The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[russellleond]

And if we do beat Man City it'll be because it was a) lucky or against a weakened City side

Or because the players chose to ignore AMcL's negative boring tactics and came up with their own.

As ridiculous as this sounds, this sort of reasoning was actually used after the QPR game :shock: .

Man City aren't without their weaknesses. McLeish got a team to beat Arsenal at Wembley, so it's 'doable'

[barry'sboots]

We're about 4 points down on where we should have been in my view - 4 3 0 would look a lot more convincing than 2 5 0 and we really should have been able to turn a couple of those draws into wins.

Not great, but hardly a hanging offence, and capable of being rectified as the season goes on.

A sensible summary.

However, in the vast majority of the draws we have been lucky, IMO, to come away with a point. Outplayed certainly by Everton and QPR for the most part and you could possibly say the same of the Wolves and Newcastle home games. Possibly a fair result against Fulham, although they probably shaded the chances. So we could easily have been 2-0-5 and those two were home games to two teams that should be in the bottom 3-5, although Blackburn may do better given their expenditure post the game with us. I am not sure which games you would have picked out as games we should have converted to wins?

Some would argue that the sign of a good team is winning or drawing when you are not playing well. I can accept this is if we were scraping draws at Old Trafford or Eastlands, or even doing it in the odd games against bottom half teams, but being outperformed in 90% of games and holding on in games against potentially lower table sides doesn't bode well for our prospects.

It is not the results that concern me but the performances. But they are not unexpected IMO.

McLeish is a solid defensive coach but, again IMO, doesn't understand how to build a front 6. His character is frankly uninspiring and dour and he shows little passion from what I can see and his teams reflect this. At least Ged had passion, even if it was, in the most part, for his old club Liverpool. :winkold:

I want my manager to inspire me. To be upbeat and have a little bit of something about him. A spark that says we might not be a top 6 club in terms of revenues or spend but you just never know. I just can't see the club developing under McLeish and I can see the fan base continuing to become disenfranchised.

I want a manager that will take a calculated risk and go out and buy a potentially exciting Clyne from Palace for a £2m rather than spending £4-5 million on Hutton who hasn't made it at Spurs or played regularly for the last few years.

I just want some hope.

[Houlston]

McLeish is a solid defensive coach but, again IMO, doesn't understand how to build a front 6. His character is frankly uninspiring and dour and he shows little passion from what I can see and his teams reflect this. At least Ged had passion, even if it was, in the most part, for his old club Liverpool.

I dont really see how you can argue that the team this season hasnt shown any passion. Its quite clear to see that we have a much stronger, together and passionate unit.

[wiggyrichard]

Alot of people on this thread refuse to see positives when they are clear as day to the open minded and rational.

[Ulver]

Outplayed certainly by Everton and QPR for the most part and you could possibly say the same of the Wolves and Newcastle home games.

Are you having a laugh ?

[romavillan]

Alot of people on this thread refuse to see positives when they are clear as day to the open minded and rational.

ex nose in charge is the problem there for a lot of them

i reckon he's doign a good job so far under the circumstances, the result at city is not gonna change my mind on that, whatever it may be. i reckon we will still be top 8 at least come christmas. hopefully by then a few people will have digested some humble pie.

[roadoftrinity]

We're about 4 points down on where we should have been in my view - 4 3 0 would look a lot more convincing than 2 5 0 and we really should have been able to turn a couple of those draws into wins.

Not great, but hardly a hanging offence, and capable of being rectified as the season goes on.

A sensible summary.

However, in the vast majority of the draws we have been lucky, IMO, to come away with a point. Outplayed certainly by Everton and QPR for the most part and you could possibly say the same of the Wolves and Newcastle home games. Possibly a fair result against Fulham, although they probably shaded the chances. So we could easily have been 2-0-5 and those two were home games to two teams that should be in the bottom 3-5, although Blackburn may do better given their expenditure post the game with us. I am not sure which games you would have picked out as games we should have converted to wins?

Some would argue that the sign of a good team is winning or drawing when you are not playing well. I can accept this is if we were scraping draws at Old Trafford or Eastlands, or even doing it in the odd games against bottom half teams, but being outperformed in 90% of games and holding on in games against potentially lower table sides doesn't bode well for our prospects.

It is not the results that concern me but the performances. But they are not unexpected IMO.

McLeish is a solid defensive coach but, again IMO, doesn't understand how to build a front 6. His character is frankly uninspiring and dour and he shows little passion from what I can see and his teams reflect this. At least Ged had passion, even if it was, in the most part, for his old club Liverpool. :winkold:

I want my manager to inspire me. To be upbeat and have a little bit of something about him. A spark that says we might not be a top 6 club in terms of revenues or spend but you just never know. I just can't see the club developing under McLeish and I can see the fan base continuing to become disenfranchised.

I want a manager that will take a calculated risk and go out and buy a potentially exciting Clyne from Palace for a £2m rather than spending £4-5 million on Hutton who hasn't made it at Spurs or played regularly for the last few years.

I just want some hope.

So many things wrong with that post, for a start, I am pretty sure that you know you are making up the price we paid for Hutton, it was reported to be far less than that by every news outlet, I think the maximum price it was reported to be was £3 million. Also Clyne is injured anyway isn't he?

I don't think you have watched Villa much this season if you think passion is lacking, ability at times yes but not passion. Also, prefering Houlliers passion to McLeish, bizzare to say the least.

[theunderstudy]

Outplayed certainly by Everton and QPR for the most part and you could possibly say the same of the Wolves and Newcastle home games.

Are you having a laugh ?

Everton we were under the cosh but displayed a fighting spirit regardless, resulting in two equalisers.

Newcastle they had better chances, but wouldn't say they were all over us, our lack of productivity with our shots and chances makes it look one way traffic.

We were lucky to get a draw off QPR?! This being the QPR that got a late-injury-time-deflected-freak-own-goal-equaliser when we'd defended stoutly and impressed (second half anyway) throughout?

Wolves no way, we should have won that.

I'm surprised no-ones said we were outplayed by Wigan and Blackburn as well. The only occasion I've been furious or particularly disappointed with our performance was against Bolton.

[KHV]

Outplayed certainly by Everton and QPR for the most part and you could possibly say the same of the Wolves and Newcastle home games.

Are you having a laugh ?

Everton we were under the cosh but displayed a fighting spirit regardless, resulting in two equalisers.

Newcastle they had better chances, but wouldn't say they were all over us, our lack of productivity with our shots and chances makes it look one way traffic.

We were lucky to get a draw off QPR?! This being the QPR that got a late-injury-time-deflected-freak-own-goal-equaliser when we'd defended stoutly and impressed (second half anyway) throughout?

Wolves no way, we should have won that.

I'm surprised no-ones said we were outplayed by Wigan and Blackburn as well. The only occasion I've been furious or particularly disappointed with our performance was against Bolton.

Everton we were extremly lucky against as that game was totally one sided. we only got back into it because of a rare Petrov 30 yarder.

Ncastle had 21 shots on goal and totally outplayed us we did harldly did anything after Bent missed his chance. We were lucky against QPR we only had 1 attempt in the first half and QPR also hit the post and should have had a penalty could have had two. The second half was better than the first but I would not go as far as to say it was impressive stuff!

Without Shay Given we would certainly lost at Fulham and QPR and also at home to Newcastle.

We were better than Wolves at VP but it was hardly convincing stuff and we didnt really create many clear cut chances over the 90 mins.

An overall reflection so far this season would be disappointing football going forwards and lack of creativity.

Defensivley we have been better especially set plays, hopefully he wiwll stick with the diamond formation against Wigan as it means that Nzogbia will not be playing as every time he plays its like we are playing with a man less as he has done nothing.

The Citeh game is a massive test and should be a marker for where we are. If we can get away with only losing by a couple of goals I think we will have done well, I hope we dont end up on the end of a 4 or 5 goal pasting which I think could happen if play like we have done in the majority of games this season

[romavillan]

the marker for where we are is the league table, and it doesn't look too bad. mcleish's first priority was to make us hard to beat.

we are unbeaten.

now comes the task of getting bent/agbonlahor enough chances in a game to net a couple. the second half against qpr showed signs of the front half clicking, the game against wigan was better.

as far as citeh goes, i don't think it is a marker for where we are, it will give us an idea of how we will fare against united and chelsea. but there are far more teams in this league nowhere near that level than near it.

[barry'sboots]

the marker for where we are is the league table, and it doesn't look too bad.

The marker is where you are in the table after you have played the other 19 teams twice. The fixture list has been about as kind as it could have been abnd anybody that denies this is really kidding themselves.

[barry'sboots]

Everton we were extremly lucky against as that game was totally one sided. we only got back into it because of a rare Petrov 30 yarder.

Ncastle had 21 shots on goal and totally outplayed us we did harldly did anything after Bent missed his chance. We were lucky against QPR we only had 1 attempt in the first half and QPR also hit the post and should have had a penalty could have had two. The second half was better than the first but I would not go as far as to say it was impressive stuff!

Without Shay Given we would certainly lost at Fulham and QPR and also at home to Newcastle.

We were better than Wolves at VP but it was hardly convincing stuff and we didnt really create many clear cut chances over the 90 mins.

An overall reflection so far this season would be disappointing football going forwards and lack of creativity.

Defensivley we have been better especially set plays, hopefully he wiwll stick with the diamond formation against Wigan as it means that Nzogbia will not be playing as every time he plays its like we are playing with a man less as he has done nothing.

The Citeh game is a massive test and should be a marker for where we are. If we can get away with only losing by a couple of goals I think we will have done well, I hope we dont end up on the end of a 4 or 5 goal pasting which I think could happen if play like we have done in the majority of games this season

Spot on. At last someone talking without their C&B specs! :winkold:

[barry'sboots]

I don't think you have watched Villa much this season if you think passion is lacking, ability at times yes but not passion. Also, prefering Houlliers passion to McLeish, bizzare to say the least.

I didn't say the team lacked passion did I??

You do know what a :winkold: means??

[Mantis]

Alot of people on this thread refuse to see positives when they are clear as day to the open minded and rational.

ex nose in charge is the problem there for a lot of them

No it's not. I wish the media and people in general would stop saying this. It's got nothing to do with that. It's all to do with his record at SHA and the fact that he has played a lot of boring football in the past.

That said, I don't think there's too much to moan about at the moment. Let's see how things go.

[brommy]

The marker is where you are in the table after you have played the other 19 teams twice.

So why are many VTers 7 months premature? :winkold:

[ozvillafan]

Alot of people on this thread refuse to see positives when they are clear as day to the open minded and rational.

Alot of people on this thread refuse to accept criticism when it's clear as day to the open minded and rational.

[wiggyrichard]

Alot of people on this thread refuse to see positives when they are clear as day to the open minded and rational.

Alot of people on this thread refuse to accept criticism when it's clear as day to the open minded and rational.

But thats the thing, what is there to criticise so far? :?

As far as i can see he has done nothing wrong. I dont buy into the "we play negative football" or the "Bent is getting getting no service".

[NorthEastVillan]

But thats the thing, what is there to criticise so far? :?

As far as i can see he has done nothing wrong. I dont buy into the "we play negative football" or the "Bent is getting getting no service".

I'm sorry but you really cannot argue these two points when it is blatantly obvious that they are both true. Under McLeish we DO play a more conservative style of football and Bent is getting far less service.

Admittedly this may not be solely down to McLeish as it was obvious when selling Young and The Gimp that the service to Bent would suffer and it has. Also the players seem to be taking some time to adjust to Ecks new style of play and some of the attacking players are struggling to adapt and as a result of which we defend too deep and tend to hoof the ball a lot but we will find some middle ground and the players will get in eventually.

I am fully in support of McLeish and think he has done a great job so far under very difficult circumstances but come on let's just call a spade a spade.

[macandally]

Its good to see the pro McLeish clique being self congratulating and dismissing those "who refuse to see positives".

We have played nobody of note, nobody. We have played petty dull football and often have conceded the initiative either from the outset of games, or worse still, like against Wigan and QPR when we retreated into a "one up front hang onto what we have got" formation for the last 15 minutes despite being on top! We have changed formations pretty regularly, a diamond being used against Wigan, so I think we can safely say that after 3 or 4 months in charge, McLeish still doesnt know our best formation.

Throwing 6 attackers onto a pitch does not constitute an attacking formation. Use your players properly and train them with a system and you can take an offensive stance without just throwing anyone who has scored a goal on. This argument seems to be the response of McLeishs staff when pressed on being a defensive unit. In fact this week, they were waxing lyrical on how effective Heskey has been at centre half in training. That made my blood chill, what the hell is he doing there!!

McLeish is what he is, tactically limited, defensive minded and I pray only a stop gap for a maximum of 12 months. You think we will move forward under this guy, I dont think so. I am glad the players like him, but he is not being paid to be popular, he is being paid to develop the football club and achieve success.

[wiggyrichard]

But thats the thing, what is there to criticise so far? :?

As far as i can see he has done nothing wrong. I dont buy into the "we play negative football" or the "Bent is getting getting no service".

I'm sorry but you really cannot argue these two points when it is blatantly obvious that they are both true. Under McLeish we DO play a more conservative style of football and Bent is getting far less service.

Admittedly this may not be solely down to McLeish as it was obvious when selling Young and The Gimp that the service to Bent would suffer and it has. Also the players seem to be taking some time to adjust to Ecks new style of play and some of the attacking players are struggling to adapt and as a result of which we defend too deep and tend to hoof the ball a lot but we will find some middle ground and the players will get in eventually.

I am fully in support of McLeish and think he has done a great job so far under very difficult circumstances but come on let's just call a spade a spade.

Each to their own pal.

I agree we are not playing expansive free-flowing football but we are certainly not being negative.

I agree the service to Bent has decreased as we expected with the sales of Young and Downing, but he is still getting chances every game.