Condimentalist Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 I'm not going to quote you again dodgyknees because your posting habits are incredibly irritating for those on phones. As to Cleverley, no he didn't for United because he wasn't used in that role owing to the world class attacking options they have there - he did though for Wigan and Watford when he was given a license to get forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted August 28, 2014 Share Posted August 28, 2014 I'm not going to quote you again dodgyknees because your posting habits are incredibly irritating for those on phones. As to Cleverley, no he didn't for United because he wasn't used in that role owing to the world class attacking options they have there - he did though for Wigan and Watford when he was given a license to get forward. I'm on a phone. He might have done it for Watford or Wigan, how does that make him an AM worth 8m? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I accept that £8m is inclusive of the dreaded 'English premium', but that doesn't reflect on Cleverley as a bad player in himself. I don't know whether he's worth that much, but I don't think United have always played to his strengths. If you're worried about value for money though, take a look at what Saturday's opponents have been spending this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanBalaban Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 I'm not going to quote you again dodgyknees because your posting habits are incredibly irritating for those on phones. As to Cleverley, no he didn't for United because he wasn't used in that role owing to the world class attacking options they have there - he did though for Wigan and Watford when he was given a license to get forward. I'm on a phone. He might have done it for Watford or Wigan, how does that make him an AM worth 8m? If he was worth more than £8m he wouldn't potentially be looking to sign for the Villa would he? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Not sure what your point is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? You were one who were very anti-Cleverley in the England and Man United threads, has your opinion now changed that he is average? Again, genuine question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 For example I made numerous comments about him being average/poor, but am now supposed to rate him? That cannot be right surely? He will get my backing but to change my view bases on us bidding for him is not right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? You were one who were very anti-Cleverley in the England and Man United threads, has your opinion now changed that he is average? Again, genuine question. Just because I don't think he's good enough for England or Man United doesn't mean I don't think he will improve Villa. I think he's also got the potential to be a lot better than he has been for the past year or so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain-from-Texas Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 In 2012-13, when United won the title, Fergie started Cleverly in 18 league matches. He would've started all 38 of United's league matches, but he's crap and not good enough.I think you'll find that he was injured for a large chunk of those 20 games he missed. Again, sarcasm and irony. A kid who started in midfield for about 50% of the champion's league matches is good enough for us. That fact should be self-evident. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? You were one who were very anti-Cleverley in the England and Man United threads, has your opinion now changed that he is average? Again, genuine question. Just because I don't think he's good enough for England or Man United doesn't mean I don't think he will improve Villa. I think he's also got the potential to be a lot better than he has been for the past year or so. Do you still think he's not as good as Delph? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Condimentalist Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? You were one who were very anti-Cleverley in the England and Man United threads, has your opinion now changed that he is average? Again, genuine question. Just because I don't think he's good enough for England or Man United doesn't mean I don't think he will improve Villa. I think he's also got the potential to be a lot better than he has been for the past year or so. Do you still think he's not as good as Delph? Obviously this question is aimed at Mantis and I'll let him answer, but for me Delph would be worth £12-15m in today's market comfortably (allowing the contract issue for minute). I don't think Cleverley is as good as Delph and I don't know whether Cleverley is really worth £8m - especially with only a year on his contract - but Delph is certainly a better player for me. We wouldn't have been saying that two seasons ago mind, quite the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Average player but good enough for us. Will make a difference for us but not what I was hoping for. No way do I think we are actually spending £8m on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 The first signing in a while where I have felt that there is no potential to get our money back or more for him than we paid in the future That might not necessarily be a bad thing. What's to say he won't make a name for himself here and be with us for the next 5+ years? You were one who were very anti-Cleverley in the England and Man United threads, has your opinion now changed that he is average? Again, genuine question. Just because I don't think he's good enough for England or Man United doesn't mean I don't think he will improve Villa. I think he's also got the potential to be a lot better than he has been for the past year or so. Do you still think he's not as good as Delph? I rate Delph higher yes but who knows what Cleverley could do here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Will surprise a few. Most are following the media bandwagon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvillafan Posted August 29, 2014 VT Supporter Share Posted August 29, 2014 Not sure what to make of this one. - means KEA is almost certainly out the door - Westwood out of favour too? - Another central midfielder? We need wide options - Is he worth taking up 80% of our supposed transfer kitty? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan_007 Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Not sure what to make of this one. - means KEA is almost certainly out the door - Westwood out of favour too? - Another central midfielder? We need wide options - Is he worth taking up 80% of our supposed transfer kitty? Well if we have signed Sanchez and cissoko for around 4mill each then our budget would seem to be almost up. If we sign cleverly for 8mill that would indicate a fresh injection from Lerner? Which is a positive I guess. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodigan Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 certainly one out of left field for me, but in the overall context of where we are, I have to say, it looks like we have assembled a fairly nice looking squad... In my mind there is no doubt we are a wiser and tougher proposition to play against now and will continue to be for the remainder of the season, even with injuries.... cleverley will in my mind add to that ethos... say we have a first choice midfield three of delph, westwood and sanchez as the engine room, as opposed to the creative players.... beyond that where do we go? KEA and then? bacuna? herd? cleverley has just turned 25, is playing for Manchester united (and still starting), has 13 England caps and can be ours for 18m. he comes with the mentality of one of the big clubs, but with a shit load to prove... I fail to see how he doesn't add value to our squad and I also believe that we are truly thin on the ground in the area that he will come in to. I also believe that he is low risk - I have no doubt about his ability to perform at the same level that he does for man u with us in the premier league, and I also believe that we are deluding ourselves if we think that is not good enough for villa as we stand today.... for me, I just get the sense that PL has started from the back and worked forward.... having said that, he has reinforced of a sort in every area, save for striker, and that on the basis that he is about to get back his two front line strikers shortly.... if we look at our pools of players in the various positions, end of last season to this, i'm feeling good about things... GK - guzan, given compared to guzan, steer RB - hutton, lowton, bacuna compared to bacuna, lowton CB - vlaar, senderos, okore, clark, baker compared to vlaar, baker, clark LB - cissokho, Richardson compared to Bertrand, luna, clark, Bennett MF (engine room) - sanchez, delph, westwood, [cleverley], KEA, herd compared to delph, westwood, KEA, bacuna MF (creative) / wingers - Cole, Richardson, grealish, n'zogbia, gabby, weimann compared to weimann, gabby, marc, tonev, bowery strikers - gabby, weimann, bent, [bentekkers], [kozak] compared to gabby, weimann, holt with the budget we have, I'm liking this as a squad and I think cleverley fits in there quite nicely.... if true, good to see PL / Keane backing themselves to get the best out of a player whose confidence is currently shot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted August 29, 2014 Share Posted August 29, 2014 Better with the sound off... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLdbMVfLa2E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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