The Careers/Jobs thread

[Kingman]

Due to IR35 I can no longer use my Ltd Co with end client,

Been given options of PAYE or Umbrella via an outfit called "Giant" Anyone have experience with Giant or if PAYE V's Umbrella would be most cost effective over 12 month contract? Cheers 

[V01]

During the phonecall last week while asking about how I did I was told I could get feedback during my dayshifts this week (yesterday and today).  Rumour around the department is that I came 2nd outperforming 2 people who already do the job as sickness/holiday cover. My boss decided to work from home yesterday and was too busy to see me today so has put me off until next week. Fully expecteing to have the same trouble sitting down with her next week.

[Guest av1]

So I start my new job in the 15th of March. Yesterday i spoke to someone at my current employer about the shares that I've purchased, apparently because I've chose to leave the business I forefit the company's contributions to my shares as I've not held them for 3yrs. Apparently you are only classed as a "good leaver" if you've been made redundant or retired. 

I've held them since April 2018, so leaving the business in March rather than April has cost me £4k 

[V01]

I did manage to sit down with my boss last week, I did will in our scenario based questions getting the highest score on one of them. Made a big error on the behavioural questions by only giving one example for each question when the marking scheme required four. My presentation let me down, it didn't cover the marking criteria. I did come second but was a distance away from the successful applicant(4 years experience as an act up/deputy in the role). The two other unsuccessful applicants (12 months and 6 months experience in the role as act up/deputy) scored a lot less than me. I asked what would be open to me going forward that would make me more prepared next time and didn't get a positive response, my boss misconstrued the question to be me asking for one of the other unsuccessful applicants role. I need to ask my Duty Manager for training going forwards but I've done that before and it lasts a few days before they lose interest.

I had positive feedback in that I had demonstrably gone out of my way to gain knowledge of the role and our policies and procedures that you aren't expected to know until you're in the role, but that was followed by some harsh criticism. My reputation is poor.

I always do more than my fair share, bend over backwards to help out covering shifts. Haven't ever had a sick day or been late. Take on additional tasks to cover absences in the department on my own initiative.  None of this is recognised though because I've been known to dick around. 

[cheltenham_villa]

On 04/03/2021 at 14:40, Kingman said:

Due to IR35 I can no longer use my Ltd Co with end client,

Been given options of PAYE or Umbrella via an outfit called "Giant" Anyone have experience with Giant or if PAYE V's Umbrella would be most cost effective over 12 month contract? Cheers 

i worked under an umberella about 8 years ago. It was a good option at the time as it allowed to to be partly tax efficient but without the overhead of establishing a ltd company.

I know a lot of rules have changed in recent years, i was lead to believe their was very limited benefit in an umberella company now, youre basically paye with little opportunity to max benefits.

[Kingman]

13 hours ago, cheltenham_villa said:

i worked under an umberella about 8 years ago. It was a good option at the time as it allowed to to be partly tax efficient but without the overhead of establishing a ltd company.

I know a lot of rules have changed in recent years, any now, youre basically paye with little opportunity to max benefits.

Yeah massively changed, On top of the  statutory deductions they also want to load 13.8% Employers NI and 0.5% App levy on to the end candidate meaning you come away with approximately 53% of your day rate. 

[Stevo985]

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

[Genie]

3 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

That’s fair, I think it’s cheeky of them asking you to step up in terms of responsibility and working hours without anything in return.

[stuart_75]

On 04/03/2021 at 14:40, Kingman said:

Due to IR35 I can no longer use my Ltd Co with end client,

Been given options of PAYE or Umbrella via an outfit called "Giant" Anyone have experience with Giant or if PAYE V's Umbrella would be most cost effective over 12 month contract? Cheers 

I had to wind up my Ltd co for this exact same reason. Fortunately the end client made a very good offer to go "permie" so took it. Just finished the liquidation of the Ltd Co.

[lapal_fan]

37 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

If you're going to be sacrificing more time, a higher level, more responsibility - regardless of "opportunity" (which is business for more work, for less gain) - then yea - I'd be irritated, but that's the culture we're in now - the seniors want more, for less.

Call them words removed but reluctantly accept is probably what I'd do - it's on your CV and you can jump ship soon is how I'd look at it.

**** shitty work bollocks - **** them. 

[Davkaus]

If that's their game, I'd be checking what else is available out there.

Are you so well respected that you declining could realistically get them to change their mind, or are they likely to just find someone else?

[lapal_fan]

So after being interviewed 3 times with lots of different people for a role I mentioned upthread about 6 weeks ago, I called them and said "assuming I haven't got the job, where did I fall down and why haven't I received feedback yet" - turns out the job role has been put on hold for 2 weeks, they're changing the job spec (which tbf the job did change during the 3 interviews, from client based to central based reporting on multiple clients) and will be on hold for another 2 weeks, by which time I'll have an answer.  The feedback on the system was very positive, which has re-energised me and given me new hope.

The wages are (or were!) much more than my current salary, which I'd estimate are about 5-10k below the average for someone doing my job.  My job is strange though, I have responsibility to deliver the contract service, but I have no staff or budget responsibility, which I love because **** MONEY IN THE ASS.

[HanoiVillan]

2 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

Does the role have clearly-defined performance targets? If not, do you think you could agree some?

I think you're entitled to ask for more compensation for more hours and more responsibility. But maybe you could meet them halfway by asking them to review in 6 or 12 months, depending on certain targets being met.

I don't like the situation they are forcing you into. I have taken more hours and more responsibility for no extra pay before, and my 'rocky' relationship with the company became just a bad relationship after that. Every late night I worked, every arsey phone call from the bosses I received, I couldn't get over that I had previously not needed to do anywhere near as much of it, for exactly the same money.

[blandy]

7 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Been offered a promotion ... My director ... wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours...be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

Depends how you look at it. Reading between the lines they either take you for a fool, or they think you’re smart. If you’re smart (you are) then they’d expect you to point out “you want me to do more, take on more responsibility, have a higher grade title, yet you either don’t think me doing more for the company is something you feel is worth funding (we both know you know it is), or alternatively you do accept that the additional responsibility, higher grade, longer hours are areas you accept you need to pay for, and you’re testing me to just to confirm that I am smart enough to recognise what you know to be true and that you will act accordingly and sort out an appropriate increase in line with the higher role and responsibilities”

so I’m saying treat it as a game, rather than an insult. Don’t be annoyed, be smart.

[lapal_fan]

3 minutes ago, blandy said:

Depends how you look at it. Reading between the lines they either take you for a fool, or they think you’re smart. If you’re smart (you are) then they’d expect you to point out “you want me to do more, take on more responsibility, have a higher grade title, yet you either don’t think me doing more for the company is something feel is worth funding (we both know you know it is), or alternatively you do accept that the additional responsibility, higher grade, longer hours are areas you accept you need to pay for, and you’re testing me to just to confirm that I am smart enough to recognise what you know to be true and that you will act accordingly and sort out an appropriate increase in line with the higher role and responsibilities”

so I’m saying treat it as a game, rather than an insult. Don’t be annoyed, be smart.

Honestly, he's not.  Trust me when I say that even @villarule123 is smarter than him, and he wears shorts for a living an actually asked us if we'd seen, and I quote "The Mar-chi-an", or as normal people say - The Martian, starring Matt Damon. 

Sorry, just had to get that out there. 

Tee Hee and all that cock-a-nanny stuff. 

[blandy]

1 minute ago, lapal_fan said:

Honestly, he's not.

My mistake, I do apologise. In that case the advice changes to ask them “if it’s still ok to lick the windows now I’s improtent”

[lapal_fan]

19 minutes ago, blandy said:

My mistake, I do apologise. In that case the advice changes to ask them “if it’s still ok to lick the windows now I’s improtent”

To be honest, I think even that's beyond him.. 

[villarule123]

38 minutes ago, lapal_fan said:

Honestly, he's not.  Trust me when I say that even @villarule123 is smarter than him, and he wears shorts for a living an actually asked us if we'd seen, and I quote "The Mar-chi-an", or as normal people say - The Martian, starring Matt Damon. 

Sorry, just had to get that out there. 

Tee Hee and all that cock-a-nanny stuff. 

It was actually Mart Ian

[Xela]

4 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

Yes, you have a right to be annoyed. No one works for nothing, despite what people say about loving their jobs. 

An increase in grade at our place is usually rewarded with a 20% increase in salary. Unless, you are way over your current grade wage structure. 

How well do you get on with the Director? Can you have a word with him 'off the record' and see what he thinks?

 

[cheltenham_villa]

7 hours ago, Stevo985 said:

Bit of a tricky one for me. Been offered a promotion at work. My director is being moved to work on a new project (which sounds really interesting) and wants me to go with him to be his deputy, essentially. So it'll be an increase in grade, more responsibility, probably longer hours etc.

I basically said I was interested (which I am. Very interested). But have since been told there will be no increase in my salary.

I'm right to be annoyed about that aren't I? 

I'm going to bring it up again and get an official answer. But I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to turn it down because it's a big opportunity and I genuinely want to do the role. But I don't want to be denied something I'm entitled to

 

At a minimum I want them to agree to a pay review in 6 months or something. But I don't want to jeopardise the opportunity by making it sound like I only care about money

i would just be honest. Say you appreciate them considering you and its a job you're could really see yourself doing. Let them know that you are looking for more responsibility but also that you are at a point in your life where you are also looking for some pay progression. Every single person in the world has likely had the same aspiration including all of these people more senior than yourself.

The company can then decide whether that is something you will get now or will at least lay out the future opportunities for you. You can make an informed decision.

In all honesty though, look through this thread and you will see many people saying many times that to really progress your pay, you will very likely need to consider leaving your current company.