Next Villa Manager

[TRO]

1 hour ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

The media are tossers. Nothing new.. just the usual 2+7 = 61 formula.

If Bruce arrives here it will certainly raise questions of Dr. Xia from many!.. me included.

So, who is this nailed on manager to take us down the yellow brick road.

to my mind it is all unsubstantiated opinions.

got a hat pin? i'll choose one.

[KHV]

7 minutes ago, GREAT_BEARD_OF_ZEUS said:

Regardless of where he lives, he has a vision and no matter how 'ambitious' that vision, he comes across as someone who sticks to his guns.  That to me points to the fact that it won't be Bruce.

That to me points to the fact he will probably make another mistake

[AvfcRigo82]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

So, who is this nailed on manager to take us down the yellow brick road.

According to 3/4 on here it's Steve Bruce.

[BOF]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

well he is more popular with fans off this site.....don't know why, perhaps they see something different.

I think over the life of any subject being discussed on an internet forum, the middle ground is slowly lost and if you talk (argue) about something for long enough you end up with 2 extremes.  I think with Tactical Timothy this has happened albeit virtually everyone ended up on the same side, against him.  The average man on the street has probably not had the daily heated debates and undoubtedly does have some fond memories of when Tim was on his miraculous run.  The logic seems to be that under an owner who will back him and let him buy his own players then he might do quite well.  I really really disagree with this logic

[TRO]

2 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

Wining things is not our concern at the minute is it. Getting promotion is. In fact just being competitive in this league would be an improvement at the moment. Take it a step at a time. Bruce of all the candidates looks like the outstanding choice for taking the big step back to the top flight as he has 4 promotions from this league on his CV the most recent just last season.

Beyond that then who knows but we can concern ourselves with what happens when we get back to the top flight when we actually get there. Nigel Adkins got Southampton back to back promotions into the top flight and then mid way through the season they sacked him and replaced him with Pochettino. If we have to be ruthless with the man who gets us promoted then so be it but to be looking that far ahead now is getting way ahead of ourselves.

Its that bit of the expectation which is unhelpful.....spot on Mark

It strikes me some folk despite their plea's to the contrary have not come to terms with our demise.

Edited October 4, 2016 by TRO

[Vive_La_Villa]

4 hours ago, dont_do_it_doug. said:

Woosh

Oops.

I blame lack of winky smiley face. 

[allani]

2 minutes ago, KHV said:

The doctor lives in cloud cuckoo land to be perfectly honest. His delusions of granduer need to stop. We will not be the best supported club in th world competing in the champions league anytime soon. He needs to get a grip on reality and get a safe pair of hands in, he needs to realise fairly quickly that we are relegation candidates at present and that this football club has had more managers than wins in the last twelve months!

To be fair - if he markets us well in China and India that is still very achievable.  Juventus became the biggest club in Italy in no small part due to the fact that so many families in Southern Italy had children who moved north to work for Fiat and so "adopted" the club of the Fiat owners.  By a combination of opening academies / buying clubs in these countries and Xia's business empire employing lots of people in these countries - it would be possible for many people to "adopt" us as a club.  However, at best we would probably be people's second team until we start competing for domestic honours and beyond.  But I agree that it definitely won't happen whilst we are 19th in the Championship (or worse)!

[Adbo9]

Steve Cotterill would surprise a few....... decent football man.  Not a great record, but not a bad one either............ Would crack a few skulls in the dressing room....... did a great job at Bristol

I wouldn't be upset with Grayson.  Always managed big clubs for their respective division, mainly league one and done well............ maybe could translate that to Villa and the championship

[Gary Thomas]

Would quite like Wagner if we could convince him to come - something about his Dortmund background, football phiilosphy and work with Huddersfield is making me think he could be a special manager and someone who could take this club forward with the backing of Xia. I know people want safe-hands Bruce but the idea of him just depresses me tbh. I would back him if appointed, but he would just be a temporary sticking plaster and we would hit problems again in a year or two as would have to replace him and rebuild.  Lets face it. The chances of getting promoted this year are slim now as we'd have to win about 60% of our games by my reckoning.  I don't see that happening tbh - not with Bruce or any other manager. So we have a bit of time to build now and to me someone like Wagner, or a good up-and-coming manager, would be ideal - for me anyway.

Edited October 4, 2016 by Gary Thomas

[Grasshopper]

I think the Dr made one mistake thinking we could get a 4-in-1 manager to do everything this club needed.

1 Sort out the squad

2 get us promoted this season

3 get us re-established in the PL

4 go for gold.

I think its clear that 1 has not been 100% achieved, but whoever it was that got rid of so much shite did a great job. My only arguement about the Ins would be that we needed more Ins for GK Defence & Midfield.

2 was going to be made more difficult with stage 1 not 100% completed. RDM proved not to be that man capable of taking the good groundwork to the next stage (even though its difficult). With stages 2 3 & 4 in mind, I think it'll be really hard to find the 3-in1 manager now (although not impossible) so I am warming to a stage by stage, horses for causes approach.

But, the question Dr, Wyness & Round have to answer is.

Is it still possible to get promoted this season?

If so, an appointment the likes of Bruce or Hughton would probably give us a good chance of achieving promotion. (We can worry about the PL once we are there).

If not, then an appointment of an "up-and-coming" manager would allow him to "get our squad" round to his ways and with next seasons pre-season and 2 transfer windows to get it right.

Again we can worry about the PL once we're there, but we'd have a manager with a bit of momentum behind him who may be capable of stage 3 (at least and maybe 4 too).

So depending on how our dreamteam see it, I think/hope they will appoint accordingly.

That said, my 3-in-1 (stages 2 3 & 4) would be.

Howe.

My 2-in-1 (stages 2 & 3)

Dyche

My 1-in-1 (stage 2 - then re-assess)

Bruce, Hughton, Warburton, Rowett & McCarthy.

My "not sure's but to be considered" would be (different reasons - not/Obtainable, unknown quantities......etc)

Hiddink, Mancini, Yakin, Phelan, Wagner...... anyone with recent success, philosyphy, recongnised playing style.....etc.

Over to you Doc.

UTV

VTID

[sharkyvilla]

Yeah I wouldn't necessarily turn my nose up at Cotterill.  Managers I thought would do well have done terribly, so the answer to our problems could lie in the most unlikely of places.

[TRO]

11 minutes ago, BOF said:

I think over the life of any subject being discussed on an internet forum, the middle ground is slowly lost and if you talk (argue) about something for long enough you end up with 2 extremes.  I think with Tactical Timothy this has happened albeit virtually everyone ended up on the same side, against him.  The average man on the street has probably not had the daily heated debates and undoubtedly does have some fond memories of when Tim was on his miraculous run.  The logic seems to be that under an owner who will back him and let him buy his own players then he might do quite well.  I really really disagree with this logic

Personally I have mixed feelings towards Tim.

He had to go when he did, didn't disagree with that.....but I don't subscribe to the argument all was bad about him, it rarely is with any manager. They have to work in an environment that can effect their judgment.....but would I want him back.....No

I think your point is very apt. I also think that those of a stronger personality who find it easier to communicate on a forum, can be influencing factors too. It can be said that a face to face debate can throw up a slightly different conclusion.....and in some cases a more amicable one.

Edited October 4, 2016 by TRO

[Jareth]

1 minute ago, Grasshopper said:

I think the Dr made one mistake thinking we could get a 4-in-1 manager to do everything this club needed.

But, the question Dr, Wyness & Round have to answer is.

Is it still possible to get promoted this season?

I agree, the decision made a lot of sense at the time but sadly backfired. I think promotion this season, unless we are super lucky can only be by the play-offs - which again is why this is a great job for anyone coming in, there may be pressure but they will get over a season and a half at least - unless they are worse than RDM that is!

[GodsBarkeep]

1 hour ago, GREAT_BEARD_OF_ZEUS said:

Not saying you're wrong Hippo, but I would hazard a guess that there's a fair number of examples to suggest that a good no.2 can make a big difference.

Look at Pearson without his team at Derby... look how much Hull improved when Phelan came in to support Bruce.  A lot of people on here who were questioning RDM were (rightly in my opinion) much more comfortable when he brought in Clarke - and I think we're right to have expected more from him.

Brian Clough and Peter Taylor.

That's the second and last time I'll mention cloughie today

[BOF]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

Personally I have mixed feelings towards Tim.

He had to go when he did, didn't disagree with that.....but I don't subscribe to the argument all was bad about him, it rarely is with any manager. They have to work in an environment that can effect their judgment.....but would I want him back.....No

I think your point is very apt. I also think that those of a stronger personality who find it easier to communicate on a forum, can be influencing factors too. It can be said that a face to face debate can throw up a slightly different conclusion.....and in some cases a more amicable one.

I think in the end all was bad about him.  Whether he was backed or whether it was his squad became secondary to what we were hearing about how he treated the players who were not part of his immediate plans (Veretout) and how he went about trying to find a winning formula, by figuratively throwing darts at a dartboard.  A professional manager who knows what he's doing would never resort to such random and indiscriminate formation and personnel changes in order to bring about sustainable change.  The playing staff see this too.  His approach to match day line-ups would not have gone unnoticed to the players who must have been thinking we haven't a hope under this fella, and the performances and results bore that out.  He may have started out well by virtue of not being Paul Lambert, but we got the real Sherwood in the end.  A complete unmitigated disaster of a blagger who should never be put in charge of a football club again.

[cbr600rr]

i would go for bruce, proven manager, winner as a player. 

[rubberman]

23 minutes ago, allani said:

That's a fair response - but if we were currently in the Top 10 (like we were when MON left) and looking to appoint a new manager then I don't think we would see either Howe or Dyche as a coup / statement of intent. Right now either would be a huge coup for us - but it isn't going to happen.  They are both in a "no lose" situation - performing well above expectations at clubs with "low" demands - they are never going to give that up for a risk like Villa.  So I would be astonished if Dr T persuaded either to sign up. 

But my point was more a "massive statement of intent" and I don't think that either are.  They've done a brilliant job at small clubs and taken them into a fantastic position but in my opinion both are bottom half of the Premiership type managers.  Xia has been talking about higher aspirations than that.  So a massive statement of intent would be signing a manager who would be expecting to manage teams competing in Europe.  Given where we are - I can't see that happening.  So I think the best we can hope for is more likely to be to sign a manager to get us back in the Premier League and then sign up our massive statement of intent manager. 

In which case I don't think that Howe or Dyche make much sense as they are neither one nor the other.  Neither would leave a comfortable job for a short term project with huge risk and I don't think that either are the long term MSOI solution either.  If Xia had just stated that his aim was to get us back into the Premier League then they would be amazing appointments and would definitely signal that he was backing up his commitment.  However, he hasn't.  He has said that he wants to take us back to at least where we are 10 years ago (top 6/7 team playing in Europe - or at the time fielding weakened teams in Europe to try and challenge for 4th) and beyond.  I just can't see Howe or Dyche doing that and so that is why amazing appointments as they might be - I don't see either as being a massive statement of intent.

Fair enough - different interpretations of MSOI I guess...  Mine is relative to where we are now, though as you say it would be astonishing if either were to come to us now.  I would definitely see them taking us most of way to where we want to be in 3-5 years.  If we need another manager to get us from Europa League to the Champions League, I'm fine with that!

[allani]

@Grasshopper - I think you have explained (better than I probably did myself) exactly where we are.  However I think that Stage 3 "re-established in the PL" should probably read being in the top 6-8 clubs competing for Europe (I don't think Xia has a plan to just be in the PL - so maybe that should be a fall-back Stage 3b?).  If Stage 4  "going for gold" is aiming for the Top 4 and competing in the Champions League.  I would put Dyche and Howe in Stage 3b (which is why I don't think they are in the running either now or if / when we get promoted).

[HeyAnty]

43 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

"Steve Cotterill to be interviewed for Aston Villa job - Sky sources"

Thank you Sky Sources™ , but who?

Sky Sources they say...  They mean the CEO of SkyBet to fleece money out of punters.

[bobzy]

20 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

Yeah I wouldn't necessarily turn my nose up at Cotterill.  Managers I thought would do well have done terribly, so the answer to our problems could lie in the most unlikely of places.

Nah, no thanks to Cotterill.  Absolutely woeful at Portsmouth and Forest.  Did well at Bristol City but I don't get the feeling he's the most adaptable manager and would absolutely shove that job in the "fluke" category.

Plus he doesn't come across as a particularly likeable bloke.