AvfcRigo82 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Just now, Dave J said: Absolutely well said - and as a mark of respect I am bowing out of this conversation for today. Thank you. 150% This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjmooney Posted February 6, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted February 6, 2018 I'm going to repeat what I said a few pages back. It's. Not. Going. To. Happen. This is nothing to do with what I think about Steve Bruce, or what I would or would not like. We can play 'But what if we did?' till we're blue in the face, but it's like arguing about what the world would he like if Germany had won the war. Or asking whether it would affect people's attitudes to Brexit if Britain were invaded by Luxembourg. If you enjoy that sort of thing, go ahead, but I'd rather talk about realistic scenarios relevant to the thread topic. Here are a few: 1. What if we fail to get promoted? Should Tony then sack SB, or give him another chance? 2. What if we get promoted, but find ourselves mired in the relegation zone at Christmas? Sack, or not? 3. What if we get promoted, and find ourselves safe from the drop, but playing dull, defensive Bruceball? Sack or not? Asking the question "Should we sack Bruce as soon as we are promoted?" may produce a few 'yes' and 'no' responses, but they will be irrelevant to Tony Xia, because he won't do it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 2 minutes ago, mjmooney said: I'm going to repeat what I said a few pages back. It's. Not. Going. To. Happen. This is nothing to do with what I think about Steve Bruce, or what I would or would not like. We can play 'But what if we did?' till we're blue in the face, but it's like arguing about what the world would he like if Germany had won the war. Or asking whether it would affect people's attitudes to Brexit if Britain were invaded by Luxembourg. If you enjoy that sort of thing, go ahead, but I'd rather talk about realistic scenarios relevant to the thread topic. Here are a few: 1. What if we fail to get promoted? Should Tony then sack SB, or give him another chance? 2. What if we get promoted, but find ourselves mired in the relegation zone at Christmas? Sack, or not? 3. What if we get promoted, and find ourselves safe from the drop, but playing dull, defensive Bruceball? Sack or not? Asking the question "Should we sack Bruce as soon as we are promoted?" may produce a few 'yes' and 'no' responses, but they will be irrelevant to Tony Xia, because he won't do it. Maybe not the day to discuss it . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Eastie Posted February 6, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted February 6, 2018 RIP Joe Bruce -our thoughts and sympathies go out to Steve and his family 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 41 minutes ago, VILLAMARV said: We're all getting ahead of ourselves, there's 16 games left. But it's gotta be said after the last 10 years of steady decline it's nice to be able to be a bit more positive about the future. Like most things in life I tend to agree with points on both sides of the argument. Steve Bruce is not necessarily the man I'd pick to get anyone back into the top 10 of the Premier League for instance. Steve Bruce teams over the years have been workmanlike rather than particularly flamboyant. Steve Bruce has got teams relegated. All arguments against him that I can get on board with. However, those things have literally nothing to do with us as a club right now and certainly didn't a year ago. Apart from the second point. To me and others watching us not even being workmanlike, not being competitive even in the championship was something that seriously needed addressing. It has divided us on VT in as much as some people have been very unhappy seeing an expensively assembled squad effectively grinding out an odd goal win or a hard fought draw on the occasions that we might not lose. We got a new manager bounce off him when he arrived. Some choose to blame Bruce for the drop off last season, some cut him some slack in the amount of players turned over in his first window and the fact that they didn't have time to bed in. We were absolutely aiming for the playoffs around christmas, by the end of Feb we were pretty much out of it. Then the Pre-season and we do the turnover again and 7 games in the knives were drawn and rightly so at that point. Not that a few of us didnt want to give him a bit more time and see how it panned out or that some of us didnt feel we should or even could financially afford to let him go, but without a doubt anyone thinking the start was ok and everything was hunkydory is insane. And yet, whilst undeniably bad it wasn't the end of the world, what it did was ramp up the pressure and we are surely all glad now of the response we got. The away win at Barnsley will be seen as the turning point. I seem to remember Bruce celebrating the narrow win over Forest quite a bit. But with 6 points after 7 games damn right people were losing their patience with him. I suspect his employers would be getting a bit twitchy at that point. But like it or loathe it Steve Bruce has turned the fortunes of this club around and whether or not we get second he deserves the credit for it. He's not the messiah, but then he's hardly a very naughty boy either. Personally, I think the idea that we could go straight back up last year was fanciful. This year I didnt see us as top 2 material but thought we'd be a shoe in for the play offs. But then I never saw Wolves coming so what do I know? I'm pretty happy right now. Good post Marv.....very much where I am. just to add.....I don't think things were ready when we started the season, despite most of us thinking we should have been.....but what we thought and what is reality is different. just need to keep winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 4 minutes ago, Eastie said: RIP Joe Bruce -our thoughts and sympathies go out to Steve and his family Very sad for the Guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted February 6, 2018 Author Share Posted February 6, 2018 32 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said: 150% This. Same with me guys the debate can continue on another day. This is truly a sad day for the Bruce family and football can take a back seat for the next few days regarding Bruce. I send my sincere condolences to the Bruce family at this terrible time. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted February 6, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted February 6, 2018 (edited) Thoughts are with Steve Bruce, his family and friends. Edited February 6, 2018 by Shropshire Lad 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 11 minutes ago, mjmooney said: I'm going to repeat what I said a few pages back. It's. Not. Going. To. Happen. This is nothing to do with what I think about Steve Bruce, or what I would or would not like. We can play 'But what if we did?' till we're blue in the face, but it's like arguing about what the world would he like if Germany had won the war. Or asking whether it would affect people's attitudes to Brexit if Britain were invaded by Luxembourg. If you enjoy that sort of thing, go ahead, but I'd rather talk about realistic scenarios relevant to the thread topic. Here are a few: 1. What if we fail to get promoted? Should Tony then sack SB, or give him another chance? 2. What if we get promoted, but find ourselves mired in the relegation zone at Christmas? Sack, or not? 3. What if we get promoted, and find ourselves safe from the drop, but playing dull, defensive Bruceball? Sack or not? Asking the question "Should we sack Bruce as soon as we are promoted?" may produce a few 'yes' and 'no' responses, but they will be irrelevant to Tony Xia, because he won't do it. I can't think of a time in our History, where we even contemplated sacking a manager who had a 47% win ratio with us and we had just won 6 games on the bounce and the team sitting 4th in the league. Lets just see where he can take us and make suggestions about his future, when the concerns are relevant. In the meantime, we would all do well to commiserate with our manager over his recent sad loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Much sympathy to Steve and his family for their sad loss and other troubles with illness. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedClaretAndBlue Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Football of course takes a backseat at a horrible time like this for SB, but lets hope the boys do him proud on Sunday and can at least take his mind to a better place if only for a couple of hours. Whether he's actually present at VP or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 2 hours ago, Demitri_C said: There is a difference from wanting Bruce out when there is very poor form to wanting him out no matter as you allude to most of the season Rigo! You have wanted him gone all season despite him turning it around. I prefer to eat humble pie and Bruce proves me wrong but in your case you want him gone whether he takes us out or not! Dont compare RDM to Bruce. RDM was utter shit with the same mistakes over and over again. No progression and he won one game in 11 (also humiliated us against luton) bruce has had some poor results but difference with him he is a fighter and bounces back. potentially 7 wins on the trot if we beat the blosers not even MON achieved that with a quality squad. As for JT for me Chelsea are missing his influence, look at them on the pitch now they dont have many leaders around. I think he adds so much to us other than the defensive side. Would you not say Bruce is a steady the ship manager? I certainly think that is what he is. But the reality is we wont be breaking the top 6 any time soon, if we can become a stable top 10 club in premier league until the laws make it fairer and less protection for the sky 6 then we wont be breaking through any time soon. My phone won't let me bold the bit about JT but watching Chelsea last night it was exactly my thoughts, how badly they seemed to be missing leadership. I'll bet that with hindsight, they would have offered him an extension if only to have his presence within the squad (and not necessarily on the pitch). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carewjust4u Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 I hope the team rallies around Bruce this weekend and give the gaffer a proper performance, saddened by the news. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 (edited) I doubt it'll get to him, but my thoughts are with Steve and his family. If that means taking a back seat for a while so be it. Family comes first, football comes second. Edited February 6, 2018 by PompeyVillan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 3 hours ago, Dave J said: I'm not really so sure this represents an endorsement of Bruce's managerial ability tbh with you - didn't McLeish take Blues to their highest ever finish and likewise Peter Reid at Sunderland? I will happily stand corrected on this mind - but would you take either of these men ? Actually this all started as a defence against your assertion that he did a bad job at these clubs. It wasn't intended to be a 'look at how good a manager he is' thread, more a defence against him being a shit one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 2 hours ago, Eastie said: Maybe not the day to discuss it . Why? I don't think Steve has the time or the inclination to read this thread right now. If/when he does, my thoughts go out to him and his family. Having lost my father myself within the recent past I feel his pain. I only hope football can offer a welcome distraction to the grieving process, as it did for me. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMelvillan Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 In a way I hope he isnt present on Sunday, and cant imagine he will be. A local derby game complete with vocal, filthy away fans wouldn't be the nicest place to be if in a fragile emotional state 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 He will be there on Sunday I'm sure of it, what else is he going to do? He lives and breathes football and has done so all his life. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 18 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Why? I don't think Steve has the time or the inclination to read this thread right now. If/when he does, my thoughts go out to him and his family. Having lost my father myself within the recent past I feel his pain. I only hope football can offer a welcome distraction to the grieving process, as it did for me. Probably out of respect , the guy has just lost his father so I feel it’s in poor taste if people are talking about whether he should or shouldn’t be here next year - just a personal opinion and not a pop at anyone . 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 (edited) 31 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: He will be there on Sunday I'm sure of it, what else is he going to do? He lives and breathes football and has done so all his life. Spend time with his mother in hospital or mourn the loss of his father ? Family at this time is far more important than football and I’d quite understand should he hand over the reigns to calderwood for a few days . should he decide to attend the game then I’m sure fans would be supportive of him and that hopefully includes blues fans too . Edited February 6, 2018 by Eastie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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