how many goals we'd conceded with and without him. That's a noticeable increase. And you also have to remember the luck we've had in recent games. 2 last kick penalties and I mean last kick - 95.50 and 93.50 on the clock respectively - both kinda questionable and the one against Boro, in that game we were diabolical. We've lost 4 games in that 13 game run as well We'd lost 4 before Hourihane in 24 games. But I can't believe I'd have to even explain to you guys what he's like, you've seen enough of him. You must know the boy can't run or tackle. That was as clear as day the first game he played in the Cup for us. But then he pinged one in from the touchline against Brentford, another outside-the-area against the league leaders and then, all of a sudden, you think, well maybe we've got to compensate somehow for him... But as the games have passed and as our midfield has become more and more non existent then it's time to call a spade a spade. The boy will always get goals and assists I would guess. There's no sane man on the planet that doesn't marvel at his dead balls and his shooting - that's real quality. But the lack of energy, speed, desire, grit, steel and touch isn't there. And it's only so long you can blag getting the points on the board with the way we've been playing. We haven't been a great watch all season and be very aware of all the plaudits Cooper is getting, he's ruined our football and it's all been about Jose Mourinho pragmatism. The fan base has put up with Cooper because we've been getting results but Cooper is another one that divides opinion. But I just can't quite get my head around how Hourihane does. But one thing I will guarantee you, forget any dreams of him in the Premier League. I'd be betting every team that plays you if you start him again. For what it's worth on Barkley - he ruined us so many times when we were up, he's a quality player and whilst I haven't seen that much of Villa or him recently, in the early part of the season I thought him and Grealish looked like they were enjoying themselves and enjoyed playing together. I thought it was a good move for Barkley. Him, McGinn, Grealish, Watkins made the Villa a good watch on tv. All the best for the remaining part of the season. I think you are right in your assessment of Conor.....some fans do get their heads turned by goals and players that score them, that is not a criticism, but the 90 odd minutes, is harder to appraise or appreciate.....Goals are the holy grail, but they do amount to moments in a game....I the Prem you need to be at it, to survive.....action, intensity, industry, aggression, initiative....is key.....Conor can have some great moments, but lacks the industry to compete. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 On 27/03/2021 at 11:30, barry'sboots said: He is a goal threat and I think could do a job at "10" - certainly be more impactful than Barkley at the minute - if he had legs around him and a striker to play off. I remember watching him against Norwich at VP a few seasons back when he got a hat trick at "10" playing off KD. He just doesn't have the legs, energy or dynamism to play in a more disciplined role i.e. "6" or "8". That doesn't mean I want him to be at VP next season but I think a championship side or bottom 6 PL side could get value out of him but only if used in a way that suited his skill set. No chance, he can’t beat a man and panics when under pressure. Aside from a useful long range shot he has none of the attributes required for a number 10, in my view. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferguson1 Posted April 2, 2021 Share Posted April 2, 2021 Please score a hat-trick this evening! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 2, 2021 Share Posted April 2, 2021 25 minutes ago, ferguson1 said: Please score a hat-trick this evening! Injured apparently 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferguson1 Posted April 2, 2021 Share Posted April 2, 2021 11 minutes ago, Zatman said: Injured apparently Ahh gutted, hadn’t realised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted April 2, 2021 Share Posted April 2, 2021 On 27/03/2021 at 13:12, TRO said: I think you are right in your assessment of Conor.....some fans do get their heads turned by goals and players that score them, that is not a criticism, but the 90 odd minutes, is harder to appraise or appreciate.....Goals are the holy grail, but they do amount to moments in a game....I the Prem you need to be at it, to survive.....action, intensity, industry, aggression, initiative....is key.....Conor can have some great moments, but lacks the industry to compete. Exactly, he doesn't have the premier player in him although he would see it differently and would give it a good try and making his doubters wrong. We are transitioning from a lower end prem team/mid table team into a team trying to gain Europe or even title chasing. The likes of Conor, Ghazi, Trezegeut, Engels, Hause, Nakamba, Taylor, Davis, Elmo and maybe more won't be any good for where were trying to be. Somehow we have to off load those players and of course offloading them will have to be at a loss and these players ability wise are holding the club back. It's nothing personal it's just business and sometimes the world has to move on and leave a certain player who is ready and capable at a lower standard in the league or a league below behind. Goals seem to attract more eyes and do wish it would stop but it wont, same as assists but the build up and play seems to always be forgotten by the majority. There are a few stats that should be in football that surprisingly have not been added but they should be. Conor is much like other players of ours from the above list I mentioned where they put the odd performances in at prem level yet nothing else is contributed for the rest of the season. We can't be having this type of player at the club any longer and we must move in from that type of player. Just because a player leaves us then all of a sudden goes starts some crazy run at another club doesn't mean we should go take them back. If we did bring Conor back then in a couple of games we would be wishing we never did make the move to bring him back. Conor is a very good championship player but he's not really anything more. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted April 2, 2021 Share Posted April 2, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Dave-R said: Exactly, he doesn't have the premier player in him although he would see it differently and would give it a good try and making his doubters wrong. We are transitioning from a lower end prem team/mid table team into a team trying to gain Europe or even title chasing. The likes of Conor, Ghazi, Trezegeut, Engels, Hause, Nakamba, Taylor, Davis, Elmo and maybe more won't be any good for where were trying to be. Somehow we have to off load those players and of course offloading them will have to be at a loss and these players ability wise are holding the club back. It's nothing personal it's just business and sometimes the world has to move on and leave a certain player who is ready and capable at a lower standard in the league or a league below behind. Goals seem to attract more eyes and do wish it would stop but it wont, same as assists but the build up and play seems to always be forgotten by the majority. There are a few stats that should be in football that surprisingly have not been added but they should be. Conor is much like other players of ours from the above list I mentioned where they put the odd performances in at prem level yet nothing else is contributed for the rest of the season. We can't be having this type of player at the club any longer and we must move in from that type of player. Just because a player leaves us then all of a sudden goes starts some crazy run at another club doesn't mean we should go take them back. If we did bring Conor back then in a couple of games we would be wishing we never did make the move to bring him back. Conor is a very good championship player but he's not really anything more. I think it depends on the spectator Dave.....There are different levels of them too. Conor does not seem to be pleasing all Swansea Fans, probably based on some of your comments. Edited April 2, 2021 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2CSCFC Posted April 2, 2021 Full Member Share Posted April 2, 2021 6 hours ago, Zatman said: Injured apparently Hopefully... But would be nice to do Brum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2CSCFC Posted April 2, 2021 Full Member Share Posted April 2, 2021 5 hours ago, Dave-R said: . Conor is a very good championship player but he's not really anything more. Debatable even in the Championship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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