Steve Bruce

[vreitti]

15 hours ago, TRO said:

Anyone watching sky and listening to Jamie carragher, Nial Quinn and Gary Neville after the Leicester v Man U game.....talk about Leicester....could easily draw parallels with Aston Villa.

It was very interesting and some soul searching going on Niall Quinn saying how important it is for the owner to back the manager to avoid division in the dressing room.

The Managers job can be a lonely place when you are losing.

its all very well folks quoting tactics and plans......but if players don't do their jobs ,all the plans in the world count for nothing.

if a boxer gets slammed up the ropes and then comes off and struggles to throw a punch, chances are it wasn't, part of the fight plan.

Steve Bruce, needs a United front......and the players will respond.

doubt is a dangerous thing and undoes everything in terms of confidence.

Watched the Leicester game myself, and have to agree, the similarities in 'performance' are there. The bigger question for me is how on earth could Bruce already have lost the dressing room, it's that's the case? 

I really can't begin to express my surprise at how things have turned out. I didn't think much of Bruce, and still don't. He's a relic of a manager, tactically clueless, and won't ever grasp the modern game. Having said that, his team usually are united, play with heart, and are tough to beat. This was the least I was expecting, but we are none of those things, and there really hasn't been the slightest of improvement. 

[Demitri_C]

33 minutes ago, sheepyvillian said:

Could turn out to be as bad as an appointment as Mcleish ,or even worse . We need a manager who is going to bring success to this club .

Look at Rafa, he's coasting in this league , why ? Because he's a top manager , and that is what this club deserves . All this talk of a short term fix is crazy 

I think it's still too early to writem off bruce yet. 90% of the problem is the away form. He has continued to make it hard to win at villa park. Out of the next 5 games 4 are at home. 

This run will show what bruce is made of. I am still pissed off about last two games especially forest as tactics were terrible. But the clubs a mess and I do think Bruce's experience will be vital from here until end of the season.

If we are still as shit as this come end of season then questions will be asked then Xia has a decision to make. It' would be idiotic to sack him at this stage. Villa fans need to get out of this habit of demanding mangers to be sacked when they hit a 5 game bad patch.

 

[turvontour]

11 hours ago, KSV said:

This is why im not a big fan of Bruce anymore. I do like him.. as a person like most our managers in the last few years but tactically they have been naive. I thought Bruce would be better. 

He said he needs to find the right formation for the players. Surely this should have been done by now. He has been there for FOUR months..  he has seen what he has and what he wants to get rid of. Surely he knew what formation/system we would deploy with what we have.. and THEN go and sign players to fit the system. Yet it appears we just signed the best players from the Championship and the first game he just played most of them without a suitable system and we got tonked 3-0. RDM did this as well with a overload on the strikers.

PICK A SYSTEM.. and then buy your players to work in a system or two. Just astounds me that he admitted it in public that we just need to find the right system AFTER he went and brought in 7-8 players. Now it still may work for him if we give him a pre season to work with what we have and buy a few new players ( a goalkeeper or two please) and a centreback will be high on the priority list. However, this should have already been implemented. 

Since this season is a write off.. we may as well try a few systems and see what works.. give some kids a go.. once we are mathematically safe that is. 

Agree with all of this except for the last sentence. Its absolutely critical that we end this season on a high - there’s a huge difference between finishing 9^th and 17^th for me, if for no other reason than that it would mean that we win a fair few of our remaining games. Also, I don’t believe that we’re suddenly going to go from a 30% win rate to a 60% win rate just because we have a collective pre-season and add some more players (I know you’re not saying this here, but I’ve read similar sentiment), I think it’s far too big a leap to expect from the rut we’re in now.

 

I mean Christ, it’s the start of February and we already know that we won’t be beating Preston, Brentford, Wolves, Leeds and Forest this season! Read those names again, all clubs that we should at least be going toe to toe with at this level. 10 games – and what 4 or 5 points, you’d be looking at it at the start of the season and saying 15-18 points minimum from those. it’s absolutely appalling.

 

Psychologically, we want to be playing these teams next season knowing that we gave them a game (ideally a hammering) the previous year. Otherwise, we start getting into the routine that we used to against Man U and Arsenal where a win felt like a miracle. I can just see it now, "that’s a good point at Brentford, last season we got thumped there remember." Players associate matches with past performances, I’m sure of it. Perhaps a contributing factor as to why we were so strong at places like Sunderland and to a lesser degree at Anfield, I don’t know.

 

If we just treat the rest of the season as an experiment, and give the kids a go, I feel that it would have the potential to dent the current morale in the camp further.

[VILLAMARV]

 

[TRO]

23 minutes ago, vreitti said:

Watched the Leicester game myself, and have to agree, the similarities in 'performance' are there. The bigger question for me is how on earth could Bruce already have lost the dressing room, it's that's the case? 

I really can't begin to express my surprise at how things have turned out. I didn't think much of Bruce, and still don't. He's a relic of a manager, tactically clueless, and won't ever grasp the modern game. Having said that, his team usually are united, play with heart, and are tough to beat. This was the least I was expecting, but we are none of those things, and there really hasn't been the slightest of improvement. 

I don't think he has lost the dressing room.....I think there were "clicks" when he arrived.....I think it is more like he is trying to gain it, from the poisonous atmosphere that existed.

That is why in some of my posts I have said this team is not reflective of Steve Bruce teams.

Having so many changes, it more like he has to gel them, they were already disjointed for the last few years.

not defending him but RDM had the same problem.

I think many of us have underestimated how long this takes to galvanise.

[Stevo985]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

 Playing a midfielder up top is more annoying than a recognised striker!! 

Yes. I know.

I've already agreed with this.

it would be even more annoying if we played a one legged, blind, toddler up front. But it still wouldn't change the fact that we were playing someone up front  

[TRO]

It seems to me that we are all just having our moment in the sun......There anti/doubting  Bruce posters are currently in the pound seats.

Its almost sounding like Brexit.....Some fans need to get over it ( not their choice) Steve Bruce is our manager.

We win one and all the posts supporting Steve Bruce have an air of eloquence and feasible rhetoric.....The support is heart warming

We lose one/few  and the gallows comes out with feasible arguments that he is wrong man for the job, you can build a case against any manager when he is losing.

We have no idea, what is going on at Bodymoor Heath and if we did, we may have a different view.

I do not subscribe to this theory that Steve Bruce is a tactical Dinosaur, blimey a few months ago someone wrote on here how he got his tactics spot on.....but we won, that made it all right......has Eddie Howe suddenly become a tactical Dinosaur, has it affected Claudio too, has he suddenly become clueless.

They are comments coming from fans who are clearly upset in what they are seeing and do you know what.....and I am totally on their side on that.....but I do not see any mileage keep bashing the manager of the day at every setback.

None of us really know how all this is going to turn out, we just have to wait and see until such time is reasonable to see where we are.

Ps The time for supporting anyone is when they are down......The results will do the job when they are up.

PPS It is oh so very easy to rate a manager when he is winning and doubt one when he is losing.....How many clubs did Ron Saunders not do it at?

how difficult did Van Gaal find it.....Pep has had difficulties is he worse than the last manager.....folk are now doubting Wenger.

We need stability, like we have never needed it in our History.

Edited February 6, 2017 by TRO

[sheepyvillian]

37 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

I think it's still too early to writem off bruce yet. 90% of the problem is the away form. He has continued to make it hard to win at villa park. Out of the next 5 games 4 are at home. 

This run will show what bruce is made of. I am still pissed off about last two games especially forest as tactics were terrible. But the clubs a mess and I do think Bruce's experience will be vital from here until end of the season.

If we are still as shit as this come end of season then questions will be asked then Xia has a decision to make. It' would be idiotic to sack him at this stage. Villa fans need to get out of this habit of demanding mangers to be sacked when they hit a 5 game bad patch.

 

In my opinion he shouldn't have been appointed in the first place ,just like when he was at Sunderland he seems out of his depth .

[dont_do_it_doug.]

Has to stick with the 3-5-2 now, swapping Taylor out for Birkir and hopefully bringing Jedi back into the side. 

Anything else would be farcical. 

[dont_do_it_doug.]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

 Playing a midfielder up top is more annoying than a recognised striker!! 

Not sure why its annoying you that's a bit bizarre.I don't think people are making it up at all as witnessed the actual striker Adomah was not playing where he was supposingly instructed to.

He was dropping deep like a midfielder hence why it looked like a 5-4-0

Well we switched to a back 4 obviously still looking to nick a win. Which under the circumstances was actually the right thing to do.

Normally I'd say go for the draw, but that was no good to us. I've no real issue with the subs he actually made, only that Grealish shouldn't have been on the pitch at all by that point. 

[vreitti]

40 minutes ago, TRO said:

It seems to me that we are all just having our moment in the sun......There anti/doubting  Bruce posters are currently in the pound seats.

Its almost sounding like Brexit.....Some fans need to get over it ( not their choice) Steve Bruce is our manager.

We win one and all the posts supporting Steve Bruce have an air of eloquence and feasible rhetoric.....The support is heart warming

We lose one/few  and the gallows comes out with feasible arguments that he is wrong man for the job, you can build a case against any manager when he is losing.

We have no idea, what is going on at Bodymoor Heath and if we did, we may have a different view.

I do not subscribe to this theory that Steve Bruce is a tactical Dinosaur, blimey a few months ago someone wrote on here how he got his tactics spot on.....but we won, that made it all right......has Eddie Howe suddenly become a tactical Dinosaur, has it affected Claudio too, has he suddenly become clueless.

They are comments coming from fans who are clearly upset in what they are seeing and do you know what.....and I am totally on their side on that.....but I do not see any mileage keep bashing the manager of the day at every setback.

None of us really know how all this is going to turn out, we just have to wait and see until such time is reasonable to see where we are.

Ps The time for supporting anyone is when they are down......The results will do the job when they are up.

PPS It is oh so very easy to rate a manager when he is winning and doubt one when he is losing.....How many clubs did Ron Saunders not do it at?

how difficult did Van Gaal find it.....Pep has had difficulties is he worse than the last manager.....folk are now doubting Wenger.

We need stability, like we have never needed it in our History.

Agreed, but then again we also need to SEE some sort of IMPROVEMENT! 

It's astonishing really, because Bruce started off so well. Granted some of victories were down to sheer individual moments of brilliance by (mostly) Kodija. Then in spite of results, he started changing and chopping, especially in the midfield. Let's assume he was searching for his best eleven. Fine, you do this for a couple of weeks. Then it's settled. It's not really rocket science. Some players are starting players, others impact players, which you bring in if need be. 

No visible change happened. He didn't find his best eleven, nor could he really settle on a formation. More importantly, he was/is unable to come up with a clear-cut game plan, of how you actually win a football match. In some matches he's made astute substitutions, no question about it, but more recently he's just left it all too late. Fact of the matter is we just keep hoofing and clearing up-field, hoping for the best, and all the while inviting more pressure on ourselves. You can always see the nervousness gathering towards the end of games.

Seeing as the January business was quite well planned and executed, I'd have thought he'd secretly developed a system for the new players to slot in right away. They are after all his players, or at least I'm assuming so. Brentford was a shambles. No game plan. Wrong formation. No plan at all. Utterly idiotic to start players that haven't played for 5 weeks. Nottingham wasn't much better. No game plan, yet again more hoofing, and almost no possession.

He's had 4 months. Please tell me, when will we start to see some positive improvement!?

I reiterate, he is still tactically clueless. 

Ps. And don't get me started on the whole ACON thing... recalling Gabby... letting Gestede leave straight away

Edited February 6, 2017 by vreitti

[ender4]

I'm totally shocked, surprised and disappointed at the results.

but i still think Bruce will be decent long-term and get us promoted next season.

Lets see where the next 17 games take us before deciding he's the right/wrong manager for us.

 

 

[ViewFromT2]

Not sure this belongs in this thread but here goes....

Brucey looks like sticking with 3 at the back. So for Saturday, assuming Jedinak is fit (is he?)....this is how I would go:

 

BUNN has to replace Johnstone. In my view this is the biggest call Bruce has to make. I'm sure the lad will go on and have a good career....but right here, right now for Aston Villa, I'm sorry he just isn't good enough. He is making too many mistakes and costing the team goals. His confidence must be very low now. Some say he isn't to blame for every goal, but I don't remember him saving anything....seems that every shot on target is going in at the moment. Bunn is no world beater, but he does makes saves and the older more experienced head might be a more sensible option now.

BJARNASON- If someone could show Steve Bruce the YouTube video of Bjarnason scoring goals for Basel last season, that would be great. He is far more suited to the the right of a midfield than he will ever be on the left. Has been likened...by Bruce himself, to Robbie Savage...and I can see why. Not the best footballer in the world but he will get around that pitch and be a nuisance. Playing him at LWB was just ridiculous.

LANSBURY- Best position clearly is attacking midfield. Playing him anywhere else is crackers, and we may aswell of kept Westwood and tshibola as Lansbury is not a defensive midfielder.

That attacking 3 for me is well balance and full of energy. I'm pretty certain these three were brought in to play together like that. With Jedinak covering....could be terrific given time.

HOGAN - Showed enough on Saturday for me to regard him as our main man now. I wouldn't play Kodija again until he starts improving his work rate and attitude on the pitch. His inability to see passes around the box is frustrating enough, but he is so lacklustre it's untrue...Benteke all over again! He's only scored 10 goals FFS...he struts round like he's just notched his 50th for the season. Look how much ground Hogan covered without the ball...Kodija ain't interested in that side of the game, and we cannot carry players at the moment. Dwight Gayle has 20 goals so far this season...and never stops running. This is the championship...we cannot carry any primadonnas!

 

That's my two pence worth. Elphick has to step up and be this leader we all keep hearing about. I wouldn't mind Richards in there though too, if Chester can keep him organised.

Edited February 6, 2017 by ViewFromT2

[vreitti]

5 minutes ago, ViewFromT2 said:

Not sure this belongs in this thread but here goes....

Brucey looks like sticking with 3 at the back. So for Saturday, assuming Jedinak is fit (is he?)....this is how I would go:

 

BUNN has to replace Johnstone. In my view this is the biggest call Bruce has to make. I'm sure the lad will go on and have a good career....but right here, right now for Aston Villa, I'm sorry he just isn't good enough. He is making too many mistakes and costing the team goals. His confidence must be very low now. Some say he isn't to blame for every goal, but I don't remember him saving anything....seems that every shot on target is going in at the moment. Bunn is no world beater, but he does makes saves and the older more experienced head might be a more sensible option now.

BJARNASON- If someone could show Steve Bruce the YouTube video of Bjarnason scoring goals for Basel last season, that would be great. He is far more suited to the the right of a midfield than he will ever be on the left. Has been likened...by Bruce himself, to Robbie Savage...and I can see why. Not the best footballer in the world but he will get around that pitch and be a nuisance. Playing him at LWB was just ridiculous.

LANSBURY- Best position clearly is attacking midfield. Playing him anywhere else is crackers, and we may aswell of kept Westwood and tshibola as Lansbury is not a defensive midfielder.

That attacking 3 for me is well balance and full of energy. I'm pretty certain these three were brought in to play together like that. With Jedinak covering....could be terrific given time.

HOGAN - Showed enough on Saturday for me to regard him as our main man now. I wouldn't play Kodija again until he starts improving his work rate and attitude on the pitch. His inability to see passes around the box is frustrating enough, but he is so lacklustre it's untrue...Benteke all over again! He's only scored 10 goals FFS...he struts round like he's just notched his 50th for the season. Look how much ground Hogan covered without the ball...Kodija ain't interested in that side of the game, and we cannot carry players at the moment. Dwight Gayle has 20 goals so far this season...and never stops running. This is the championship...we cannot carry any primadonnas!

 

That's my two pence worth. Elphick has to step up and be this leader we all keep hearing about. I wouldn't mind Richards in there though too, if Chester can keep him organised.

Spot on mate. I'm also advocating dropping Kodjia, as he isn't a team player. Sadly don't think Bruce has got the balls to do it.

[PieFacE]

Dropping our top goalscorer is not the answer to our problems. 

[mykeyb]

While I agree that stability is something we do need, it has to go hand in hand with improvement. One without the other is pointless.

Bruce needs to find a system that suits the squad, stick to it and hopefully the results will improve. Get the ball down, play through our midfield and let the strikers find the space to create the goals, just lumping it upfield will not garner the results required I am afraid.

[Dr_Pangloss]

1 minute ago, PieFacE said:

Dropping our top goalscorer is not the answer to our problems. 

He screws up a lot of our counter attacks, it's worth considering IMO. Hogan is the better player and has the better record at this level in terms of goals to games so wouldn't be the worst idea if it gets us playing more direct and countering at a faster tempo (which is what Bruce seems to want). 

[Grasshopper]

2 hours ago, ViewFromT2 said:

I remember being told at the time he was appointed that his remit was to get us into the playoffs or he is out.

I was told he was the only manager that accepted that clause...which is why the move for the David Wagner fell through....remember he was hot favourite initially.  

Is this common knowledge?Who told you that?

not questioning you, I hadnt heard/seen/read that anywhere. (I was in fact on holiday at the time of SB's appointment)

 

[wilko154]

26 minutes ago, ViewFromT2 said:

Not sure this belongs in this thread but here goes....

Brucey looks like sticking with 3 at the back. So for Saturday, assuming Jedinak is fit (is he?)....this is how I would go:

 

BUNN has to replace Johnstone. In my view this is the biggest call Bruce has to make. I'm sure the lad will go on and have a good career....but right here, right now for Aston Villa, I'm sorry he just isn't good enough. He is making too many mistakes and costing the team goals. His confidence must be very low now. Some say he isn't to blame for every goal, but I don't remember him saving anything....seems that every shot on target is going in at the moment. Bunn is no world beater, but he does makes saves and the older more experienced head might be a more sensible option now.

BJARNASON- If someone could show Steve Bruce the YouTube video of Bjarnason scoring goals for Basel last season, that would be great. He is far more suited to the the right of a midfield than he will ever be on the left. Has been likened...by Bruce himself, to Robbie Savage...and I can see why. Not the best footballer in the world but he will get around that pitch and be a nuisance. Playing him at LWB was just ridiculous.

LANSBURY- Best position clearly is attacking midfield. Playing him anywhere else is crackers, and we may aswell of kept Westwood and tshibola as Lansbury is not a defensive midfielder.

That attacking 3 for me is well balance and full of energy. I'm pretty certain these three were brought in to play together like that. With Jedinak covering....could be terrific given time.

HOGAN - Showed enough on Saturday for me to regard him as our main man now. I wouldn't play Kodija again until he starts improving his work rate and attitude on the pitch. His inability to see passes around the box is frustrating enough, but he is so lacklustre it's untrue...Benteke all over again! He's only scored 10 goals FFS...he struts round like he's just notched his 50th for the season. Look how much ground Hogan covered without the ball...Kodija ain't interested in that side of the game, and we cannot carry players at the moment. Dwight Gayle has 20 goals so far this season...and never stops running. This is the championship...we cannot carry any primadonnas!

 

That's my two pence worth. Elphick has to step up and be this leader we all keep hearing about. I wouldn't mind Richards in there though too, if Chester can keep him organised.

With one of the most expensive teams assembled in this league there is no way we should be playing a 3 man back line at home.

Kodjia is our top goalscorer and has to play, he needs to start working on a partnership with Hogan.

 

[Grasshopper]

4 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said:

Adomah played up front. 

And I've no idea who Ann Elk is nor based on that do I want to. 

Python