nick76 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 2 hours ago, Mic09 said: So you would rather have the money generated in order to win trophies rather than... winning trophies? I’d rather be at the table with the ability to win trophies consistently than win a trophy every 30 years…..Yes! Added that winning that trophy would be likely at the expense of having to lose key player or two so one step forward and two steps back. Having that money strengthens us to keep key players, add key players and take us another step forward. If we can stabilise at this ‘competing for champions league places’ for a few seasons then I would pick trophy every time then. Our future has to be in the game regularly rather a plucky winner once every thirty years imo. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam2003 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, AVFCDAN said: Maybe i still haven't accepted our new reality under Emery but realistically i cant see us having this good of a season next year. It really is very hard to finish top 4 and Man U and Chelsea aren't going to keep dicking around forever are they. If we don't get Champs league this year it could be years before the opportunity comes again, that's why we cant let it slip. This could be the first step of something great in the coming year's or another missed opportunity before we fall back into the middle of the pack again. I mean I personally think Man U will absolutely keep dicking around forever. Shambles of a club now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 4 minutes ago, nick76 said: I’d rather be at the table with the ability to win trophies consistently than win a trophy every 30 years…..Yes! Added that winning that trophy would be likely at the expense of having to lose key player or two so one step forward and two steps back. Having that money strengthens us to keep key players, add key players and take us another step forward. If we can stabilise at this ‘competing for champions league places’ for a few seasons then I would pick trophy every time then. Our future has to be in the game regularly rather a plucky winner once every thirty years imo. We'll still lose players, even if we qualify for CL or not, there will always be bigger teams. United at their absolute peak in 2009 lost Ronaldo to Madrid, Liverpool lost Coutinho to Barca, Spurs lost Bale and Modric to Madrid, Arsenal lost Henry and Fabregas to Barca. All happened while they played CL football regularly. That won't change if we suddenly get CL for a season or two. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 2 hours ago, duke313 said: What long term success have Spurs had? Hosting a Beyonce concert? A Patriots game? I'd say the majority of their fans would trade all that in and CL football to win a few trophies. Very valid points, I just want us to be consistently competing with the Top 4 places regularly and the revenue that generates than having to sell our best players every season just to comply with FFP/PSR/UEFA rules or those players getting poached by the big 6. As for Spurs fans, yes they would be it’s ok for them because they are already at the big boys table. Ask them if they would give up being at the big boys club and I’m not sure they would be as keen, that they would be equivalent to West Ham, I don’t think they would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 2 minutes ago, duke313 said: We'll still lose players, even if we qualify for CL or not, there will always be bigger teams. United at their absolute peak in 2009 lost Ronaldo to Madrid, Liverpool lost Coutinho to Barca, Spurs lost Bale and Modric to Madrid, Arsenal lost Henry and Fabregas to Barca. All happened while they played CL football regularly. That won't change if we suddenly get CL for a season or two. Of course but to a far greater extent for us. More chance of our players overall stopping with us than pushing for a move, we’ll also have more bargaining power if a big club comes in for one plus we’ll be more attractive for possible replacements. Plus that PSR/FFP/UEFA rules will give us more leeway than having to sell players. We can both see the positive sides of the argument, it’s such a fine line…let’s just get both CL place and a trophy this season, so this argument is put to bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCollins29 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, AVFCDAN said: Maybe i still haven't accepted our new reality under Emery but realistically i cant see us having this good of a season next year. It really is very hard to finish top 4 and Man U and Chelsea aren't going to keep dicking around forever are they. If we don't get Champs league this year it could be years before the opportunity comes again, that's why we cant let it slip. This could be the first step of something great in the coming year's or another missed opportunity before we fall back into the middle of the pack again. Also, liverpool might not be great with a new manager, brighton could fall away further. No one knows. Emery will be looking to improve year on year though - that at least is certain 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keyblade Posted April 17 Popular Post Share Posted April 17 To put it in perspective, if we finish 4th and win the ECL, it'll be better than pretty much any Arsenal season in the past 20 years, and every Man United season post-Fergie bar the season Mourinho did the double. I don't even need to mention Tottenham here. We are in the driving seat for this to happen. I don't think people are quite grasping how special this season can be. Why worry about Dortmund when we can enjoy Villa getting over the line? 9 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pongo Waring Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, AVFCDAN said: Maybe i still haven't accepted our new reality under Emery but realistically i cant see us having this good of a season next year. It really is very hard to finish top 4 and Man U and Chelsea aren't going to keep dicking around forever are they. If we don't get Champs league this year it could be years before the opportunity comes again, that's why we cant let it slip. This could be the first step of something great in the coming year's or another missed opportunity before we fall back into the middle of the pack again. Save your negative energy about next season for the next season thread. This thread is for this season and we're having a bloody great season. Your negativity isn't welcome here. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 5 hours ago, markavfc40 said: I'd take a cup win all day long over qualification for Champions League. My eldest daughter is 26 this year and has had a season ticket since she was 5 and has never seen us win anything. There are thousands of supporters like her. 28 years since we last won a trophy so we haven't won a trophy this century. SHA have won a trophy more recently than us and I have some of them often remind me of that fact. Champions league qualification doesn't guarantee future success. Far from it. A trophy in the cabinet can never be taken away though and will be something we'll talk about until our last breaths. She doesnt remember this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummybloke Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 We really need all English team to win tonight and tomorrow, even if Liverpool and West ham don't go through over all. Ideally all go through no matter how unlikely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 3 minutes ago, brummybloke said: We really need all English team to win tonight and tomorrow, even if Liverpool and West ham don't go through over all. Ideally all go through no matter how unlikely City will go through, and hopefully us, but I can't see Arsenal doing it. Bayern are too experienced at this level, and Arteta too naive. I doubt us and City will be enough, if Bayern, Dortmund and Leverkusen all make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, Adam2003 said: I mean I personally think Man U will absolutely keep dicking around forever. Shambles of a club now. Well their last 5 years PL finishes are 3rd, 2nd, 6th, 3rd, probably 6th. Not too shabby at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ender4 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 36 minutes ago, Keyblade said: To put it in perspective, if we finish 4th and win the ECL, it'll be better than pretty much any Arsenal season in the past 20 years, and every Man United season post-Fergie bar the season Mourinho did the double. I don't even need to mention Tottenham here. That's not actually true is it? Man Utd have won a FA Cup, League Cup, & Europa League all whilst usually finishing in the top 4 in the PL since Fergie. Even excluding the Mourinho double season, they've even been PL runner-ups. Arsenal have won the FA Cup at least 3 times, a couple of second places in PL, runner-ups in European finals, and so on. I'd easily swap history with either of them even if we win the Conference and finish 4th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 3 minutes ago, ender4 said: That's not actually true is it? Man Utd have won a FA Cup, League Cup, & Europa League all whilst usually finishing in the top 4 in the PL since Fergie. Even excluding the Mourinho double season, they've even been PL runner-ups. Arsenal have won the FA Cup at least 3 times, a couple of second places in PL, runner-ups in European finals, and so on. I'd easily swap history with either of them even if we win the Conference and finish 4th. I'm talking about individual seasons? I rate European trophies above domestic ones. Neither Arsenal or United have won a European trophy while finishing in the top 4, since 2014...or 1994 in the case of Arsenal. I mentioned that Mourinho season as a caveat as they won the Europa League and FA Cup but finished 6th. That probably a better season than 4th and ECL. Tottenham haven't won a single trophy since 2008. I think they finished 9th that season. 4th and Conference League would be a monumental season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCDAN Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 53 minutes ago, Pongo Waring said: Save your negative energy about next season for the next season thread. This thread is for this season and we're having a bloody great season. Your negativity isn't welcome here. It’s not negativity it’s called looking at both sides of the equation. I’m absolutely loving this season but it will be a massive disappointment if we don’t get champs league at the end of it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randy_69 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 47 minutes ago, Folski said: She doesnt remember this? Is that Tommy Elphick in the middle?? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 1 hour ago, nick76 said: Very valid points, I just want us to be consistently competing with the Top 4 places regularly and the revenue that generates than having to sell our best players every season just to comply with FFP/PSR/UEFA rules or those players getting poached by the big 6. As for Spurs fans, yes they would be it’s ok for them because they are already at the big boys table. Ask them if they would give up being at the big boys club and I’m not sure they would be as keen, that they would be equivalent to West Ham, I don’t think they would. They might have a seat at the big boys table, but they’re left feeding of their scraps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talldarkandransome Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 53 minutes ago, Folski said: She doesnt remember this? I'm struggling to remember the bloke on the left. Was it Shagger or summat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 This isn't going to be a hugely popular opinion here, but I don't see the Conference League as a "proper" trophy worth derailing our progress for. I'll be delighted if we win it, but for me it's just not on the same level as the FA cup / premier league title / the Champions League as it's a competition that the top teams don't play in. Because of the strength of the PL whatever English team ends up playing there will probably be among the favourites to win it; I imagine we'll see a lot of PL teams winning it in the next few years. I also don't get the logic of anyone saying trophies are all that matter - I mean, if that's what you believe then why not get ourselves relegated so we can win the Championship trophy next season? Clearly the quality of the competition matters too. I wouldn't trade the club going backwards for the Conference League trophy, as there are bigger prizes out there and I think this team and manager have the potential to win one of them if we can keep them together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted April 17 Share Posted April 17 3 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: This isn't going to be a hugely popular opinion here, but I don't see the Conference League as a "proper" trophy worth derailing our progress for. How would it derail the season? We could play the kids on Thursday and still not beat Bournemouth. Or we could go for it on Thursday and beat Bournemouth. There are no guarantees. Our win at Arsenal came off the back of a tough game 3 days earlier. in other games, we've looked less effective after a longer break. You just got to take one game at a time and aim to win every one. IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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