pacbuddies Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 In the summer Lambert must do something about Vlaar, Clark and Baker. They are all accidents waiting to happen, I wouldnt mind Robert Huth from Stoke after they get relegated I would rather take upson.. Is he still alive? lol You will have to ask his wife! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Think yesterday was our best performance of the season irrelevant of how bad Stoek are. They had 2 shots on target in whole game. We absolutely bossed them from start to finish. Only negative was we could have won by 5 or 6 and had the chance to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Although he looked poor y'day I'd take Shawcross from Stoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 (edited) People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont. Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ). If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team? "Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV. has to stay. for me he gets the team up and running against the must win relegation teams around us in lambo we trust "He gets the team up and running against the must win relegation teams around us. Excellent stuff and "in lambo we trust" even though our record this season against other teams in the Premiership has left us fighting against the drop. Its actually nice to know now that relegation battles and the abject failure of our present manager has become acceptable. In the summer Lambert must do something about Vlaar, Clark and Baker. They are all accidents waiting to happen, I wouldnt mind Robert Huth from Stoke after they get relegated A MON signing. In lambo we trust - he'll find the missing piece's for that defence, and wont be a player looking for a final pay day. He's already built a defence that most agree is one of the worst we have had at our club yet you expect one more Lambert defensive signing to improve that? I will state again that if Lambert had been managing any other club with his record this season he would have been sacked and rightly so. He has had the fortune to follow one of the worst managers this club has had and has remained in his job because of it. Edited April 7, 2013 by Morpheus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 I will hold my hands up. Over the dire xmas period I did seriously question Lambert and thought maybe he should have gone- esp after the Bradford Incident. The 5-3-2 experiement was a shambles, throwing away leads, and forgetting how to defend corners, all added to the nightmare. However, if we can somehow just stay up this season, perhaps next year might be half decent. We all knew what Lambert was trying to do- create a young team on the cheap whilst still under pressure to cut the wages, but it has been obvious that we have been naive and inexperienced in some matches this year. On the flip side we are playing some lovely stuff going forward, comparing to last year is like chalk and cheese. If we can finish 17th or better, than Lambert should be given the summer to build the squad again. Fatty Dunne, Ireland, Given and Bent will save a huge amount on the wage bill if they can leave. I would just like more of a balance in experience and youth in the transfers this summer, providing Lerner can fund it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Jonno Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont. Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ). If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team? "Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV. Did he have much choice considering the positions that needed filling ? Was it viable with the financial restrictions and wage reduction were going through at the moment to go and find a older player with more experience ? probably not, because they would want more money and if they didnt then Id question their quality. He brought in Westwood, Lowton, Bennet and Benteke who are young. Benteke is our player of the season and Lowton and Westwood have been good enough but both showing promise. Only Bennet can really questioned out of Lamberts "inexperienced" signings. The likes of Delph, Weimann, Bannan, Baker and Clarke were all at the club already and are hardly seasoned pro's. I dont like it when people make out he went crazy on youth when he didnt, but given the circumstances we found ourselves in, and the amount of players we needed to bring in players who perhaps lacked a little experience were likely to come in. Do you see everything so black and white ? It is undoubtedly clear that he is installing a philosophy of football in this club, of progressive football. Football that can push clubs on and ultimately be succesfull. We have gone from god awful football, that never wins you games to developing a style of play, which in time and with better players will put us in fantastic stead to push on. Thats progression. Anyone who thought we wouldnt be involved in a relegation scrap ( admiteddly not this much of one ) was naive. It takes more than a season to sort this pish out. He has made mistakes, I dont deny that but keeping a manager who installs belief and confidence in players like he does, coupled with the way he tries to play football is important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Jonno Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Did i just read "abject failure of the manager". Lol. Id love to know where you think we should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted April 7, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted April 7, 2013 People claim they understand giving a manager time, but they really dont. Nail on the head. A few months is not giving time. I appreciate if the manager is not good enough, its just not working out or if results are truly appalling then you have to call time. But with Lambert he had to deal with a huge amount of issues, coupled with him trying to play football with a team who lack experience, quality in a number of positions and importantly, the Villa players from the previous season had a season of playing completely different football ( if i can call it that ). If we go down, I wont shift the blame to much on Lambert. Certainly mistakes have been made hear and there which have cost us a few points but alot of the points thrown away he cant legislate for, its just our team panicking, put it down to experience put it down to the situation at the time, but I have always understood how were progressing under him and i can recognise where he wants to take us. For that reason, I am more than happy to give him time. 'Trying to play football with a team who lack experience' eh? Who purchased that lack of experience in the first place when there was already inexperience trying to break into the first team? "Progressing under him?" That progression has seen us battling relegation for the best part of the season and breaking records no manager would want on his CV. has to stay. for me he gets the team up and running against the must win relegation teams around us in lambo we trust "He gets the team up and running against the must win relegation teams around us. Excellent stuff and "in lambo we trust" even though our record this season against other teams in the Premiership has left us fighting against the drop. Its actually nice to know now that relegation battles and the abject failure of our present manager has become acceptable. In the summer Lambert must do something about Vlaar, Clark and Baker. They are all accidents waiting to happen, I wouldnt mind Robert Huth from Stoke after they get relegated A MON signing. In lambo we trust - he'll find the missing piece's for that defence, and wont be a player looking for a final pay day. He's already built a defence that most agree is one of the worst we have had at our club yet you expect one more Lambert defensive signing to improve that? I will state again that if Lambert had been managing any other club with his record this season he would have been sacked and rightly so. He has had the fortune to follow one of the worst managers this club has had and has remained in his job because of it. Oh dear, you sound like someone who is clinging to his dogmatic beliefs and is not prepared to admit you might be wrong about Lambert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted April 7, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted April 7, 2013 Morpheus by the way i suggest you look up the meaning of "abject failure" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Must say I failed to see anything "dogmatic" in Morpheus's post. He's stating a case which some will disagree with but which can't just be dismissed by slogans about dogma. This has been a terrible season and the role of the manager is legitimately open to question. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Morpheus by the way i suggest you look up the meaning of "abject failure" Don't know why you're feeding the trolls Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMcKenna Posted April 7, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted April 7, 2013 On reflection I don't why either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutherland Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 (edited) Abject Failure[ˈæbdʒɛkt] adj 1. utterly wretched or hopeless 2. miserable; forlorn; dejected 3. indicating humiliation; submissive an abject apology 4. contemptible; despicable; servile an abject liar [C14 (in the sense: rejected, cast out): from Latin abjectus thrown or cast away, from abjicere, from ab- away + jacere to throw] abjection n abjectly adv abjectness n Spot On Morpheus ! Edited April 7, 2013 by sutherland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 (edited) Must say I failed to see anything "dogmatic" in Morpheus's post. He's stating a case which some will disagree with but which can't just be dismissed by slogans about dogma. This has been a terrible season and the role of the manager is legitimately open to question. exactly - let's remove those claret and blue specs for a moment, who expected us to win, especially once we have conceded our customary goal to lose at the time our winning position? There are some who go overboard on this and other threads mainly to try and bolster their own self inflated ego's but frankly you can ignore them sort of people as they are the real trolls. But getting back to the subject in hand, Lambert's performances as manager of the club this season have at times been woeful and we are certainly not out of the relegation fight just yet, despite what was a great win at the end of the day in Stoke. An objective look back at the season to date will still see a lot of problems, some of them outside of his control but a lot that were down to his actions and for that fans have the right to ask questions and form opinions. As with all things opinions change as time progresses, there is no problem in that. Interesting the dilemma now for some fans re Lambert and the fact that Lerner did not sack him, is that praise for Lerner? But with Lambert, I am still far from convinced that he has the skills or ability to do the job at AVFC. He may well be a good manager within the constraints of a club like Norwich but the expectations and things he had to work with there are different to what we have at AVFC especially considering the framework that Lerner etc has asked him to work within. This has not been a good season to date, far to many negatives for that, Lambert has not done anywhere near enough to warrant the frankly absurd adulation that some like to put on him. A great win yesterday and in the last weeks, and a decent run of form are helping the outlook look a little brighter but final judgement on this season will surely only be valid once we know if we are safe or championship bound. Ultimately lets hope he proves to be a Great manager because that means we are winning stuff and no one cannot enjoy that Edited April 7, 2013 by drat01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwan Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Jesus you guys are a misery bunch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Jonno Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 (edited) No one has said he has done a brilliant job, people just believe he has had shit to put up with and is showing signs, or certainly the performances and the way we play football are showing signs of progression. If you cant see that, I dont know what to think. I think Lambert is a good manager doing a tough job, I wont say he has done brilliantly because he has made mistakes but to be honest I dont think loads of managers could of done much better. Plus with him there is a philosophy in place which can progress us to the next level and the next etc. All very well getting your middle of the road manager in, hoping he does ok and gets us that juicy 14th place finish. Managers like Lambert create a style of play, and if stuck with that progressive football can take you places the likes of most managers cannot. Edited April 7, 2013 by SuperJonno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 4 wins in 7 (3 single goal defeats by 2 champions league teams and a team with best striker in the league) defence has improved since Christmas set-pieces have clearly improved manager looks like fixing the errors from early in the season. trying to play good football... yet people still complaining about some things that have been improved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 4 wins in 7 (3 single goal defeats by 2 champions league teams and a team with best striker in the league) defence has improved since Christmas set-pieces have clearly improved manager looks like fixing the errors from early in the season. trying to play good football... yet people still complaining about some things that have been improved All true. I do think its worth noting though that three of those 4 teams are very much terrible teams. Still better beating them than losing I will say one massive plus we have going for us is we always look likely to score, plenty of threat up front. Thats a very very hard thing to do in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P3te Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 4 wins in 7 (3 single goal defeats by 2 champions league teams and a team with best striker in the league) defence has improved since Christmas set-pieces have clearly improved manager looks like fixing the errors from early in the season. trying to play good football... yet people still complaining about some things that have been improved I can kinda see where some of them are coming from though. Ultimately, if we're in the same position this time next year, Lambert will not have sufficiently progressed us. I don't expect us to be where we are now in 12 months though, I expect us to be comfortably mid-table with our young players growing into a well defined system of football, with an ethos being pushed through the entire club. This is a long term project, and people need to realise that we went for the short term fix under MON, Houllier and, to a lesser extent, McLeish, by throwing money at things, but it's not really sustainable. Lambert very much appears to be going about it the right way, building it from the bottom up, while keeping the budgets in check. That approach has the same glass ceiling as the previous one, but with the additional benefit of being upwardly scalable 4 wins in 7 (3 single goal defeats by 2 champions league teams and a team with best striker in the league) defence has improved since Christmas set-pieces have clearly improved manager looks like fixing the errors from early in the season. trying to play good football... yet people still complaining about some things that have been improved All true. I do think its worth noting though that three of those 4 teams are very much terrible teams. Still better beating them than losing I will say one massive plus we have going for us is we always look likely to score, plenty of threat up front. Thats a very very hard thing to do in this league. And even that in itself took time to come to fruition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 If we are still in trouble next year then obviously Lambert will have to burden the blame but their has been a massive improvement on last season for example. its just people mentioning things that happened months ago to have a go at manager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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