tonyh29 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: The vote based on falsehoods and no clear mandate to what leaving the EU actually meant. Also it was over 2 years ago. the vote was a simple In or Out .. regardless of the merits of the wording on the question ... the decision was Out falsehoods and consequences claims were made on both sides the Welsh devolution vote was won by a margin of .6% .. not heard any talk of re-running that one because it was x years ago because some people didn't like the outcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurembergVillan Posted November 15, 2018 Moderator Share Posted November 15, 2018 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 1 minute ago, ml1dch said: Wow, you've not just been ignoring Twitter, you've been ignoring "all news". That's some impressive ostriching. nice try .... surprisingly I was able to buy some food in Waitrose as well , so I'm off for lunch ..Ciao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Just now, tonyh29 said: the vote was a simple In or Out .. regardless of the merits of the wording on the question ... the decision was Out Regardless, it was over 2 years ago and multiple things have happened since, and any individual one of them should be enough to rule the verdict null and void. 1 minute ago, tonyh29 said: falsehoods and consequences claims were made on both sides Only one side is under criminal investigation. 1 minute ago, tonyh29 said: the Welsh devolution vote was won by a margin of .6% .. not heard any talk of re-running that one because it was x years ago because some people didn't like the outcome Your last 7 words show why this is a pointless debate. Thoroughly disingenuous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 The only party openly remain is lib dem - who are doing poorly in the polls I voted remain - and would still like that to happen. But I don't see how it possibly can - you can't keep offering referendums until you get the answer you like - there would have to be massive surge in support for remain, like 70-80% - much as I wish there was - I don't believe there is .... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 6 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Of course, democracy stands still in a vacuum and once we vote for something, we never ever vote again. This viewpoint is so unbelievably shallow and disingenuous. what you want best out of 10 instead ..my bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 7 minutes ago, Genie said: I am a remainer, but I believe that if it went back to a vote with the option of remain there would be utter carnage in the UK. Not quote civil war but ugly, ugly scenes. Plus it was made clear at the time, result wouldn't be reversed. And if something that can get majority support in Parliament is produced, I imagine those requests for another vote would l go away. So... Given this looks dead on arrival, what next? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Just now, tonyh29 said: what you want best out of 10 instead ..my bad Go and get your lunch and let us discuss in good faith. Cheers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted November 15, 2018 VT Supporter Share Posted November 15, 2018 11 minutes ago, Genie said: Certainly? I think that's naïve. Its easy to say we should have had this or that. This is the result of 2 years of negotiating. The Barnier staircase laid out what the EU would offer. The Norway one was the best deal to be had if we had to shift from the golden ribbon bound cushy deal we have. We (she) put us into a corner were this is about the best available, which is still shit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Just now, StefanAVFC said: Go and get your lunch and let us discuss in good faith. Cheers. I think that ship left port a while back. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, Chindie said: The Barnier staircase laid out what the EU would offer. The Norway one was the best deal to be had if we had to shift from the golden ribbon bound cushy deal we have. We (she) put us into a corner were this is about the best available, which is still shit. Yep. We set our own red lines which made even a decent deal impossible. We screwed the pooch singlehandedly here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) I think there should be "ugly, ugly scenes" when we're dragged out of the EU with no deal, something not even floated as a remotely possible option at the time of the referendum, due to a fringe of **** lunatics. The "will of the people" was a smorgasbord of possible avenues of leaving the EU. How many people wanted this? Now that a whole bunch of the possible options just aren't going to happen, namely any form of soft brexit, it seems like the only sane option to put it back to the people. "You wanted to leave in one way or another, this is the only way to do it. Are you sure?". Edited November 15, 2018 by Davkaus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Go and get your lunch and let us discuss in good faith. Cheers. Apologies probably not my finest moment i accept things can be re-run ,I just don’t think the case that it was 2 years ago is a valid one arguably a GE would be where such things get resolved , if we were offered an alternative like labour would remain , tories would leave that would kinda make it easy ... but this decision seems to be splitting parties down the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 31 minutes ago, ml1dch said: That's some impressive ostriching. No, this is impressive ostriching. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 29 minutes ago, hippo said: The only party openly remain is lib dem - who are doing poorly in the polls I voted remain - and would still like that to happen. But I don't see how it possibly can - you can't keep offering referendums until you get the answer you like - there would have to be massive surge in support for remain, like 70-80% - much as I wish there was - I don't believe there is .... This is it. Its the kind of thing Trump would do, and we'd all be ridiculing him for it. Decision made, now we have to make the best of the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 11 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: Apologies probably not my finest moment i accept things can be re-run ,I just don’t think the case that it was 2 years ago is a valid one arguably a GE would be where such things get resolved , if we were offered an alternative like labour would remain , tories would leave that would kinda make it easy ... but this decision seems to be splitting parties down the middle Apology accepted. I’m not even sure where I stand on a people’s vote to be honest. I’m conflicted but leaning towards the longer the shit show drags on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 1 minute ago, Genie said: This is it. Its the kind of thing Trump would do, and we'd all be ridiculing him for it. Decision made, now we have to make the best of the situation. If post ref, the plan was laid out and clearly stated, promises were kept and key leave groups weren’t being investigated for criminal behaviour I’d fully agree. It’s a totally dishonest statement that people are only pushing for a re-run/remain because they didn’t like the outcome. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: If post ref, the plan was laid out and clearly stated, promises were kept and key leave groups weren’t being investigated for criminal behaviour I’d fully agree. It’s a totally dishonest statement that people are only pushing for a re-run/remain because they didn’t like the outcome. I don't think anyone who voted leave is asking for a new vote which leaves just those who lost / don't like the result. What promises were broken? Leave was always going to be a giant step into the unknown, which was clear at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 9 minutes ago, Genie said: I don't think anyone who voted leave is asking for a new vote which leaves just those who lost / don't like the result. Well...apart from the thousands of people that are. https://www.remainernow.com 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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