Pez1974 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 25 minutes ago, Woodytom said: Exactly. My point about how it's odd bernstein n king receive support regards it, yet randy doesn't. Fwiw, I think the email obviously included detrimental content hence why randy blew his lid. But we don't know. What we do know is that after 4 weeks, two board members have bailed and haven't really covered themselves in glory. Now that's not a lot to go on but enough for me to question whether we really want them at the club? Your point is fair, and most people are now anti-Lerner, so pro anyone else. However, the 2 people concerned have been highly successful and are well regarded professionals. Randy has an incredibly poor track record in business (he inherited everything he owns, and has only succeeded in reducing it in value), and has screwed up 2 sporting entities. Yes people are assuming an anti-Lerner position, but he can hardly complain given what we know. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 34 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: FWIW, you're doing what you were doing in the RL thread. Calling Bernstein unprofessional and childish based on what? Your own uninformed opinion? As DCJ said in the RL thread, we have years of mismanagement as evidence against Lerner, what evidence do we have that Bernstein and King were unprofessional? King is a lifelong fan of Villa, I'd trust his judgement over an American who inherited his wealth who hasn't been to a Villa game in years. It's pretty unprofessional to talk behind your bosses back over email. I've never argued that there aren't years of mismanagement from Lerner. What I've argued is that doesn't Warrent abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, Pez1974 said: Yes people are assuming an anti-Lerner position, but he can hardly complain given what we know. All fair points but it seems silly to judge every single situation based on the previous failings of one person (within that situation). IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 8 minutes ago, Woodytom said: It's pretty unprofessional to talk behind your bosses back over email. I'm fairly sure that everybody says things about their boss behind their back at some point. I know I'll talk about work related things to my best mate at work. Sometimes over email. Not always complimentary either. Is everyone who works for somebody unprofessional then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 We are totally screwed.If Lerner is going to keep interfearing ( with his vast football knowledge ) then we are really in the shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raver50032 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 (edited) oops Edited April 21, 2016 by Raver50032 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raver50032 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 (edited) 5 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: I'm fairly sure that everybody says things about their boss behind their back at some point. I know I'll talk about work related things to my best mate at work. Sometimes over email. Not always complimentary either. Is everyone who works for somebody unprofessional then? Given the freedom of information act, depending on where you work and how it might be perceived if it 'gets into the papers,' then yes it is... I'm guilty of it too... I just hope that my boss never has to investigate me and build a case to have me dismissed once my face doesn't fit Edited April 21, 2016 by Raver50032 I am a butterfingers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 6 minutes ago, Woodytom said: It's pretty unprofessional to talk behind your bosses back over email. I've never argued that there aren't years of mismanagement from Lerner. What I've argued is that doesn't Warrent abuse. I have one to ones regularily with personel who I subcontract to. I need assessments, reports on how everything is being done. And I'm pretty sure they all talk amongst themselves about me. It all depends on the tone of respect and honesty one communicates. But more importantly listening to peoples opinions and ideas. I would like to think that I work with very capable people, so why wouldn't I listen or respect their opinions and idea's? If I didn't that would make me a "Bad" boss and probably an unsuccessful one to For example a certain Randy Lerner. Former Cleveland Browns owner and current owner of AVFC 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pez1974 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 8 minutes ago, Woodytom said: All fair points but it seems silly to judge every single situation based on the previous failings of one person (within that situation). IMO. It's the only measure one usually has. Randy (and our club) needed experts to help the club out of it's current position. These experts weren't complimentary to the root cause of the problem so the root cause made them feel their position was untenable. In Randy's position, I would take almost anything to recover the position, repair the club, and my lost millions. He appears to have sided with his own ego over and above the future of the club and his investment. That is a bad businessman IMO. Of course I'm am assuming that the criticisms were professional and not personal, but given all of the facts at my disposal, which of the following scenarios is most likely: Bernstein and King were suggesting that Randy needs to be kept as far away from decision making as possible because he has a terrible track record and doesn't understand the industry. Bernstein and King were photoshopping knobs onto photos of Randy face; calling his children ugly; his girlfriend a gold digger and signing him up to Grinder. Anything in and around the former should be acceptable; anything around the latter not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodytom Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 10 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: I'm fairly sure that everybody says things about their boss behind their back at some point. That doesn't make it professional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just now, Woodytom said: That doesn't make it professional. So you're making claims about 'making the atmosphere more poisonous', that Bernstein and King are unprofessional and childish' based on a (what they probably would have believed to be) private conversation, between 2 very respected business/football men; one of which is a lifelong Villa fan. Your reasoning, they unprofessional for doing what 90% of everybody in work probably does at some point. In addition, you have literally ZERO idea what conditions Lerner is making them work under! None of us do. They might have had a plan and Lerner overruled them. He might have gone back on things he previously said. You have no idea. All of this, to defend the owner that has run the club into the ground culminating in our first relegation in the PL era. I struggle to understand your motivation at the best of times, but this is really strange. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 As Lerner has taken a 'backseat' wouldn't Hollis be their boss anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pez1974 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 7 minutes ago, sexbelowsound said: As Lerner has taken a 'backseat' wouldn't Hollis be their boss anyway? Not sure that is relevant as Randy seems to still have a sort of 'veto' over things, which is appears to have happened in this case (see Bernstein resignation letter saying that things can't be compromised, and King placing the un-tenability of their positions firmly in the owners court). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexbelowsound Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just now, Pez1974 said: Not sure that is relevant as Randy seems to still have a sort of 'veto' over things, which is appears to have happened in this case (see Bernstein resignation letter saying that things can't be compromised, and King placing the un-tenability of their positions firmly in the owners court). So it's as most predicted. Hollis is merely other layer to shield Randolph's terrible decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mykeyb Posted April 21, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted April 21, 2016 I find it very hard to believe that Mervyn King, former head of the Bank of England who must have dealt with some right prize clearings in the woods would be so unprofessional as to put something so derogatory in an email that would cause Laidback Lerner implode. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just now, mykeyb said: I find it very hard to believe that Mervyn King, former head of the Bank of England who must have dealt with some right prize clearings in the woods would be so unprofessional as to put something so derogatory in an email that would cause Laidback Lerner implode. But you DON'T KNOW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 this letter crap sounds like more PR spin from the club to try get the fans onside again. I wont believe it until I see it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pez1974 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 1 minute ago, sexbelowsound said: So it's as most predicted. Hollis is merely other layer to shield Randolph's terrible decisions. That might be overblowing it, but in essence it appears that Randy still has that veto of the big decisions. I'm sure having better management in place to advise will improve decision making, but at the end of the day, having a single shareholder does mean that the whole organisation is effectively at their whim. That person will always be rich, but won't always be smart (it's not about being clever). A smart person takes all advice, isn't insecure and knows their own limitations. Less smart people feel the need to exert control, but often don't know when to let go as they confuse power, control and authority. Guess which one I think Randy is? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amsterdam_Neil_D Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 1 minute ago, mykeyb said: I find it very hard to believe that Mervyn King, former head of the Bank of England who must have dealt with some right prize clearings in the woods would be so unprofessional as to put something so derogatory in an email that would cause Laidback Lerner implode. I think it was something along the lines of the truth. If he just stated the facts as they are then that alone would cause the falling out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pez1974 Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just thought of something else.... If Bernstein and King had been so unprofessional and derogatory towards Randy in an email exchange that would cast them in the wrong if it became public knowledge, would they really have been so naïve to resign using the language they have, and in King's case discuss it publically in the way he has? The club would have the smoking gun to destroy them with. Sorry, this is Randy being, er, Randy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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