snowychap Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 18 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I think they are more cynical than that. The government signed off on whatever it needed to to actually move to the next stage. It had no intention of actually implementing it though. It has been 'implemented', i.e. it is the current law. That they are looking to renege on it and rip it up is very different to not implementing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 minute ago, snowychap said: It has been 'implemented', i.e. it is the current law. That they are looking to renege on it and rip it up is very different to not implementing it. I think it’s possible to have a law for something to happen in the future, and then change it before it comes in to effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, bickster said: Did I hear Demonic Raaaaaaaaab saying one of the two major sticking points was state bailouts of businesses? It's almost like they didn't actually understand the contents and implications of the document that they 'negotiated' and touted round the country last year. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Genie said: I think it’s possible to have a law for something to happen in the future, and then change it before it comes in to effect. The particular law is about what is happening now and what is to happen in the future. The European Union Act 2020 is governing what happens now in the transition period as well as what is due to happen in the future once the transition period is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 43 minutes ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said: It's never a good sign when the "Oven ready" wont let you see whats inside until you cook it ? Inside is a steaming Rees-Mogg turd, with a post it note pinned to it with a broken lolly stick. It says "Thanks for letting me avoid tax, mugs. Looking forward to the the cost of living going up, and the NHS being turned into a US corporate cash cow? Toodle pip!" Brexit voters can smear it all over their faces, then blame lefties for the bad smell. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Probably worth stocking up on necessaries for January. A No Deal situation would mean a supply shock which will leave the country short of food and medicine for at least a few weeks. Don't mean to panic anybody, but all the stuff people said about No Deal meaning a lack of essentials on the shelves wasn't wrong, and it hasn't got less true just because we're all talking about other things these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 minute ago, HanoiVillan said: Probably worth stocking up on necessaries for January. A No Deal situation would mean a supply shock which will leave the country short of food and medicine for at least a few weeks. Don't mean to panic anybody, but all the stuff people said about No Deal meaning a lack of essentials on the shelves wasn't wrong, and it hasn't got less true just because we're all talking about other things these days. I’ve still got 642 toilet rolls if anyone wants to set up some swaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I can get everything from Amazon can’t I? According to their tax return they are not based in the UK so I should be able to get everything I need within my prime subscription. Sorted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 This strikes me as very sound analysis: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 36 minutes ago, ml1dch said: This strikes me as very sound analysis: I think Johnson knows what he wants. He believes the U.K. should be free of any interference whatsoever from the EU, I think that is his number one concern. Whether that is is due to some idea of nationalism or a desire to have closer alignment with other trading nations like the US or a combination of reasons. However, for a trade deal to be agreed with the EU the EU has to maintain some control over (at least some parts of) the U.K. The difference I have is I think Johnson and co know this and have known it the whole time. They are not finding out now. Hence I think he is genuinely willing to rip up the withdrawal agreement and proceed with no deal if that is what is required to secure his number one objective. He probably also still thinks there is a chance the EU will fold and make some sort of a concession to maintain more trade, even though it would compromise their market rules, however I think he sees that more of a bonus than an expectation. The biggest question is around the NI/Ireland border. The EU know that if the U.K. goes rogue and walks away (as they are now seemingly threatening to do) then they will have a real problem at the Irish border. If they want to defend the EU market from a UK that will potentially undermine it the EU will need to put up a hard border there which is obviously not an option for them. Presumably Johnson knows this as well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicho Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I think Johnson knows what he wants. He believes the U.K. should be free of any interference whatsoever from the EU, I think that is his number one concern. Whether that is is due to some idea of nationalism or a desire to have closer alignment with other trading nations like the US or a combination of reasons. . I don’t think it is either, he is in a position to make decisions to look after himself and his family, friends, connections, circles of influence. The whole group is in it for no one than themselves. A de regulation of the working environment and the ability to gain from contracts through trade details suits his them. They are already set up for life with generational wealth. Scenarios like this just allow extention of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blandy Posted September 7, 2020 Author Moderator Popular Post Share Posted September 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I think Johnson knows what he wants. He believes the U.K. should be free of any interference whatsoever from the EU, I think that is his number one concern. Whether that is is due to some idea of nationalism or a desire to have closer alignment with other trading nations like the US or a combination of reasons. However, for a trade deal to be agreed with the EU the EU has to maintain some control over (at least some parts of) the U.K. The difference I have is I think Johnson and co know this and have known it the whole time. They are not finding out now. Hence I think he is genuinely willing to rip up the withdrawal agreement and proceed with no deal if that is what is required to secure his number one objective. I strongly differ. He wrote those 2 different versions of his Daily Torygraph In/Out article. He resigned from May's cabinet over her deal with the EU, then later took that same deal, made it slightly worse for the UK, promised to get it through, did an election on it, spent that past however long having people negotiate based around it...and is now apparently reneging on it. Those are not the actions of someone who has clear idea of what he wants, other than to be popular and have an easy life. Where I agree is that I think voices in his ear want no deal and would happily tear it all up. But he doesn't have a clue what he wants, other than it to all be over. This latest thing will be the throbberiest throbbers doing. All the ones who were lying during the Brexit campaign about easy deals, keeping the benefits, not leaving the single market, we hold all the cards, German car makers, what Northern Ireland border problem. The liars, grifters, sharks and weasels. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 11 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I think Johnson knows what he wants. A cake. A shag. A holiday. To be in charge. To be liked. A holiday. Boobies. Money. Fame. A holiday. His father’s approval. A cake. A photo opportunity. A shag. A holiday. Boobies. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 I think the guy is both cunning and ruthless and I hope the EU are not underestimating him in that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enda Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 hour ago, LondonLax said: The biggest question is around the NI/Ireland border. The EU know that if the U.K. goes rogue and walks away (as they are now seemingly threatening to do) then they will have a real problem at the Irish border. If they want to defend the EU market from a UK that will potentially undermine it the EU will need to put up a hard border there which is obviously not an option for them. Presumably Johnson knows this as well. It's absolutely an option. More than an option, it will happen if there's no deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, Enda said: It's absolutely an option. More than an option, it will happen if there's no deal. I think Johnson is just the kind of person who would be willing to exploit that situation. The narrative around the EU breaking the Good Friday agreement would be all too easy to sell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 1 hour ago, chrisp65 said: A cake. A shag. A holiday. To be in charge. To be liked. A holiday. Boobies. Money. Fame. A holiday. His father’s approval. A cake. A photo opportunity. A shag. A holiday. Boobies. Don’t we all? Can’t really blame Boris for these. mmm boobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enda Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 26 minutes ago, LondonLax said: I think Johnson is just the kind of person who would be willing to exploit that situation. The narrative around the EU breaking the Good Friday agreement would be all too easy to sell. Not a chance. Dublin has spent the past four years trying to avoid a border. The NI electorate aren’t fools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, Enda said: Not a chance. Dublin has spent the past four years trying to avoid a border. The NI electorate aren’t fools. There are not many votes in NI the Tories care about. His audience are the voters back on the British mainland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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